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Topic review - Calling all Kirov, Slava & Ushakov class fans
Author Message
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all Kirov, Slava & Ushakov class fans  Reply with quote
To be honest, I doubt that ship will ever see service.
She looks rather shabby at the moment. She looks more or less complete, but the equipment and paint looks in a deplorable state. Not at all new, and that's what you'd want when you "buy" a new ship. Without any sign of maintenance she may already be beyond repair/use. Perhaps they'll just take off whatever they can for spares.
If they would take it after all, it would probably take up a large amount of budget, in a Nakhimov-fashion... for little use.
I'm not sure about that kit. The Ukraina actually has different funnels etc. I have my doubts Trumpeter took that in account.

As for foreign buyers. There's probably nobody interested. The main interest would be the Vulkan anti-ship missile (the Rif was already copied by the Chinese, so no interest in that anymore). And that Vulkan has such a range that it cannot be sold abroad. Refitting her would again cost a lot of money and the general ship structure is outdated by far now, no real stealth features. It would just become a floating missile battery, a very visible one at that. I doubt she'd last long in today's battlefield.
Post Posted: Wed Feb 26, 2014 12:23 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all Kirov, Slava & Ushakov class fans  Reply with quote
With the events currently transpiring in the Ukraine, if the country splits in two, or if the pro-Russian eastern half of the country is absorbed by Russia, does anyone here think that Russia will simply just absorb the cruiser VILNA UKRAINIA into their navy? Or perhaps for the navy of an independent Eastern Ukraine? Or sell the ship on the arms market to a buyer such as India/China?

Last I read, that Slava class cruiser was currently being completed for the Ukrainian Navy with Russian help.

There is even a Trumpeter kit available of the VILNA UKRAINIA in 1/700.
Post Posted: Wed Feb 26, 2014 10:14 am
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all Kirov, Slava & Ushakov class fans  Reply with quote
Hi All,

A quick quote from a February military magazine


By Rear Admiral Viktor Burusk, Deputy Commander Russian Navy:

Burusk said that Russia will continue the repair and overhaul of the “Admiral Nakhimov” – The Kirov class cruiser, previously known as the Kalinin. Nakhimov is due to rejoin the flet in 2018 with the most advanced weapons systems for its vessel type. The Russian Navy will receive 40 new warships and auxiliaries in 2014.

Exciting times for the Russian Navy!
Post Posted: Wed Feb 26, 2014 4:54 am
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all Kirov, Slava & Ushakov class fans  Reply with quote
Hi All,

A long shot I know, but does anyone have a rough idea of what the diameter of the rivets around the superstructure and bridge windows on the Slava would be? :thinking: :thinking:

Andrew
Post Posted: Fri Nov 29, 2013 12:59 am
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all Kirov, Slava & Ushakov class fans  Reply with quote
That must create a big cloud of chaff but I suppose these ships are so big they need it. I didn't see this mystery when I went through the pages but I am glad you have cleared it up. Another mystery (to me) was the round things with spouts that looked like the Russian heavy duty fire extinguisher nozzles and a big red star on them. Eventually i found a reference to them in these invaluable pages and only then discovered they are decoy launchers!

