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Topic review - Calling all USS Independence class (CVL) fans
Author Message
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all USS Independence class (CVL) fans  Reply with quote
Hi out there. I am wanting to add the CVL Independence into my FLAT TOP board game by making her an excellent silhouette. Can someone out there please send me a line drawing in high resolution JPEG scan of the light carrier Independence? (The Squadron magazine might have a good line drawing of her; I purchased Squadron's "Carrier Escorts" book recently for this reason.)

I sure will appreciate this.

~ Rod H
Post Posted: Mon Jul 15, 2019 11:18 am
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all USS Independence class (CVL) fans  Reply with quote
DavidP wrote:
Mike, if the parts have not broken off, do you have a heat gun or a hand held hair dryer?


I have neither and both parts are snapped (I tried hot water). Dragon have been contacted.

thanks
Mike
Post Posted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 7:30 am
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all USS Independence class (CVL) fans  Reply with quote
Mike, if the parts have not broken off, do you have a heat gun or a hand held hair dryer?
Post Posted: Sat Jan 19, 2019 12:17 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all USS Independence class (CVL) fans  Reply with quote
Tracy White wrote:
OK, I thought I had copies of the "as launched" CVL-24 in high resolution but I had miss remembered. I do have a "good enough" shot from Rick Davis dated December of 1943. Early 1944 should be the same as the 1/350th CVL-23 Princeton, so you can use the instructions on this review of it as a bit of inspiration (this page). One difference is the small platform midway up the mast that has the searchlights and reproducers (speakers). Belleau Wood had the two reproducers that were on the port side overlooking the flight deck whereas the Princeton kit has a smaller platform with a single reproducer



Thanks for that! That should help. Now I just need to fix the warped parts!

thanks
Mike
Post Posted: Sat Jan 19, 2019 10:38 am
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all USS Independence class (CVL) fans  Reply with quote
OK, I thought I had copies of the "as launched" CVL-24 in high resolution but I had miss remembered. I do have a "good enough" shot from Rick Davis dated December of 1943. Early 1944 should be the same as the 1/350th CVL-23 Princeton, so you can use the instructions on this review of it as a bit of inspiration (this page). One difference is the small platform midway up the mast that has the searchlights and reproducers (speakers). Belleau Wood had the two reproducers that were on the port side overlooking the flight deck whereas the Princeton kit has a smaller platform with a single reproducer
Post Posted: Sat Jan 19, 2019 12:49 am
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all USS Independence class (CVL) fans  Reply with quote
Tracy White wrote:
Independence and Princeton had a different arrangement than the others where one radar was on what looked like a saw horse platform versus a pole mast with a circular platform on the other ships - at least as launched. I'll be able to look over the differences more when I get home and have access to my high-resolution photos.



No problem! Annoyingly the forward hangar sides are badly warped outwards, so don't fit properly. Not sure how to fix that.

thanks
Mike
Post Posted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 5:07 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all USS Independence class (CVL) fans  Reply with quote
Independence and Princeton had a different arrangement than the others where one radar was on what looked like a saw horse platform versus a pole mast with a circular platform on the other ships - at least as launched. I'll be able to look over the differences more when I get home and have access to my high-resolution photos.
Post Posted: Thu Jan 17, 2019 7:32 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all USS Independence class (CVL) fans  Reply with quote
Tracy White wrote:
According to Alan Raven:

Quote:
... there was the introduction of a new flight deck stain for carriers called #21 Flight Deck stain which began to be employed on the ESSEX class as they came into service in 1943. This color when newly applied exactly matched that of 5-0 Ocean Gray. This new stain was also used on the flight decks of INDEPENDENCE class CVLs and CVE classes in 1943 and into 1944. About mid 1944 there was the introduction of #21 Flight Deck stain (revised). This revised stain was (when newly applied) identical to 20B deck Blue (revised) and was a near match in service with the introduction in March 1944 of glossy Sea Blue, a new camouflage color for use on carrier aircraft.


I'm on my laptop and am limited to Navsource's CVL-24 page for now. There was a fairly systemic evolution to the mast that might enable you to use other ships photos to fill in the blanks. In early 1944 she would have had what I call the "Early" mast, which featured only a single yardarm to starboard and an angled/wedge truss structure forward, sort f like a stubby construction crane. This was cut off later and a more squared off appearance left. The earlier mast is shown in this photo of CVL-25 Cowpens (larger black & white copy available here). The later mast with a double yardarm and squared off front (as well as what the covered bridge actually looked like during war time) on the same ship is available here for comparison.


Would it have been pretty much the same a Independence? I have the Classic Warship book on that, so plenty of good pics.

thanks
Mike
Post Posted: Thu Jan 17, 2019 5:43 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all USS Independence class (CVL) fans  Reply with quote
According to Alan Raven:

Quote:
... there was the introduction of a new flight deck stain for carriers called #21 Flight Deck stain which began to be employed on the ESSEX class as they came into service in 1943. This color when newly applied exactly matched that of 5-0 Ocean Gray. This new stain was also used on the flight decks of INDEPENDENCE class CVLs and CVE classes in 1943 and into 1944. About mid 1944 there was the introduction of #21 Flight Deck stain (revised). This revised stain was (when newly applied) identical to 20B deck Blue (revised) and was a near match in service with the introduction in March 1944 of glossy Sea Blue, a new camouflage color for use on carrier aircraft.


