The Ship Model Forum

Thanks for sharing the link to your build log. Interestingly, I learned that the Notoro was serviced by the repair ship Akashi in September 1943. I'm actually building the Akashi at the moment, in a diorama where it is servicing the destroyer Asashio after the Battle of Midway in 1942. I have a build log on MSW:

https://modelshipworld.com/topic/32789-ijn-asashio-and-akashi-by-landlubber-mike-pit-road-with-five-star-and-flyhawk-am-1700-diorama/

Taking a break from my Akashi/Asashio build, I started the Notoro last night. I ended up gluing the hull sides together, and was thinking I needed to support the long seam at the bottom. The YouTube build I linked above had a good idea of placing plastic card inserts inside the hull, but I was thinking of maybe just adding a full plastic card to the outside bottom. Logged on this morning and saw that you took that approach, in part also it sounds like to raise the hull a bit to account for its draft. So, I think I'll borrow from your approach - not to mention, I like really the idea of drilling holes into the hull halves to allow for more glue penetration along the bottom. Fantastic idea!

For the bow deck, I agree with you that it appears to be wood, as represented by Pit Road. Five Star represents it with PE as a metal deck, but that seems to be incorrect. What I will likely do is cut off that section of the kit part, and use it and the Five Star PE part to create another deck, add wood laminate, and then add the various bow deck features (or sand off the details as you have on the kit part which actually is probably much easier now that I think about it). One thing I noticed from the You Tube build is that the forward most bulwarks at the bow are incorrectly positioned inward from the hull lines. From the Notoro pictures, it appears that the bulwarks should follow the line of the hull, so like you and the You Tube build, I will cut those off the kit part and add new bulwarks in the proper position.

I think your diagram of the actual Notoro deck looks very plausible. Thinking on this some more, it seems like it would be a logistical nightmare to try to raise and lower planes onto that middle deck if the deck did not extend all the way to the starboard side of the hull, particularly with the upper decks/platforms extending past the midline of the ship. I originally thought that having the deck level with the edge would be a safety issue for the crew, but looking at pictures of the Kamoi, the decks/platforms appear to extend all the way to the hull edge on both the starboard and port sides - albeit above the level of the bulwarks. Granted, the Kamoi was converted to a seaplane tender in 1932, eight years after the Notoro's conversion, but it sounds like the conversion generally followed the approaches with the Notoro conversion. This website describes the Kamoi as:

"Former tanker. At conversion experience with Notoro was used. Differing from the [Notoro] seaplanes have been better protected from bad weather at the expense of light hinged platforms over upper deck. Seaplanes flied off from water and landed also there and lifted to a deck by cargo booms."

https://www.navypedia.org/ships/japan/jap_aux_kamoi.htm

I also like how you extended the linoleum on the starboard side from the stern to just forward of the bridge. If the middle deck extended all the way to the starboard side, then it seems reasonable that the Japanese would not have put down a wood floor covering the original linoleum deck as that would have been wasteful.

I'll have to think on this some more, but I am leaning towards thinking that you might be correct that the middle deck extended all the way to the starboard side of the hull. I like your cut-outs showing additional sections of the original linoleum deck. For simplicity, I might just model mine similar to the cover picture on the Pit Road box . At least I have some time to make a final decision while preparing the base hull. On the one hand it is a bit frustrating that the available pictures do not give a perfect rendition of the actual ship, but on the other hand, at least it gives a bit of artistic license to come up with a scheme that seems to make sense since nobody can point to pictures to say it was wrong.

Thank you so much for sharing all your thoughts on this interesting ship! I'll be sure to do the same.

Mike,

I built the hull a long time ago so I could draw the etchings to specific dimensions. The progress of the initial work can be seen here:
https://www.modelforum.cz/viewtopic.php?f=175&t=133765

I'm currently finishing up the etchings and expect to be working on Notoro again in about 2 months.

Still on the subject of the deck. I have spent a lot of time over the available photos of Notoro and I think the deck might look something like this.
[attachment=0]Notoro 01.jpg[/attachment]

How close this is to reality given the limited documentation I can't judge.