EDIT: Actually, I think these are the same things. I seem to be getting confused all over the place!
Post Posted: Sat Oct 26, 2013 2:46 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all Kirov, Slava & Ushakov class fans  Reply with quote
This would be the picture I was talking about. You can even see a second launch near the deck. It's from the Chaff Launcher system, as it tends to fire two shots at once when firing. Notice how far forward it is, practically next to the RBU launcher on the forecastle, FAR too forward for the SA-N-9, and nothing like its launch profile.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:SA-N- ... ze%29.JPEG
Post Posted: Sat Oct 26, 2013 10:18 am
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all Kirov, Slava & Ushakov class fans  Reply with quote
Ah, I was mixed-up, it was Neptune's photo I was talking about. I haven't seen the one you mean.
I am looking forward to starting my Varyag and I have ordered Pyotr Veliky too!
Post Posted: Sat Oct 26, 2013 2:41 am
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all Kirov, Slava & Ushakov class fans  Reply with quote
The one by Neptune is unmistakably an S-300F/SA-N-6. That I will not dispute. I thought you were referencing the all too common shot of a smoke-blast off the forecastle of Frunze that you can find on, say, Wikipedia, where they claim that it is an SA-N-9. No Kirov has ever had her bow SA-N-9 launchers in place, nor has it had the required Klinok/Cross Swords Fire Control Radar on that position. Similarly, as I said, SA-N-9 is a Cold-Launch like the S-300F - the launcher kicks it a good couple meters in the air, a short-burn motor in the nose kicks the nose down to trajectory, and THEN the main motor kicks in. There's good video footage of the system acting off the side of the Kuznetsov.
Post Posted: Fri Oct 25, 2013 6:22 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all Kirov, Slava & Ushakov class fans  Reply with quote
Hi Sauragnmon, are you referring to the pic on p.33 posted by Neptune or another missile launch?
I might have got mixed up here.
Post Posted: Fri Oct 25, 2013 11:47 am
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all Kirov, Slava & Ushakov class fans  Reply with quote
Unfortunately, John, that's not an SA-N-6 - they're a fairly long missile, to begin, and there are videos of the SA-N-6 launch, specifically off one of the Kirov decks. The missile is, like the SA-N-6, a cold-launch missile, and again, the placement of the missile's point of launch is even further on the scale of "Too Far Forward" for a SA-N-6 launch. SA-N-9 is often assumed, because it's off the forecastle, but it isn't true as pointed out previously. It's a chaff launch, or maybe one of the RBU rockets off the forecastle.
Post Posted: Fri Oct 25, 2013 5:34 am
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all Kirov, Slava & Ushakov class fans  Reply with quote
Peter H wrote:
Hi all

I have previously discussed some thoughts on an upcoming 1/350 Pyotr Velikiy that I hope to start in month or so and have come across a few new questions that I wanted to ask for assistance?

1) With Tomb Stone fitted as per instructions is there any point in fitting (forward or aft) the spare "Top Dome" (as a back up so to speak)?

2) I have seen and read the various discussions on deck colour, but I would like to ask for "below waterline" has another colour ever been used or trialled like Brown or Black? (I think a Slava class CG may have been Black below waterline at one stage)? Apologies in advance if I am wrong on this point.

Thanks for any assistance.

Peter H
Sydney, AU


From what I have read, the radar fitted is not tombstone but Trap Door. The Trap door is part of the Front Door/Front Piece family and is used to guide the anti ship missiles not the SA-N-6. So the Top Dome is the correct director for the SA-N-6.
Post Posted: Fri Oct 25, 2013 12:21 am
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all Kirov, Slava & Ushakov class fans  Reply with quote
Sauragnmon wrote:
I spent some time catching up on the whole thread, but I have a few things to share that I think might be pertinent for some of the questions/issues that I noticed did not seem resolved.

1 - the Launch from Frunze's Bow:

A - Too far forward for SA-N-9.
B - Hot vs Cold Launch - SA-N-9 is cold launched, with a nose-mounted rocket that kicks it down towards horizontal before the main motor kicks in. What you're seeing are, possibly, the Tin Man rocket launchers which are right in that area and hot launch.
C - I'm not sure there's a whole hell of a lot of detail to be Had on the SA-N-9 launcher, looking at the ones in the video I posted below. Not as much as the S-300F launchers on, say, Slava Class.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FuH3VL-IP4g -- starting at 9:00 it goes through weapon systems 9:49 is a SA-N-9 launch, notice no burner until it's on trajectory.

2 - the varying deck colours: I think it was Neptune and I had a discussion about this some time back, and the black deck is actually a fresh coat of the Russian Anti-skid coating. It starts out that dark, and especially on the North Fleet it is a sticky, tarry type substance with grit as well as a sticky nature, so it does not freeze in the cold and flake off. The Orange is the typical deck paint. I'm not entirely sure about the Green, might be a different anti-skid or a paint for some use with the helicopters in low light. You don't tend to see that green anywhere outside of aircraft zones though. There are pictures of the Kievs with the whole aircraft area painted in that green, but anywhere else was standard deck orange. The brown colour observed on Moskva is likely, as theorized, weathering of the surface.

