The Ship Model Forum

Hello Oddball, I´m not an admin but I suggest you start your own WIP thread in [url=http://www.shipmodels.info/mws_forum/viewforum.php?f=59]Works in Progress[/url] and ask the admin to move your post there.

Happy building :thumbs_up_1: !

[b]Mod Edit:[/b] Moved to here: http://www.shipmodels.info/mws_forum/viewtopic.php?f=59&t=395154

[quote="tjstoneman"]The WEM instructions for Sussex depict her after the repairs and changes following the bombing and subsequent fire in Glasgow in 1940. One major change was to replace the pole mainmast with a tripod one, stepped further forward (just abaft the catapult) and the after control (superstructure) moved abaft it. Devonshire and Shropshire retained their masts in the same location as when completed, but they were replaced with tripods during the Second World War. Devonshire's "X" turret was landed and replaced by multiple 2pdr mountings during a late war refit; Shropshire retained hers.

As with most warships, particularly major ones, there were many variations in configuration of any particular ship during that war, and so reference to photos is essential for an accurate model.[/quote]

Thank you for your reply!!! I have read a lot indeed about the (whole) class, so I am aware about these differences. As for Sussex, I am trying to copy WEM's kit (I suppose that it is fairly accurate), but for the other two, the references I gathered are sparse... My intention is to built Sussex as close as possible to the WEM kit (I think it is 1942), Shropshire as before delivered to the RAN and Devonshire at any moment between 1941 and 1943. My main "grey point" concerns the shape of the latter's secondary guns deck.


Thanks again!!!!
DK

The WEM instructions for Sussex depict her after the repairs and changes following the bombing and subsequent fire in Glasgow in 1940. One major change was to replace the pole mainmast with a tripod one, stepped further forward (just abaft the catapult) and the after control (superstructure) moved abaft it. Devonshire and Shropshire retained their masts in the same location as when completed, but they were replaced with tripods during the Second World War. Devonshire's "X" turret was landed and replaced by multiple 2pdr mountings during a late war refit; Shropshire retained hers.

As with most warships, particularly major ones, there were many variations in configuration of any particular ship during that war, and so reference to photos is essential for an accurate model.

Greetings to all and best wishes for the coming New Year!!!!

This is my first post here, although I am following the forum for a long time. I recently obtained an interest for the Counties, and have built already six of them (Kent, Berwick, Suffolk Norfolk, Dorsetshire and Australia).

Now I am trying to convert Aoshima's Norfolk to Sussex, as I do have WEM's instructions (but not the kit). As the conversion of the gun deck is rather difficult, my intention is to make resin copies of the (scratch) gun deck and the bridge, in order to make in the future a Shropshire and a Devonshire.

The few photos and profiles I found online, suggest that the three ships were almost identical, with minor differences in their aft superstructure.

So my question is: Were there any differences between the three ships (other than their A/A suite) that worth to be dealt with in 1/700, and if any what were these???
Thank you in advance!!!!

DK

[quote]Kasec: I am building the SS Model London kit. However, I cannot find any photo reference for the ship in 1945. Is there any photo for 1945?[/quote]
There is the film footage from the Eastern Fleet in 1945.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g74ma4vxYDA&t=314s

London can be seen at about 3:13 minutes. Here's a combined screenshot. Of course it's from a video so is not too crisp.
[attachment=1]London colour 1945.png[/attachment]

[quote]On the deck forward of the breakwater beingsteel, is there any photo reference?[/quote]
There is film footage that shows this. Here's a screen shot from the Youtube video linked below.
[attachment=2]Fore-deck WW2.jpg[/attachment]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gJIp7kQ8D0o&t=101s

[quote]Photos in 1946 show a much lower freeboard than the 1943 photos such as this one, which is similar to the model[/quote]
In the Eastern Fleet video, at 2:02 you can see Suffolk. I don't think the freeboard looks any different. London's bulkier superstructure may make it look lower at first, but I don't think it was. I improved that somewhat on my model by adding a waterline plate. What I did wrong though was to do the wood deck as unpainted, whereas apparently it was painted dark grey! Too late! :doh_1:
[attachment=0]London model (2).jpg[/attachment]

I am building the SS Model London kit. However, I cannot find any photo reference for the ship in 1945. Is there any photo for 1945?