By the way, I found a build on YouTube yesterday that I thought I'd share with everyone. He also used the Five Star set, and it's a pretty nice build:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZX_VuiOfXrY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=98PnRJ5hZEU

[quote="Milan Kuliffay"]Mike, you can see the deck design in these photos of the "sister ships":

Iro - nice photo from above
[attachment=1]Iro 02 SW522.jpg[/attachment]

Tsurumi - coloured photo
[attachment=0]Tsurumi 05 1935 and Furutaka 01.JPG[/attachment][/quote]

Thanks Milan! I believe these were two of the ships I came across as possible "sister ships" to get an idea of the deck/platform materials. I didn't find these pictures though, thank you! I think they pretty clearly show a wood deck at the bow, and linoleum used midships (before being covered with a wood deck) and at the stern. And a big thank you for starting this topic and sharing all your thoughts, pictures, etc. - really helpful for us fellow modelers!

I'm still early in researching this ship, and have been trying to figure out the starboard side deck issue that you identified. On the one hand, it seems that to most easily load planes onto the ship, the deck should extend all the way to the hull starboard side. On the other hand, it also seems quite dangerous for the crew not to have a bulwark or railings along the starboard side of the ship. Then again, if you look at the Kamoi, the platforms for the planes actually were higher than the bulwarks, and didn't seem to have any protection like railings, etc. for the crew.

To solve both issues, I'm wondering if the Notoro had some kind of maneuverable platforms that they could position as needed along the starboard side of the ship, load the planes directly onto those platforms, then the crew could push/pull the planes back to the middle of the ship onto the wooden deck. Looking at the third picture in your Jan. 3, 2023 post above, it seems like on the port side at least, the center wooden platform did not extend all the way to the port bulwarks. By just having the raised wooden platform in the center of the ship -rather than extending to either or both starboard and port bulwarks - the crew would have the ability to freely move along the length of the ship with the stored planes up and out of the way in the center of the deck on the raised platform.

All that being said, I think it's very tough to determine exactly what is going on with the available pictures that are out there -- except for the few showing the port side of the interior deck, most are too far and grainy. Like any modeling, we just do the best we can do.

So, I guess at this point after a couple of hours of looking at pictures, models, etc., I'm leaning towards how the kit generally presents the model. Aside from using the Five Star bow deck piece -- which shows a metal deck rather than a wooden one -- I'm going to use most, if not all of, the rest of the Five Star set. What I've been thinking of doing is using wooden deck laminates rather than painting the wooden decks. I've have some generic material from I think Artwox and maybe one other manufacturer that I might try out. I'm hoping I can use the Five Star PE as templates to cut the decks to shape. I'm a little less certain on what to do with the upper platforms. They certainly appear to be wood, but with long lines down the length of the platforms. Maybe those were raised pieces of wood or metal so that you end up with channels on the platforms (for rain, stability, etc.)?

Have you started your build yet?

Mike, you can see the deck design in these photos of the "sister ships":

Iro - nice photo from above
[attachment=1]Iro 02 SW522.jpg[/attachment]

Tsurumi - coloured photo
[attachment=0]Tsurumi 05 1935 and Furutaka 01.JPG[/attachment]

[quote="Milan Kuliffay"]I think the correct option is how you described it for the kit.[/quote]

Thank you Milan! Really appreciate your thoughts.

I think the correct option is how you described it for the kit.

I'm wrapping up a few 1/700 builds, and decided that the Notoro would be my next. I have the Pit Road kit along with the FiveStar detail set, and had a question on the various decks/platorms on the ship: (1) bow, (2) stern, and the three middle decks - (3) original bottom deck from when it was an oiler, (4) the deck immediately above it, and then (5) the upper platforms). What's confusing is that the kit and the FiveStar set seem to envision different types of decks being used.

