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Topic review - Calling all USS Iowa BB-61 class fans
Author Message
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all USS Iowa BB-61 class fans  Reply with quote
Ian Roberts wrote:
Interesting stuff - why was the boot top width different on some of the ships?


There is no reason given in the blueprints. However, one can imagine it was because the IA/NJ were lighter than the MO/WI. The former did not have as much armor and thicker plating was used in many places on the latter.
Post Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2020 4:16 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all USS Iowa BB-61 class fans  Reply with quote
Interesting stuff - why was the boot top width different on some of the ships?
Post Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2020 2:54 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all USS Iowa BB-61 class fans  Reply with quote
DavidP wrote:
what is the standard ww2 boot top width on the Iowa's?


Waterline: 34'9-1/4"

IA/NJ: 17" above WL and 5' 6-1/2" below WL at the bow. 17" above WL and 12-1/2" below at the stern
MO/WI: 34' 9-1/4 below and 38' 2-3/4" above.
Post Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2020 1:27 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all USS Iowa BB-61 class fans  Reply with quote
what is the standard ww2 boot top width on the Iowa's?
Post Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2020 9:30 am
  Post subject:  Re: Missouri/Wisconsin differences  Reply with quote
tigerdvr wrote:
I am building the Joy-Yard 1/350 USS Missouri. I am toying with the idea of converting her to the Wisconsin circa late 1944, early 1945.
Any advise on the differences between these two would be greatly appreciated. I have checked most of the regular references.


There are not any major structural differences. However, you will likely find differences in details such as the position of 20mm guns and radar.

E.g., at the 02 level there is a platform designed for 2x20mm. However, the Wisconsin had three guns wedged in there from the beginning. I don't know if the Missouri did the same.
Post Posted: Mon Sep 21, 2020 3:11 pm
  Post subject:  Missouri/Wisconsin differences  Reply with quote
I am building the Joy-Yard 1/350 USS Missouri. I am toying with the idea of converting her to the Wisconsin circa late 1944, early 1945.
Any advise on the differences between these two would be greatly appreciated. I have checked most of the regular references.

Thanks, Harley
Post Posted: Mon Sep 21, 2020 1:49 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all USS Iowa BB-61 class fans  Reply with quote
JoeP wrote:
frenchc197 wrote:
.
Image


Some accuracy notes (just addressing the add-ons):

1. The ladder openings on the ABLS face inboard on the aft group and forward on the forward group, except that the two forward ABLs on the NJ have openings on both sides.

2. There is a full deck behind the Harpoon shields at the top of the shied.

3. The aft harpoon platform is the narrow version that is correct for early 1980's It was widened to add tracks for ABL reloading.

4. There is a bulwark (rather than railing) at the O1 next to the refueling kingpost.

5. There is no border around the odd shaped decking around turret 3. The non-wood area was a a rubber mat over wood.
Post Posted: Fri Sep 11, 2020 7:14 am
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all USS Iowa BB-61 class fans  Reply with quote
frenchc197 wrote:
Hello everyone,

I'm building Revell's platinum 1/350 USS New Jersey right now, and I'm seeking additional aftermarket parts for elements of the model that even with Revell's upgrades still look shoddy.

In particular, I'm looking for any improved parts on the small rigid hull ships (Seen here) that are lacking upgrades.
Image

Does anyone know the name of these particular vessels to help my search for better pieces?


For the larger boat aft of the refueling tower look up "USN Captain's Gig". Yours will need be hollowed out and an interior fitted, that upper projection removed to be replaced with a windscreen, the windows either cut out and replaced, or painted black to simulate glass, railings added fore and aft, and a prop before the rudder.

I see on Shapeways that "BaconFistModels" produce several 1/350 USN boats if you want an upgrade. I've not bought from them so I cannot speak to their level of detail.

JoeP
Post Posted: Thu Sep 10, 2020 1:32 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all USS Iowa BB-61 class fans  Reply with quote
frenchc197 wrote:
Does anyone know the name of these particular vessels to help my search for better pieces?


On the port side, it's 40-foot utility boat with a 26-foot motor whale boat above.
On the starboard side, it's a 33-foot personnel boat with a 26-foot motor whale boat above.

A variety of boats were used on dollies, including
26-foot personnel boat
28-foot personnel boat
33-foot personnel boat
40-foot personnel boat
40-foot utility boat
Post Posted: Sat Sep 05, 2020 10:21 am
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all USS Iowa BB-61 class fans  Reply with quote
You can find the names of them on the first page of this set of drawings, and then on the overhead view you can find the specific boats with the names attached to where they are: https://www.hnsa.org/wp-content/uploads ... 8/bb62.pdf
Post Posted: Wed Sep 02, 2020 2:11 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all USS Iowa BB-61 class fans  Reply with quote
Hello everyone,

I'm building Revell's platinum 1/350 USS New Jersey right now, and I'm seeking additional aftermarket parts for elements of the model that even with Revell's upgrades still look shoddy.

In particular, I'm looking for any improved parts on the small rigid hull ships (Seen here) that are lacking upgrades.
Image


Does anyone know the name of these particular vessels to help my search for better pieces?
Post Posted: Wed Sep 02, 2020 1:23 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all USS Iowa BB-61 class fans  Reply with quote
This is rendering that shows the three basic ABL configurations on the USS New Jersey. There are actually more variations because the four end extensions for the bases are aligned to the beams under the deck so they do not have the same length.

