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Re: HMS Victory and Le Redoutable at Trafalgar (1/300) |
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wefalck wrote: "But I will only start another project after this one is done! That's my n°1 'secret' to getting ambitious projects actually finished...  " ... exactly  Well, I have four projects planned but nowhere near finishing my model  [quote="wefalck"]"But I will only start another project after this one is done! That's my n°1 'secret' to getting ambitious projects actually finished... ;)"
... exactly :thumbs_up_1:[/quote]
Well, I have four projects planned but nowhere near finishing my model :rolf_3:
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Posted: Sat Apr 13, 2024 9:21 am |
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Re: HMS Victory and Le Redoutable at Trafalgar (1/300) |
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Maarten Schönfeld wrote: ditto. [quote="Maarten Schönfeld"] :worship_1: [/quote]
ditto.
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Posted: Sat Apr 13, 2024 8:19 am |
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Re: HMS Victory and Le Redoutable at Trafalgar (1/300) |
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Posted: Sat Apr 13, 2024 1:21 am |
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Re: HMS Victory and Le Redoutable at Trafalgar (1/300) |
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"But I will only start another project after this one is done! That's my n°1 'secret' to getting ambitious projects actually finished... " ... exactly "But I will only start another project after this one is done! That's my n°1 'secret' to getting ambitious projects actually finished... ;)"
... exactly :thumbs_up_1:
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Posted: Fri Apr 12, 2024 3:20 am |
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Re: HMS Victory and Le Redoutable at Trafalgar (1/300) |
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Thank you very much everybody!   EJFoeth wrote: would do one more highlight pass on the frames on the boat inside to make them pop out a bit more (especially the English 32ft barge)? Thank you Evert-Jan, that's a good idea! wefalck wrote: the rowing benches of boats were never varnished, but kept blank and perhaps were holy-stoned from time to time. Varnish would have made the benches too smooth, but the rowers needed the friction in order to stay on their benches. Particularly, when you move forward with the oars lifted out of the water, you tend to also slip forward and off the bench (I know this, from experience, because in our family we had a wooden rowing boat where the benches were painted with oil paint ...). In a sea, this is even worse. During the actual working stroke you have your feet resting agains the foot-rests with legs stretched. Thank you very much Eberhart! That makes a lot of sense. I'm in fact not really sure where I got the idea that they would have been varnished? I wish I would have known earlier of of course, because now it would be very hard to change this (especially the floor-boards)... So I will have to live with it. But it is certainly good to know for any future project! Dan K wrote: Your comments about having started them earlier led me back to the start of this thread.
June, 2018!!! Almost 6 years now. Wow.
Have you worked on any side projects during this time, Marijn? No, only on this project! And I don't feel I have been lazy or slow either...  This subject just takes so much work... Especially when scratchbuilding a lot of it, and building and painting at this level of detail. (And having a full-time job and three kids ). But I had anticipated that it would take lots of time and I don't mind. There is plenty of variation in techniques etc. to keep it interesting and challenging. And it is still peanuts compared to building a ship of the line in wood in a larger scale. I have to admit though that sometimes my mind wonders what I will build after this project... And it will certainly be something much less time-consuming! But I will only start another project after this one is done! That's my n°1 'secret' to getting ambitious projects actually finished... Thank you very much everybody! :smallsmile: :cool_2: :smallsmile:
[quote="EJFoeth"]would do one more highlight pass on the frames on the boat inside to make them pop out a bit more (especially the English 32ft barge)?[/quote]
Thank you Evert-Jan, that's a good idea!
[quote="wefalck"]the rowing benches of boats were never varnished, but kept blank and perhaps were holy-stoned from time to time. Varnish would have made the benches too smooth, but the rowers needed the friction in order to stay on their benches. Particularly, when you move forward with the oars lifted out of the water, you tend to also slip forward and off the bench (I know this, from experience, because in our family we had a wooden rowing boat where the benches were painted with oil paint ...). In a sea, this is even worse. During the actual working stroke you have your feet resting agains the foot-rests with legs stretched.[/quote]
Thank you very much Eberhart! That makes a lot of sense. I'm in fact not really sure where I got the idea that they would have been varnished?
I wish I would have known earlier of of course, because now it would be very hard to change this (especially the floor-boards)... So I will have to live with it. But it is certainly good to know for any future project!
[quote="Dan K"]Your comments about having started them earlier led me back to the start of this thread.