[quote="PaulC"]

Also, the freeboard is noticeably lower (though London had overweight issues after reconstruction, so maybe that's not too bad?) and the deck forward of the breakwater is printed as wood planking rather than steel.
, [/quote]

Photos in 1946 show a much lower freeboard than the 1943 photos such as this one, which is similar to the model
[img]https://www.directart.co.uk/bmall/images/mpl1272.jpg[/img]

On the deck forward of the breakwater beingsteel, is there any photo reference?

Thanx, guys; good to know.

The official record lists Dorsetshire without Type 286P 27/7/41 but with it 1/8/41 and without Types 284 & 285 on 1/8/41 but with them 8/8/41. The official record often lagged slightly behind the actual fitting dates.

The image of Dorsetshire at Trincomalee and this poor scan (likely not seen before) suggest that the forward DCT was fitted with 284 antenna ASF at the time of her sinking.

My radar book lists: WC290 by May 1941 (X-frame like the type 286), type 284 listed by June 1944 and 2 x type 285 by November 1941. Now, the type 284 year sounds suspect but I have no images of her to confirm it was fitted when sunk...

What type of radar(s) did DORSETSHIRE have when sunk in April 1942?

The model is 1945. And I just realized it represents her after a 1945 refit in which she got 4 single Bofors 4 mm in addition to a few other AA changes which are depicted in the kit.

That means the 1943-45 disruptive camo scheme is out of the question. Straight G45 with the B20 hull panel is the only one applicable. :doh_1:

But FYI, I understand (from a Britmodeller thread) that it was actually documented that her scheme post-1943 refit was actually G10 (507A 10%) and B55 - two tones only, though photos tend to look like 3, probably due to lighting effects. But there's no documentation of a third.

https://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/235068917-colour-scheme-for-hms-london-~1943/

what time period does the model represent?

Yup I know....World of Warships models.

I actually got the kit by mistake. I had ordered a Bretagne to build as Provence, but the seller joined the reciprocal club and mixed up the last 2 digits of the kit number - Bretagne ends in 26, while London is 62. When I got the package, suprise! London it was. I decided to keep it and the seller agreed. (Who knows when Flyhawk will get around to theirs?!)

I'll have to live with what I can't fix! LoL!

& there is issues with the full hull as most files to do the 3d printed full hulls come from war games not naval drawings.

The one I got is waterline, but they do have a full hull version.

full hull or waterline?

Hi guys,

I recently acquired the SS-model 1/700 London kit. It's in late war fit and beautifully printed - crisp and clean.

However - for those who are sticklers for absolute accuracy - it is off scale, the hull is approximately 1/2 cm or more longer than the Trumpeter and corrected Aoshima kits. Also, the freeboard is noticeably lower (though London had overweight issues after reconstruction, so maybe that's not too bad?) and the deck forward of the breakwater is printed as wood planking rather than steel.

In any case, It will build into a great-looking model.

But question: Does anyone have any ideas as to what colours she wore in her post-1943 refit camo scheme as per the photos below?

[img]https://www.whiteensignmodels.com/uploads/site/products/p_k9y39/img_K757.jpg[/img]

[img]https://uboat.net/media/allies/warships/br/ca_hms_london.jpg[/img]

MS1 is there almost for sure, plus B5, MS4 and MS4A maybe?? (Pure guesswork on my part).

I know 1945 Eastern Fleet is G45 with the B20 hull panel. Easier to do certainly, but I'd like to use the disruptive camo if feasible.

Any help would be much appreciated!

The hulls were similar between the London and Norfolk sub-classes. Both had the armour inside, as opposed to the Kent sub-class.

About the difference in the 8inch armamant you are correct: the visible difference is that later Mk.2 turrets were 2 feet longer than the original ones. That's a little under 1mm on 1:700 scale to be removed. Also their sighting ports (periscopes) were differently arranged.

Another difference I spotted in the drawings that in the Norfolk/Dorsetshire the funnels were moved slightly together, just one frame less spacing between the funnels than the Kent class. So that's another one to be checked, whether the Londons had the Kent arrangement maintained or followed already the closer arrrangement of the Dorsetshire/Norfolk. I have to break out my Sussex plans to do that check.

And for the superstructure: these varied widely amongst the entire County class, and individual modifications were many. So for a project of building HMS London pre-restructuring you could go by any kit and work out all the required modifications. Finding the kit that requires the least mods is already a search in itself.

I do not know how similar the London and Dorsetshire class were. At least the bridges were very different and there were other difference in regard of the superstructure - and also the 8" turrets were of a different model. The hull could be very similar.

The Sussex kit is already a London class kit, featuring e.g. the old bridge structure.