by Guest » Fri Nov 30, 2007 10:30 pm
Werner wrote:If my statement is false, please show the evidence. I have provided an image of the Elektronika knock-off of the pdp-11 J-11 CPU (which is still the state-of-the-art in CMOS CPUs). The next chip, called the DEC C-VAX, has the words "DEC - When you care enough to steal the very best" on the perimeter of the die, because they knew the Soviets were stealing everything.
I have a few DEC systems. The legend "The FBI investigates every theft of DEC products" appears on the papers next to the list of countries to where export is forbidden.
The statement with the mostly negative merit is "Russian military expansion in the 1980s was borne on the shoulders of stolen technology". Judging from the subsequent thrust of your argument it was your intention to state that the Soviet Union of 1980s was incapable of building a broad spectrum of competitive military force using domestic R&D and normal high level intelligence of main thrust of the technical progresses by their opponents. That was very evidently not true. The fact that aspects of their hardware developments may have been eased or sped along by theft does not alter the fact that the rest of developments were, just by themselves, more than sufficient to make Soviet Union a military technology superpower. I think they've demonstrated beyond any reasonable doubt that they can, using purely domestic R&D produce weapons as capable, serviceable, and up-to-date as those of
almost any other nation. Just in the naval field, examples of their capacity to keep abreast of the US in some fields, and offset backwardness in some fields with unmatched advances in others, were numerous. Their titanium submarine and liquid metal cooled reactors technologies were prodigiously difficult feats unmatched by any others. Their wake homing technology was unmatched and described with envy the USN. The autonomous landing technology of their Yak-36 is something the US is only now beginning to match. Their short range close in missile defenses were also something that lead the USN by up to 30 years.
All these suggests that the former Soviet military R&D capacity does not form a good basis for any low estimate for current Russian military R&D capacity, as you attempted to imply.
[quote="Werner"]If my statement is false, please show the evidence. I have provided an image of the Elektronika knock-off of the pdp-11 J-11 CPU (which is still the state-of-the-art in CMOS CPUs). The next chip, called the DEC C-VAX, has the words "DEC - When you care enough to steal the very best" on the perimeter of the die, because they knew the Soviets were stealing everything.
I have a few DEC systems. The legend "The FBI investigates every theft of DEC products" appears on the papers next to the list of countries to where export is forbidden.[/quote]
The statement with the mostly negative merit is "Russian military expansion in the 1980s was borne on the shoulders of stolen technology". Judging from the subsequent thrust of your argument it was your intention to state that the Soviet Union of 1980s was incapable of building a broad spectrum of competitive military force using domestic R&D and normal high level intelligence of main thrust of the technical progresses by their opponents. That was very evidently not true. The fact that aspects of their hardware developments may have been eased or sped along by theft does not alter the fact that the rest of developments were, just by themselves, more than sufficient to make Soviet Union a military technology superpower. I think they've demonstrated beyond any reasonable doubt that they can, using purely domestic R&D produce weapons as capable, serviceable, and up-to-date as those of [i]almost [/i]any other nation. Just in the naval field, examples of their capacity to keep abreast of the US in some fields, and offset backwardness in some fields with unmatched advances in others, were numerous. Their titanium submarine and liquid metal cooled reactors technologies were prodigiously difficult feats unmatched by any others. Their wake homing technology was unmatched and described with envy the USN. The autonomous landing technology of their Yak-36 is something the US is only now beginning to match. Their short range close in missile defenses were also something that lead the USN by up to 30 years.
All these suggests that the former Soviet military R&D capacity does not form a good basis for any low estimate for current Russian military R&D capacity, as you attempted to imply.