June, 2018!!! Almost 6 years now. Wow.
Have you worked on any side projects during this time, Marijn?[/quote]
No, only on this project! And I don't feel I have been lazy or slow either... :big_grin:
This subject just takes so much work... Especially when scratchbuilding a lot of it, and building and painting at this level of detail. (And having a full-time job and three kids :big_grin: ).
But I had anticipated that it would take lots of time and I don't mind. There is plenty of variation in techniques etc. to keep it interesting and challenging. And it is still peanuts compared to building a ship of the line in wood in a larger scale. ;)
I have to admit though that sometimes my mind wonders what I will build after this project... And it will certainly be something much less time-consuming! :big_grin:
But I will only start another project after this one is done! That's my n°1 'secret' to getting ambitious projects actually finished... ;)
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Posted: Fri Apr 12, 2024 2:05 am |
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Re: HMS Victory and Le Redoutable at Trafalgar (1/300) |
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Exquisite boats. Your comments about having started them earlier led me back to the start of this thread.
June, 2018!!! Almost 6 years now. Wow.
Have you worked on any side projects during this time, Marijn?
Exquisite boats. Your comments about having started them earlier led me back to the start of this thread.
June, 2018!!! Almost 6 years now. Wow.
Have you worked on any side projects during this time, Marijn?
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Posted: Thu Apr 11, 2024 8:16 pm |
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Re: HMS Victory and Le Redoutable at Trafalgar (1/300) |
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Outstanding work as usual my friend!
Outstanding work as usual my friend!
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Posted: Thu Apr 11, 2024 7:21 pm |
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Re: HMS Victory and Le Redoutable at Trafalgar (1/300) |
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Impeccable work, as always. Your boats and launches are better detailed than my 1/700 scale monitors and destroyers!
Impeccable work, as always. Your boats and launches are better detailed than my 1/700 scale monitors and destroyers!
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Posted: Thu Apr 11, 2024 5:13 pm |
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Re: HMS Victory and Le Redoutable at Trafalgar (1/300) |
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Really excellent paint-job on this micro-fleet of ship's boats I liked in particular the washes/shading with oils of the interior details that otherwise could look quite flat at this small scale. I hardly dare to say a word of criticism: the rowing benches of boats were never varnished, but kept blank and perhaps were holy-stoned from time to time. Varnish would have made the benches too smooth, but the rowers needed the friction in order to stay on their benches. Particularly, when you move forward with the oars lifted out of the water, you tend to also slip forward and off the bench (I know this, from experience, because in our family we had a wooden rowing boat where the benches were painted with oil paint ...). In a sea, this is even worse. During the actual working stroke you have your feet resting agains the foot-rests with legs stretched. Really excellent paint-job on this micro-fleet of ship's boats :thumbs_up_1: :thumbs_up_1:
I liked in particular the washes/shading with oils of the interior details that otherwise could look quite flat at this small scale.
I hardly dare to say a word of criticism: the rowing benches of boats were never varnished, but kept blank and perhaps were holy-stoned from time to time. Varnish would have made the benches too smooth, but the rowers needed the friction in order to stay on their benches. Particularly, when you move forward with the oars lifted out of the water, you tend to also slip forward and off the bench (I know this, from experience, because in our family we had a wooden rowing boat where the benches were painted with oil paint ...). In a sea, this is even worse. During the actual working stroke you have your feet resting agains the foot-rests with legs stretched.
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Posted: Thu Apr 11, 2024 1:46 pm |
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Re: HMS Victory and Le Redoutable at Trafalgar (1/300) |
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A1 ++ for small scale boatbuilding...! the clinker simulation in particular ............ ( whilst everything else is merely superb...!!) ==> is very very outstanding! Bravo JB A1 ++ for small scale boatbuilding...!
the clinker simulation in particular ............
( whilst everything else is merely superb...!!)
==> is very very outstanding!
