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Topic review - Colourcoats Royal Navy WW2 model paints
Author Message
  Post subject:  Re: Colourcoats Royal Navy WW2 model paints  Reply with quote
I think we're about there now with the main colours. There are a few stragglers that possibly nobody will miss for a while at least!

Available individually here:
https://www.sovereignhobbies.co.uk/collections/royal-navy

And we're starting on the boxed sets here:
https://www.sovereignhobbies.co.uk/collections/colourcoats-sea-coloursets/british

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Post Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2018 1:51 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Colourcoats Royal Navy WW2 model paints  Reply with quote
I'll give you a shout Bill. We've got the NARN21 paint put by, and more NARN20 is on the way.

This project has really hammered our company bank account though (i.e. remaking a whole product line without selling the old stock off first) so we need some sales of 14ml for a bit before expending more on new tins. It hopefully won't be too long though :thumbs_up_1:
Post Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2018 1:39 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Colourcoats Royal Navy WW2 model paints  Reply with quote
Any news on NARN20 and NARN21?

Looking for 150 or 200ml as discussed before.

(Oh... and thinners!)

If you PM me when they are available I'll place an order on your website... or you can take an order now, in advance, I'm happy to pay and then wait... again, just PM me.

Thanks James... :thumbs_up_1:
Post Posted: Fri Jun 15, 2018 12:11 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Colourcoats Royal Navy WW2 model paints  Reply with quote
Hi All,

Hi Jamie, thanks for the heads up my order will be in Monday!

Best wishes
Cag.
Post Posted: Fri Jun 15, 2018 11:28 am
  Post subject:  Re: Colourcoats Royal Navy WW2 model paints  Reply with quote
Four more colours will be available this weekend;

NARN34 - 1941-1943 B.6
NARN37 - 1943-1945 B30
NARN38 - 1941-1943 Western Approaches Blue
NARN40 - 1943-1945 B55
Post Posted: Fri Jun 15, 2018 10:42 am
  Post subject:  Re: Colourcoats Royal Navy WW2 model paints  Reply with quote
Bill Livingston wrote:
Thank you James,

I think its the 13% I need for Hood (if I have read everything correctly!).

I presume this is a full matt paint, even at the 13%, or is the 13% NARN20 supposed to be the example with enamel in the mix, hence the greater reflectivity? In which case it really ought to be the 10% by 1941, NARN21... shouldn't it?

But then again, maybe I am overthinking everything... weathering and shading will result in variation on the model, even if less so than on the prototype, (Hood was repainted just before Denmark Strait, so should be reasonably 'clean'... especially on all the vertical surfaces).

Then there is 'scale effect'... which inclines me toward the 13% if fully matt... with heavy weathered 507A/Home Fleet Grey NARN21 (10%??) on decks... not that any of the steel decks will have a pure colour anyway...

Like EJ... I am beginning to realise that the steel decks and the rest of the ship are much the same colour, with the variation on horizontal and vertical surfaces only due to heavy weathering/wear on the decks... and the fact the decks were mixed with more or less a 'paste', making them very rough/non-reflective/prone to holding dirt/grime/wear. So any difference is likely to be the state they were in, not the actual 'colour'.

(If you look at photos of HMS Cornwall (F99) which I'm building at the moment, none of the decks look close to the base colour due to wear/grime/weathering, so I cant see Hood being a great deal different! :smallsmile: )

Anyway... there is a question in there somewhere amongst all the waffle... lets see if I can extract it.

Which should I order? NARN 20 or NARN 21?

(And when will there be some thinners available?)



Hi Bill,

We've made both 13% and 10% versions, NARN20 and 21 respectively to give a degree of freedom. The 3% does make a difference and for what it's worth I'd choose the NARN20 for an overall HFG scheme on a model and NARN21 for part of a camouflage scheme.

The 13% certainly reconciles better with photographs of overall HFG ships pre/early war.

I dare say that with suitable modelling toning (I won't say weathering because that implies rust and dirt) on a model either would look good and convincing. Unlike armour and aircraft modellers most ship modelers tend to paint in flat, solid colours with no attempt to hint at more going on.

We have plenty thinners so you should be good :thumbs_up_1:
Post Posted: Wed Jun 06, 2018 5:08 am
  Post subject:  Re: Colourcoats Royal Navy WW2 model paints  Reply with quote
Royal Navy WW2 paint colours MS1, MS2, MS3, MS4, MS4A and B5 now revised and updated in line with latest primary source research and available now

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1944 to 1945 B20 is also now available.