For the kit:

(1) bow - wood
(2) stern - linoleum
(3) original bottom deck from when it was an oiler - linoleum
(4) deck immediately above (3) - wood
(5) upper platforms - wood

For the FiveStar set:

(1) bow - metal
(2) stern - metal
(3) original bottom deck from when it was an oiler - wood
(4) deck immediately above (3) - wood
(5) upper platforms - unclear, could be wood or metal slats

I tried looking at other tankers, but I didn't find any compelling scheme that would apply to the Notoro. I feel pretty comfortable that (4) is wood. Looking at the colorized picture above, however, it seems that (1) and (2) are either wood or linoleum and (5) is likely wood. I understand that the Notoro gradually underwent improvements over the years, so it's quite possible that both Pit Road and FiveStar are correct depending on the year the ship is being modeled. I may just go with the Pit Road scheme and skip the FiveStar parts for (1) - (3).

Any thoughts on what the various decks and platforms should be? Thanks in advance!

Dan, Timmy

Thank you for your responses.
If that platform was folding, it probably wasn't intended for the purpose Timmy describes. It would probably have been parallel to the waterline. But she rather follows the slope of the deck at the front of the ship.
I originally thought it was a hangar side cover which could be used in bad weather. But given that in all available photos it is in that position, not to mention the photos from 1938 when Notoro no longer had a covered hangar and that platform is there, I don't think that's likely.

[attachment=0]1 Notoro 05 1934 E.jpg[/attachment]

Maybe a platform for maintaining seaplanes while they're in the water so the wing tips don't touch the hull sides?

I don't have a clue. I had a thought that it might be a hinged platform, but I couldn't imagine what it would be used for. Some kind of staging platform? Just guessing on all of it.

I have one more question for the IJN boat experts.
Does anyone know what the device - a platform attached to the hull on the port side of the ship - was used for?
It is clearly visible in the photos from 1931, 1934 and 1938.

[attachment=2]1 Notoro 03B D.jpg[/attachment]
[attachment=1]1 Notoro 05 1934 D.jpg[/attachment]
[attachment=0]1 Notoro 14 1938 MS25 D.jpg[/attachment]

Dan thank you very much for the link. :cool_2:
I didn't know about this site and found some very valuable photos there that I hadn't seen before.
And one that also gives an answer to my last question about the height of the wooden deck for seaplanes.
The photo is of Notoro with Hosho, and judging by the figures of the sailors on the starboard side of the ship, it's obvious that it's as I described in my last post.
So this is how I'm going to modify the draft etchings.

Thanks again. :thumbs_up_1:

[attachment=0]1 Notoro 07 A.JPG[/attachment]

See of this link to the KMM for Notoro helps at all. Some pics in that not seen before, particularly after some sort of accident.

http://jmapps.ne.jp/yamatomuseum/list.html?is_pub_mode=1&museum_sub_domain=yamatomuseum&kwd_and_or=and&f9=%E5%86%99%E7%9C%9F&title=%E8%83%BD%E7%99%BB%E5%91%82&f8=&f1=&hlvl=1&bunrui=0&uni_museum=&attach_img=&keywords=&kwd_and_or=and&search_type=keyword&sort_type=asc&page=1&list_type=LLA&btn_list_type=yes&list_count=10&title_query=no&sort_field=&list_count=50

One question again. Wooden deck for seaplanes above the boat deck. The Pit-Road kit W62 / W210, the Five Star Model FS710163 supplemental set, and all the Notoro models I've seen so far have a raised wooden deck only in the middle of the hull, so as to cover the fittings and piping that were originally there when the Notoro served as an oil tanker.
[attachment=9]FS710163 B.jpg[/attachment]

The picture on the model box even has the wooden deck raised the full width of the deck.
[attachment=8]Box Art Pit-RoadW62 B.jpg[/attachment]

But the proof that this was not the case is in some of the photos.
Only the port side of the ship is well documented.
[attachment=7]1 Notoro 11B 1931.JPG[/attachment]
[attachment=6]1 Notoro 12 1931.jpg[/attachment]
[attachment=5]1 Notoro 12B 1931.JPG[/attachment]