I'm on my laptop and am limited to Navsource's CVL-24 page for now. There was a fairly systemic evolution to the mast that might enable you to use other ships photos to fill in the blanks. In early 1944 she would have had what I call the "Early" mast, which featured only a single yardarm to starboard and an angled/wedge truss structure forward, sort f like a stubby construction crane. This was cut off later and a more squared off appearance left. The earlier mast is shown in this photo of CVL-25 Cowpens (larger black & white copy available here). The later mast with a double yardarm and squared off front (as well as what the covered bridge actually looked like during war time) on the same ship is available here for comparison.
Post Posted: Thu Jan 17, 2019 5:02 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all USS Independence class (CVL) fans  Reply with quote
Tracy White wrote:
I only worked with Dragon on their 1/350th kits, so I'm not as familiar with the 1/700 offerings. If you mean this kit the enclosed bridge is wrong and looks more like what was installed during her later French Service (That said, I don't know if it's accurate even for that). Most looks mostly right, so it would mainly be a fairly simple rebuild of the enclosed bridge area - all flat shapes.



Thanks, that makes sense. There's two etch masts, so the next step is to work out which is which! I'm thinking of modelling her in early 44, as I've never modelled a ship in MS14, so I'll have to check out the radar and AA fit, although I suspect the kit is probably accurate enough in that way. Which flight deck stain would she have had in early 44?


thanks
Mike
Post Posted: Thu Jan 17, 2019 4:06 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all USS Independence class (CVL) fans  Reply with quote
I only worked with Dragon on their 1/350th kits, so I'm not as familiar with the 1/700 offerings. If you mean this kit the enclosed bridge is wrong and looks more like what was installed during her later French Service (That said, I don't know if it's accurate even for that). Most looks mostly right, so it would mainly be a fairly simple rebuild of the enclosed bridge area - all flat shapes.
Post Posted: Thu Jan 17, 2019 11:10 am
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all USS Independence class (CVL) fans  Reply with quote
I asked a question a while ago about the 1/700 Dragon kit of USS Belleau Wood and don't recall ever getting an answer. The kit includes an etch Island which is different to the plastic one. Can anyone tell me anything about this? The pics I've seen of the ship during WW2, look more like the plastic kit island.

thanks
Mike
Post Posted: Thu Jan 17, 2019 10:01 am
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all USS Independence class (CVL) fans  Reply with quote
I'd be up for helping regardless of manufacturer. :thumbs_up_1:

Just as long as they work with me instead of "send us all your photos, K.. bye."

One of the things I find interesting with ships is the meshing of the need for hull efficiency with the mission "above the water." The Independence CVLs are an "interesting" design in that you have a beautiful hull form and one of the ugliest structures above the main deck ever to set sail.....
Post Posted: Wed Jan 10, 2018 12:19 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all USS Independence class (CVL) fans  Reply with quote
Slowly this class is growing in my intrest. I do not really like the look, the look so "Ersatz" if you know what I mean. But reading reviews and now knowing that Tracy did the technical consultant work on them makes me want to get one in 350...
I just hope Tracy's phone will ring in the not too distant future and Drangon on the other end wants him to do a new Essex family...:-)

cheers
Uwe
Post Posted: Wed Jan 10, 2018 9:48 am
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all USS Independence class (CVL) fans  Reply with quote
I started a build log here on CVL-23 Princeton: http://www.shipmodels.info/mws_forum/viewtopic.php?f=59&t=166458

Image

Probably I'm going to try the late camo and build her waterlined. I ordered "Carrier Down" and bought the Warship Pictorial, nr. 40, but are there any magazines that feature Princeton instead of the more usual Independence footage?
Post Posted: Mon Jan 01, 2018 1:57 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all USS Independence class (CVL) fans  Reply with quote
OK, new questions for all :

looking on my CVL-24 Drydock plans, both boat platforms are same length. On the other plans , and other ships, the right side one is a lot shorther.
Also, the left one have one mid platform, and ledders from ship platform to this, and another ladders up to catwalk opening

On all photos that I have, CVL-24 have not this mid platform and ladders
On the other side, I have not any photo of her right boat platform

So, questions are :

Time frame is September 1944, before bomb hit and overhaul

Does The Belleau wood have this mid platform and ladders on left side?
Does the right boat platform was shorter or not??

TIA foe any help!!!
Mario
Post Posted: Mon Jan 16, 2017 8:22 am
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all USS Independence class (CVL) fans  Reply with quote
Tracy you are the man, thank you. I would imagine the lower part, cone, is if not solid then very close to it to act like a counter weight.

Keith
Post Posted: Tue Dec 06, 2016 4:10 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all USS Independence class (CVL) fans  Reply with quote
Hinged just under the catwalk with a counterweight. Small section of the catwalk turns with it and is replaced with another section mounted to the antenna side.


Attachments:
CVL.jpg
CVL.jpg [ 18.5 KiB | Viewed 1033 times ]
Post Posted: Tue Dec 06, 2016 11:49 am
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all USS Independence class (CVL) fans  Reply with quote
Four ant. on port side. They look as if they must fold over to clear flight ops. Trying to find photos showing details of the fold mech. where they are hinged into the catwalk.

Any takers on this one ?

Thank you,

Keith
Post Posted: Mon Dec 05, 2016 7:01 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all USS Independence class (CVL) fans  Reply with quote
:big_grin:
Post Posted: Fri Sep 16, 2016 10:10 am

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