507A / G10, 507C / G45, Equal Parts 507A / 507C Medium Grey Emergency Mix to follow tonight.

B6, B30, B55 and Western Approaches Blue to follow shortly, and Flotta shades will come in after those.
Post Posted: Wed Jun 06, 2018 5:02 am
  Post subject:  Re: Colourcoats Royal Navy WW2 model paints  Reply with quote
Thank you James,

I think its the 13% I need for Hood (if I have read everything correctly!).

I presume this is a full matt paint, even at the 13%, or is the 13% NARN20 supposed to be the example with enamel in the mix, hence the greater reflectivity? In which case it really ought to be the 10% by 1941, NARN21... shouldn't it?

But then again, maybe I am overthinking everything... weathering and shading will result in variation on the model, even if less so than on the prototype, (Hood was repainted just before Denmark Strait, so should be reasonably 'clean'... especially on all the vertical surfaces).

Then there is 'scale effect'... which inclines me toward the 13% if fully matt... with heavy weathered 507A/Home Fleet Grey NARN21 (10%??) on decks... not that any of the steel decks will have a pure colour anyway...

Like EJ... I am beginning to realise that the steel decks and the rest of the ship are much the same colour, with the variation on horizontal and vertical surfaces only due to heavy weathering/wear on the decks... and the fact the decks were mixed with more or less a 'paste', making them very rough/non-reflective/prone to holding dirt/grime/wear. So any difference is likely to be the state they were in, not the actual 'colour'.

(If you look at photos of HMS Cornwall (F99) which I'm building at the moment, none of the decks look close to the base colour due to wear/grime/weathering, so I cant see Hood being a great deal different! :smallsmile: )

Anyway... there is a question in there somewhere amongst all the waffle... lets see if I can extract it.

Which should I order? NARN 20 or NARN 21?

(And when will there be some thinners available?)
Post Posted: Tue Jun 05, 2018 11:39 am
  Post subject:  Re: Colourcoats Royal Navy WW2 model paints  Reply with quote
I don't think most people realize the amount of work that goes into producing these paints. Just to have continued with what was in place was a job, but to have done the research, made these sorts of changes and then implemented them - the amount of blood, sweat and tears you've invested in this boggles the mind. It's certainly a labor of love.

Colourcoats has been my "go to" paint for ship models for years. Thanks for all your efforts to not only keep the brand in production, but in refining and improving it.
Post Posted: Tue Jun 05, 2018 11:35 am
  Post subject:  Re: Colourcoats Royal Navy WW2 model paints  Reply with quote
Thanks for all your efforts, James! Can't wait for some of your new colors to ooze across the Atlantic.
John
Post Posted: Tue Jun 05, 2018 11:04 am
  Post subject:  Re: Colourcoats Royal Navy WW2 model paints  Reply with quote
HI Bill,

Glad the modern ones arrived safely :)

We've got plenty of NARN21, the 10% RF Home Fleet Grey now with sufficient to divert some to larger containers. The next batch of NARN20, the 13% version, isn't here yet. We've plenty of the 14ml tins of NARN20 but need a fresh bulk size to do bigger containers. We've loads of thinners, both 125ml and 250ml sizes in stock presently :thumbs_up_1:

Amongst yesterday's arrivals were 2.5 litre batches of NARN21 - Home Fleet Grey 507A / G10 at 10% RF and NARN22 - Light Grey / 507C / G45
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I got through a personal best of 8 colours of tin lids in a single evening after day-job last night.
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Tonight I will start tinning. I hope this will prove to have been worth all the effort :heh:
Post Posted: Tue Jun 05, 2018 3:49 am
  Post subject:  Re: Colourcoats Royal Navy WW2 model paints  Reply with quote
Hi James,

How far away are we from being able to buy the new paint for Hood 1941?

... and thinners? I have some really old Colourcoats thinners (certainly 7 or 8 years old) which I'm not sure I should trust...

(BTW... I received the paints for modern RN over the weekend... thanks).
Post Posted: Mon Jun 04, 2018 4:26 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Colourcoats Royal Navy WW2 model paints  Reply with quote
The first of the new paints are here (6 new colours plus some others needed for general restocking) and I am very pleased with them. I am about to start spraying lids and hope to have these on sale during this week.