However, I am not aware of similarly good shots of the starboard side of the ship.
But if we look at the design of the IJN Wakamiya - the direct predecessor of the Notoro, or the design of the IJN Kamoi, it is clear that the way it is done in the model was not the case in reality. It's hard to imagine how seaplanes would have been handled if the starboard side of the ship didn't have a wooden deck aligned with the side of the hull.
[attachment=4]Wakamiya 01B.JPG[/attachment]
[attachment=3]20 Kamoi 03 1937 B.jpg[/attachment]

In this photo of the Notoro it is well seen that the two seaplanes positioned longitudinally on the deck of the ship are level with the sides of the hull, and by their wings casting a shadow on the side of the hull it is obvious the wings protrude beyond the outline of the ship, so their position relative to the deck must be closer to the starboard side of the ship.
And this would not be possible with a design like the port side of the ship.
[attachment=2]1 Notoro 06 1931 C.jpg[/attachment]
[attachment=1]Notoro CD 01 B.jpg[/attachment]

The only photo I have that gives an idea of how it might have been there is this one.
From it, I conclude that the starboard wooden deck where the seaplanes were loaded/unloaded was raised up to the edge of the hull sides. This is evidenced by the figures of the sailors. In the area at the level of the masts / cranes the deck was apparently lowered as that is where the crane winches were located. Therefore, some sailors are lower in these locations.
Do you think this interpretation of mine is correct?
[attachment=0]1 Notoro 09 B.jpg[/attachment]

Thanks for all the photos...I only had a couple pics of Notoro before this! :thumbs_up_1:

Dan thank you. :thumbs_up_1:

I have the mentioned publication. I drew information from it as well.
The model is nice, cleanly built, but "out of the box only", with no other extras.
I even have the kit from Five Star Model FS710163, which can certainly take the final impression of the model up a few levels.
[attachment=0]FS710163.jpg[/attachment]

However, after studying all the information I already have about the IJN Notoro, I have found that the real-life execution of the ship is a bit different after all. That's why I decided to make my own etchings that are closer to reality.
And that is why I started this thread, to share the information I have about this ship and also I hope that if anyone has more information about the IJN Notoro and is willing to share it, it will help possibly other people interested in this ship.

I don't know ow much help this will be but , FWIW:

The Model Art volume on IJN Auxiliaries (April, 2015, v. #915) has a really nice build of Notoro, converted from the Tsurimi kit. My scanner is inoperative, but here is one example page via photo.

In my last post I apparently gave incorrect information regarding the identification of the ship.
According to the information from http://www.combinedfleet.com, I assumed that the ship in the picture below was the Tsurumi.

However, I came into possession of a 1979 publication, The Maru Special No.25, from which I learned that the conversion of the Notoro to a seaplane carrier was gradual.
[attachment=3]TMS 25 A.jpg[/attachment]
[attachment=2]TMS 25 B.jpg[/attachment]

In 1924 the structure to cover the hangar was only in front of the bridge. The aft section didn't get a similar design until about a year later.
Similarly, the command post was not built on the foremast above the covering structure until 1929 because of the limited view from the original bridge.
[attachment=1]1 Notoro 01 1924.jpg[/attachment]

There is a photo in the publication of the starboard side of the ship, similar to what I have presented here, but from a slightly different angle, which confirms the vertical side walls on the forward part of the hangar structure with transitions to the bow of the ship.
However, the design of the starboard vertical wall is not entirely clear even from this information.
[attachment=0]1 Notoro 06 1931 B II.jpg[/attachment]

So I'll keep looking, although I suspect that the amount of new sources of information is gradually diminishing given the years of service and the categorization of the Notoro.

In addition to the Notoro, the Tsurumi was converted into a seaplane carrier in 1924. I assume the appearance of the two ships was very similar, and the only significant change I have found from these photos is that apparently the Tsurumi did not have a covered station on the foremast above the hangar platform. I have nothing to confirm this, it's just my guess. However, both of these photos still don't give me an answer regarding the design of the front of the hangar platform. But they do point to another detail, which is some sort of structure ( crane ) on the starboard side of the bow.
[attachment=1]1 Notoro 07 B1.jpg[/attachment]
[attachment=0]1 Notoro 08 Tsurumi B1.jpg[/attachment]