Bravo
JB :thumbs_up_1: :thumbs_up_1:
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Posted: Thu Apr 11, 2024 12:04 pm |
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Re: HMS Victory and Le Redoutable at Trafalgar (1/300) |
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Speechless!  Speechless! :woo_hoo:
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Posted: Thu Apr 11, 2024 9:55 am |
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Re: HMS Victory and Le Redoutable at Trafalgar (1/300) |
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marijn van gils wrote: Contrary of some of the more adventurous scratchbuilders here (I’m looking at you EJ and Eberhart! ), I decided to build the hulls smooth and suggest the overlapping planks with paint only. I heard that  Has been a while since a last touched a brush, don't trust myself enough to paint those lines in... and adding strips is fairly easy, only takes a couple of days Great work though as always! would do one more highlight pass on the frames on the boat inside to make them pop out a bit more (especially the English 32ft barge)? [quote="marijn van gils"]Contrary of some of the more adventurous scratchbuilders here (I’m looking at you EJ and Eberhart! ;) ), I decided to build the hulls smooth and suggest the overlapping planks with paint only. [/quote]
I heard that :whistle:
Has been a while since a last touched a brush, don't trust myself enough to paint those lines in... and adding strips is fairly easy, only takes a couple of days ;)
Great work though as always! would do one more highlight pass on the frames on the boat inside to make them pop out a bit more (especially the English 32ft barge)?
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Posted: Thu Apr 11, 2024 6:09 am |
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Re: HMS Victory and Le Redoutable at Trafalgar (1/300) |
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Ahahahah We were really looking forward from an update from you Marijn, but we weren't expecting the apperance of the HUGE HAND pic Excellent details and painting that makes the "little boats" at par with the big vessels - consistency is the word! Bravo  Cheers, Rui Ahahahah
We were really looking forward from an update from you Marijn, but we weren't expecting the apperance of the HUGE HAND pic ;)
Excellent details and painting that makes the "little boats" at par with the big vessels - consistency is the word!
Bravo :)
Cheers,
Rui
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Posted: Thu Apr 11, 2024 5:19 am |
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Re: HMS Victory and Le Redoutable at Trafalgar (1/300) |
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What a feast for the eye XXXDAn What a feast for the eye :-)
XXXDAn
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Posted: Thu Apr 11, 2024 5:14 am |
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Re: HMS Victory and Le Redoutable at Trafalgar (1/300) |
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Thanks guys!  It is about time to add two boats to the skid beams of Victory. But I decided to also paint the other five remaining boats together. I scratchbuilt them quite some time ago: viewtopic.php?f=59&t=167367&start=560#p942655viewtopic.php?f=59&t=167367&start=560#p942794viewtopic.php?f=59&t=167367&start=620#p956741The base colours were airbrushed with Tamiya and AK lacquer acrylics. Only the varnished wooden elements (twarts, benches, floorboards, …) needed to be picked out by hand. I used AK 3th gen acrylics for that. I started with a light sand colour (only the British and French barges are shown here, so I we can zoom in a bit):  I painted over this with diluted brown, creating a light woodgrain effect by painting in the direction of the woodgrain. I started with a lighter brown and then added a darker one to emphasize the effect. When dry, I coated the ‘wood’ with acrylic satin varnish to get the varnished feel of the real thing:  The rest of the painting process was the same as for the ships. First some filters with different tones oil paints to add some colour variation. I tried not to get these on the varnished wood parts.  Three of the boats have been damaged. I painted the base colour of the damage with Humbrol enamel (here only on the British barge):  Now I shaded all the details with very dark brown oil paint:  Next, I highlighted edges and details, and of course the damaged areas. I also used Humbrol enamels for that. Finally, I painted the small details (mast clamps, golden rim on the barge, rudder pins):  For most of the boats, that was it! The French barge:   English 32ft barge:   French cutter:   British 34ft launch:   British 28ft pinnace:   The only clinker built boats were the smallest ones, the British 18ft cutter ('jollyboats'). I have two of them: the damaged one on Victory and the other one in the water. Contrary of some of the more adventurous scratchbuilders here (I’m looking at you EJ and Eberhart! ), I decided to build the hulls smooth and suggest the overlapping planks with paint only. Smooth hulls:  And the planks painted on with diluted oil paint:   Painting these lines is of course fine work, so it does take a bit of time: about 45 minutes to one hour for each boat. But I’m guessing that’s still a lot less than actually building the overlapping planks (which I would never be able to do this finely anyway…). But of course, these boats will mostly be viewed like this:  Or even worse like this:  Anyway, it was a fun challenge to render the clinker planking effect! And a small reminder of the scale/size of these. This also gives a better idea how the painting effects look in real life (because they do look overdone when enlarged as much as in all the photos above).  Thanks guys! :smallsmile: :cool_1: :smallsmile:
It is about time to add two boats to the skid beams of Victory. But I decided to also paint the other five remaining boats together.