Attachment:
Tomahawk ABL V2 06.jpg
Tomahawk ABL V2 06.jpg [ 94.65 KiB | Viewed 461 times ]
Post Posted: Wed Aug 26, 2020 11:26 am
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all USS Iowa BB-61 class fans  Reply with quote
Here is what the tower should look like—but never does in kits.
Attachment:
Tower 2.jpg
Tower 2.jpg [ 41.48 KiB | Viewed 534 times ]
Post Posted: Sun Aug 23, 2020 11:21 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all USS Iowa BB-61 class fans  Reply with quote
Here is another error that appears in every Iowa class kit I have seen. This is the forward director tower at the 08 level with the rarely used conn position. I have reproduced the kit error by extruding the stack base shape up to that level.

In reality, it starts to bend inward at the 07 level. The yellow lines show where the structure should cut in. This creates a triangular facet that is visible in photographs. The tower is shown in red. There should be a continuous taper with the red surface; not a step.

Attachment:
Superstructure Error.jpg
Superstructure Error.jpg [ 61.69 KiB | Viewed 595 times ]
Post Posted: Sat Aug 22, 2020 11:18 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all USS Iowa BB-61 class fans  Reply with quote
Yes, the tunnel widens near its front, and there is a docking keel along the midline.

Another often missed subtlety is the real hull has two clear chines, one about 1 strakes below the deck The other just below waterline.
Post Posted: Wed Aug 05, 2020 9:56 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all USS Iowa BB-61 class fans  Reply with quote
I saw a video review of the Blue Ridge 1:350 Missouri. Here is a screen capture from the review showing the stern bottom and above is my computer rendering based off the original blueprints.

Attachment:
Stern.jpg
Stern.jpg [ 61.89 KiB | Viewed 898 times ]

Attachment:
Screen Shot 2020-07-30 at 2.47.46 PM.jpg
Screen Shot 2020-07-30 at 2.47.46 PM.jpg [ 77.11 KiB | Viewed 898 times ]
Post Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2020 11:05 pm
  Post subject:  Armor Over-engineering  Reply with quote
There are a number of places where the engineers went crazy with unnecessary complexity in the Iowa class. Here's one that took me a couple of months to sort out.

The Upper Belt ends at FR166. The Lower Belt plates have a different configuration aft of FR166 than forward. Aft they are 13-inches at the top. Forward they are 12.1". Due to their configuration, the aft plates are thicker than the forward plates at their top and bottom while the forward plates are thicker in the middle.

The plates were welded together using scalloped straps on both sides. It was felt the joint needed to be flattened. This illustration shows what they did. At the top, the aft plate was planed even with the forward plate.

In the middle, both plates were planed down (it would have been simplle to just have planed the forward plate). The edge created on the forward plate was beveled.

At the bottom the aft plate was planed then beveled down to the forward plate.

In the middle area the strap welded over the joint is forward of the bevel. In the bottom area, the strap has to be shimmed.

A) They could have welded the two plates together directly (which would have been stronger than what they did).
B) They could have shimmed the entire joint and skipped all the planing.
C) They could have done a lot less planing to even things out.

Attachment:
Aft Belt V2 02.jpg
Aft Belt V2 02.jpg [ 74.3 KiB | Viewed 952 times ]
Post Posted: Thu Jul 30, 2020 9:46 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all USS Iowa BB-61 class fans  Reply with quote
chuck wrote:
I think the armored transverse bulkheads at the ends of the citadel are made from class B armor. Class A armor is typically used where armor piercing shells have a good chance of striking at a high angle of 60 degrees or more.


They are definitely Class A.

Attachment:
Untitled-1.png
Untitled-1.png [ 26.96 KiB | Viewed 1027 times ]



I climbed down there today for the first time. Different from the plans (and my rendering), the openings are staggered and oval shaped.

Attachment:
P1050827 3D Attachment to Armor.jpg
P1050827 3D Attachment to Armor.jpg [ 245.34 KiB | Viewed 1027 times ]
Post Posted: Tue Jul 28, 2020 7:42 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all USS Iowa BB-61 class fans  Reply with quote
I think the armored transverse bulkheads at the ends of the citadel are made from class B armor. Class A armor is typically used where armor piercing shells have a good chance of striking at a high angle of 60 degrees or more.
Post Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2020 8:51 am
  Post subject:  Third Deck to Transverse Armor  Reply with quote
Because it has been dead here, I thought I'd share some more Iowa class construction details.

One of the myths that appears frequently is that Class A armor was not used structurally. While generally true, it is not totally true. One example is the transverse armor bulkheads.

The outside face of a Class A plate could not be welded because the heat would crack the hardened surface.

This image shows the inside face of the forward transverse armor (looking forward). The vertical lines are grooves for welding the class A plates together. A plate with holes was welded to the inside face. The holes provide additional welding surface. The Third Deck was welded directly to that plate. Unusually for the Iowa class there are no other supports at the attachment point.

The large deck opening is where turret no. 1 goes.

Attachment:
Third Deck 1.jpg
Third Deck 1.jpg [ 67.72 KiB | Viewed 1092 times ]


This shows the forward face of the transverse armor. The seams between the armor plates (angled but close to vertical) have slots in the them Vertical supports were inserted into the slots and a beam was welded between them. The beam supports the third deck.

An L-bar was welded to the the third deck on the upper side that butts up against the armor. The L-bar is not welded to the armor.

Attachment:
Third Deck 2.jpg
Third Deck 2.jpg [ 57.33 KiB | Viewed 1092 times ]


Note that the third deck takes a large step down at the armor. The step is not visible because there are no openings in the armor plate. The Third deck shelf runs outside the citadel on both sides. At its forward end, the shelf joints the third deck flush. As it moves aft, the shelves descend below the third deck.
Post Posted: Sun Jul 26, 2020 9:38 pm

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