3 - something else I noticed about the picture of PTG's Bow - there's a new dome on the center of the forward radar farm, a white dome. That's new, as it looks to be in the spot where the Forward Cross Swords radar should be if it were mounted. Not sure what that's all about.

4 - Rritchie71's comparison pictues - these seem to be of Nakhimov/Kalinin, owing to the fact it's got Kashtan on the side of the rear superstructure. In the first picture, that's not Top Steer on top of her aft mast, that looks more like Plate Steer, where it's one array and a dish, which might suggest why it was removed, as Plate Steer wasn't used on many ships before Top Plate came into service (good example, look at the Sovremenny Class, they served with Top Steer, Plate Steer AND Top Plate units on different hulls). Top Dome has been removed, which is interesting, could be a lead-in to Tombstone installation. Something missed, was the fact that Kite Screech is also missing from its usual place just abaft of the Top Dome position. If you really look, even her Forward Top Dome has been removed from its place on top of the bridge.

Just a few things I thought I could share input on.


Sorry for the late arrival, I'm new to Russian/Soviet ships.
I think the missile being launched (thanks for the link BTW) is a SA-N-6 as the launchers are in that area and also the size of the missile. Thanks for the info on SA-N-9, great launch shots.
Post Posted: Fri Oct 25, 2013 12:10 am
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all Kirov, Slava & Ushakov class fans  Reply with quote
Does this picture of Varyag from Nov. 2011 help?
Cheers
Bill Inglee

Image
Post Posted: Tue Oct 22, 2013 9:32 am
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all Kirov, Slava & Ushakov class fans  Reply with quote
Hi All,

Now for something far less technical. I have a question that I was going to answer when I went aboard Varyag in Sydney at the International Fleet Review. Unfortunately she did not attend the review, very disappointing :cry_3: :cry_3:

My question is this: Does anyone have an estimate (or a measurement) as to how large the anchor cables are on Varyag - the number of links in a certain length of cable would do just nicely :thinking: :thinking:

Thanks in advance.

Andrew
Post Posted: Tue Oct 22, 2013 5:54 am
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all Kirov, Slava & Ushakov class fans  Reply with quote
The Top Dome fire control radar's completely hemispherical radome mounted on a deep, two step truncated cone is unlike any other Radar I know of. Is its hemispheric radome really a lundberg lens mounted on an array of traveling wave amplifiers?
Post Posted: Tue Aug 20, 2013 11:36 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all Kirov, Slava & Ushakov class fans  Reply with quote
If you watch the video of that launch again, you'll note that they launch at a move, and the shot still dives a chunk like a normal torpedo due to the mass/inertia/gravity effects before its motor kicks in. They seem to clear a decent distance before ignition pretty easily.
Post Posted: Tue Aug 20, 2013 3:38 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all Kirov, Slava & Ushakov class fans  Reply with quote
It looks to me like the tubes may have room to train directly abeam, but not further. If the tubes would primarily fire ss-n-15, then they need to ensure the weapon clear the ship by a safety margin. Besides that it wouldn't matter which way they are fired. They can fire in the opposite direction from its target and it wouldn't make any difference.
Post Posted: Tue Aug 20, 2013 1:00 am
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all Kirov, Slava & Ushakov class fans  Reply with quote
Finally got something more clear on those torp tubes. So the Slava tubes definately rotate. It seems that they can't rotate fully though, they'll Always launch under a forward angle. It also corresponds to my initial ideas and indeed the aft of the tubes comes on the reload hatch on main deck aft.

Image

Image
Post Posted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 8:20 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all Kirov, Slava & Ushakov class fans  Reply with quote
Sorry I shoulda been more specific on what I meant! It's the platforms those radomes sit on along the sides of the forward superstructure.
Post Posted: Wed Jul 24, 2013 12:37 am
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all Kirov, Slava & Ushakov class fans  Reply with quote
I find LEDs make excellet replacement radomes. Just cut off the contacts, file the base until you get the right length, and then paint the thing radome color.
Post Posted: Wed Jul 17, 2013 6:39 pm

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