I scratchbuilt them quite some time ago:
http://www.shipmodels.info/mws_forum/viewtopic.php?f=59&t=167367&start=560#p942655
http://www.shipmodels.info/mws_forum/viewtopic.php?f=59&t=167367&start=560#p942794
http://www.shipmodels.info/mws_forum/viewtopic.php?f=59&t=167367&start=620#p956741
The base colours were airbrushed with Tamiya and AK lacquer acrylics.
Only the varnished wooden elements (twarts, benches, floorboards, …) needed to be picked out by hand. I used AK 3th gen acrylics for that.
I started with a light sand colour (only the British and French barges are shown here, so I we can zoom in a bit):
[img]https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53623227955_c57929465a_o.jpg[/img]
I painted over this with diluted brown, creating a light woodgrain effect by painting in the direction of the woodgrain. I started with a lighter brown and then added a darker one to emphasize the effect. When dry, I coated the ‘wood’ with acrylic satin varnish to get the varnished feel of the real thing:
[img]https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53622986758_61a666d7c1_o.jpg[/img]
The rest of the painting process was the same as for the ships.
First some filters with different tones oil paints to add some colour variation. I tried not to get these on the varnished wood parts.
[img]https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53623113964_99665084a7_o.jpg[/img]
Three of the boats have been damaged. I painted the base colour of the damage with Humbrol enamel (here only on the British barge):
[img]https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53622987498_9fac3b289b_o.jpg[/img]
Now I shaded all the details with very dark brown oil paint:
[img]https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53623114549_4db8bc571e_o.jpg[/img]
Next, I highlighted edges and details, and of course the damaged areas. I also used Humbrol enamels for that. Finally, I painted the small details (mast clamps, golden rim on the barge, rudder pins):
[img]https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53623229685_a2c63a8bc4_o.jpg[/img]
For most of the boats, that was it!
The French barge:
[img]https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53622787256_f18642e0b9_o.jpg[/img]
[img]https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53623234055_d2ebc15f5a_o.jpg[/img]
English 32ft barge:
[img]https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53622989678_9b58281629_o.jpg[/img]
[img]https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53623116769_b3a5bb610a_o.jpg[/img]
French cutter:
[img]https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53622993173_b6f7179260_o.jpg[/img]
[img]https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53623120194_1914aa68a2_o.jpg[/img]
British 34ft launch:
[img]https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53621900427_91ed2ddcb7_o.jpg[/img]
[img]https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53621900847_693c298794_o.jpg[/img]
British 28ft pinnace:
[img]https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53622785691_e4e604c48d_o.jpg[/img]
[img]https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53623117479_9a4f004e18_o.jpg[/img]
The only clinker built boats were the smallest ones, the British 18ft cutter ('jollyboats'). I have two of them: the damaged one on Victory and the other one in the water.
Contrary of some of the more adventurous scratchbuilders here (I’m looking at you EJ and Eberhart! ;) ), I decided to build the hulls smooth and suggest the overlapping planks with paint only.
Smooth hulls:
[img]https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53644330101_421bb0a436_o.jpg[/img]
And the planks painted on with diluted oil paint:
[img]https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53644669729_31d9d54060_o.jpg[/img]
[img]https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53644542218_49aca54866_o.jpg[/img]
Painting these lines is of course fine work, so it does take a bit of time: about 45 minutes to one hour for each boat. But I’m guessing that’s still a lot less than actually building the overlapping planks (which I would never be able to do this finely anyway…).
But of course, these boats will mostly be viewed like this:
[img]https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53644789565_9a45b791f3_o.jpg[/img]
Or even worse like this:
[img]https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53643453142_cb6cef6c0e_o.jpg[/img]
Anyway, it was a fun challenge to render the clinker planking effect!
And a small reminder of the scale/size of these. This also gives a better idea how the painting effects look in real life (because they do look overdone when enlarged as much as in all the photos above).
[img]https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53621905327_1485f48753_o.jpg[/img]
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Posted: Thu Apr 11, 2024 3:53 am |
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Re: HMS Victory and Le Redoutable at Trafalgar (1/300) |
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Absolutely stunning work, and amazing artistry on display here!
Absolutely stunning work, and amazing artistry on display here!