The new ones include:

507A / G10 at 10% LRV
507C / G45
MS3
MS4
MS4A
B20

plus some more Corticene and what used to be RN02 Medium Grey which is now Equal Parts 507A/507C Emergency Mix
Post Posted: Mon Jun 04, 2018 10:50 am
  Post subject:  Re: Colourcoats Royal Navy WW2 model paints  Reply with quote
mister me wrote:
certainly an already asked question, but...

why don't you develop this range in waterbased acrylics (vallejo- or lifecolor-like for instance) ????


Honestly? I hate water based acrylics. I have hated every single brand I have tried. I could not recommend anyone bought a product we made that behaved like water based acrylics do, and hence it is unlikely I would ever see return on the very large investment necessary to duplicate our range in another formulation. That would mean double the physical space, double the capital tied up on shelves, an investment in new mixing machines and pigments since they are not compatible, double the labour to maintain stock and for a product we just don't believe in.

We do keep experimenting with different binders available, but we have not yet found one I would prefer to use over our enamel formulation. If we ever do find something I could recommend, we may change our position.
Post Posted: Wed May 23, 2018 5:21 am
  Post subject:  Re: Colourcoats Royal Navy WW2 model paints  Reply with quote
certainly an already asked question, but...

why don't you develop this range in waterbased acrylics (vallejo- or lifecolor-like for instance) ????
Post Posted: Wed May 23, 2018 4:50 am
  Post subject:  Re: Colourcoats Royal Navy WW2 model paints  Reply with quote
Any remaining stocks of outgoing paints will remain available with ourselves and the dealer network until stocks run out. We have taken this decision based upon a a volume of enquiries from modellers with part-complete projects to finish, or collections they wish to keep consistent, or should anyone simply decide that they prefer to believe the outgoing colours over the new research.

Thank you to all who have contacted us to express interest and support over the past while. Your encouragement has fuelled our enthusiasm and commitment to this project.
Post Posted: Tue May 22, 2018 4:37 am
  Post subject:  Re: Colourcoats Royal Navy WW2 model paints  Reply with quote
SovereignHobbies wrote:
No, B5 was in use from 1941 to 1943 so it is feasible for 1942.


Phew! Thank you.
Post Posted: Tue May 15, 2018 7:54 am
  Post subject:  Re: Colourcoats Royal Navy WW2 model paints  Reply with quote
PaulC wrote:
SovereignHobbies wrote:
It should only be used as a rough guide, but it should help insomuch as it would be an anachronism to have B&G colours before 1943, and indeed B20 before 1944. We should never see B&G series colours used in conjunction with the paints they replaced i.e. the MS paints.


Uh oh! So Renown's late 1942 scheme that supposedly had B5 along with MS1, MS3 and 507C isn't right? So what were the "B5" areas really? MS2?


No, B5 was in use from 1941 to 1943 so it is feasible for 1942. I haven't really studied Renown otherwise so would not like to comment on whether I agree with the colours, but they are all viable in that time period. :thumbs_up_1:
Post Posted: Tue May 15, 2018 2:39 am
  Post subject:  Re: Colourcoats Royal Navy WW2 model paints  Reply with quote
SovereignHobbies wrote:
It should only be used as a rough guide, but it should help insomuch as it would be an anachronism to have B&G colours before 1943, and indeed B20 before 1944. We should never see B&G series colours used in conjunction with the paints they replaced i.e. the MS paints.


Uh oh! So Renown's late 1942 scheme that supposedly had B5 along with MS1, MS3 and 507C isn't right? So what were the "B5" areas really? MS2?
Post Posted: Mon May 14, 2018 3:16 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Colourcoats Royal Navy WW2 model paints  Reply with quote
:big_grin: :big_grin:

It should only be used as a rough guide, but it should help insomuch as it would be an anachronism to have B&G colours before 1943, and indeed B20 before 1944. We should never see B&G series colours used in conjunction with the paints they replaced i.e. the MS paints.

Deck coatings, and particularly Semtex is more complicated than is shown here - there were at least 3 brands of latex based trowel-on deck coatings of which Semtex was one brand, and each brand was a different colour. I may revise this in due course. Likewise the Flotta colours are somewhat "interpretational".

Still, hopefully this is useful of sorts even if it shows how the camouflage colours look relative to one another. I did this not to try to simply the subject down to one page, but in recognition that most of my customers don't have reams of reference material and struggle to know what to do with all these paints. My experience is that when it's not summarised, some potential customers just follow the kit instructions and paint RN warships Dark Sea Grey, US Haze Gray with some camouflage blotches in Radio Active Snot Green.
Post Posted: Mon May 14, 2018 4:29 am

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