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Posted: Fri Mar 15, 2024 4:01 am |
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Re: HMS Victory and Le Redoutable at Trafalgar (1/300) |
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pascalemod wrote: Lets not forget through 60 pages that Redoutable here is scratchbuilt.. No, certainly not! It's entirely from scratch! But as for Victory: the good hull was indeed from a resin kit. But Marijn started with carving out the hull completely and building up all of the details, and from there the two ships went almost side by side... [quote="pascalemod"]Lets not forget through 60 pages that Redoutable here is scratchbuilt..[/quote]
No, certainly not! It's entirely from scratch!
But as for [i]Victory[/i]: the good hull was indeed from a resin kit. But Marijn started with carving out the hull completely and building up all of the details, and from there the two ships went almost side by side...
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Posted: Thu Mar 14, 2024 4:18 pm |
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Re: HMS Victory and Le Redoutable at Trafalgar (1/300) |
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Maarten Schönfeld wrote: marijn van gils wrote: ... And together:  The hulls are almost ready now... Now for the first time this picture shows clearly how different the two ships were. Victory was a hefty 'first-rate' three-decker with 104 guns, Redoutable a 'third-rate' two-decker of the Téméraire class with 74 guns . Yes, not much of an underdog the Victory was  Lets not forget through 60 pages that Redoutable here is scratchbuilt.. [quote="Maarten Schönfeld"][quote="marijn van gils"]... And together:
[img]https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53566091027_75e895752f_o.jpg[/img]
The hulls are almost ready now...[/quote]
Now for the first time this picture shows clearly how different the two ships were. [i]Victory [/i]was a hefty 'first-rate' three-decker with 104 guns, [i]Redoutable[/i] a 'third-rate' two-decker of the Téméraire class with 74 guns .[/quote]
Yes, not much of an underdog the Victory was :heh:
Lets not forget through 60 pages that Redoutable here is scratchbuilt..
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Posted: Thu Mar 14, 2024 2:49 pm |
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Re: HMS Victory and Le Redoutable at Trafalgar (1/300) |
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Thank you very much everyone! That is exactly what I'm trying to do and show! Of course, it all depends on the story one wants to tell. If you want to show the beauty and/or technical aspects of a vessel, a pristine museum-style model is probably the best way. But I like to tell the story of the purpose and use of these ships and (in the first place) the human drama involved, for which this style works better. I don't think one is better than the other, just different. But for some reasons, we don't see too many sailing ships in this style... Maarten Schönfeld wrote: Now for the first time this picture shows clearly how different the two ships were. Victory was a hefty 'first-rate' three-decker with 104 guns, Redoutable a 'third-rate' two-decker with 74 guns of the Téméraire class. Indeed Maarten! And I like them both: the power and mass of the first rate, and the more elegant third rate... Thank you very much everyone! :smallsmile: :smallsmile: :smallsmile:
That is exactly what I'm trying to do and show! :smallsmile: :cool_1: :smallsmile:
Of course, it all depends on the story one wants to tell.
If you want to show the beauty and/or technical aspects of a vessel, a pristine museum-style model is probably the best way. But I like to tell the story of the purpose and use of these ships and (in the first place) the human drama involved, for which this style works better.
I don't think one is better than the other, just different. But for some reasons, we don't see too many sailing ships in this style...
[quote="Maarten Schönfeld"]Now for the first time this picture shows clearly how different the two ships were. [i]Victory [/i]was a hefty 'first-rate' three-decker with 104 guns, [i]Redoutable[/i] a 'third-rate' two-decker with 74 guns of the Téméraire class.[/quote]
Indeed Maarten!
And I like them both: the power and mass of the first rate, and the more elegant third rate... ;)
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Posted: Thu Mar 14, 2024 7:42 am |
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Re: HMS Victory and Le Redoutable at Trafalgar (1/300) |
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marijn van gils wrote: ... And together: The hulls are almost ready now... Now for the first time this picture shows clearly how different the two ships were. Victory was a hefty 'first-rate' three-decker with 104 guns, Redoutable a 'third-rate' two-decker of the Téméraire class with 74 guns . [quote="marijn van gils"]... And together:
[img]https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53566091027_75e895752f_o.jpg[/img]
The hulls are almost ready now...[/quote]
Now for the first time this picture shows clearly how different the two ships were. [i]Victory [/i]was a hefty 'first-rate' three-decker with 104 guns, [i]Redoutable[/i] a 'third-rate' two-decker of the Téméraire class with 74 guns .
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Posted: Thu Mar 14, 2024 6:33 am |
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