Model Monkey USS Portland CA-33 Superstructure

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Expand view Topic review: Model Monkey USS Portland CA-33 Superstructure

Re: Model Monkey USS Portland CA-33 Superstructure

by taskforce48 » Wed Jul 13, 2016 2:25 pm

Anyone interested in seeing what these parts produce in the flesh should check out these couple of builds

My 1/350 Academy Conversion

Vlad's 1/700 Tamiya Conversion

Matt aka a Happy Model Monkey Customer*

*Disclaimer- I have been no way copensated for this post, just wanting to help promote a great product

Re: Model Monkey USS Portland CA-33 Superstructure

by Joe Ellias » Sat Apr 23, 2016 9:22 am

Thank you Steve.

Re: Model Monkey USS Portland CA-33 Superstructure

by ModelMonkey » Sat Apr 23, 2016 8:27 am

And some more reference photos.
Attachments
CA-33 1942.06.14 0403302.e.jpg
CA-33 1941.12.07 9cb4880b1aedf43b_small.jpg
CA-33 1941.12.07 a181c467a8a95b4e_small.jpg
CA-33 1941.12.07 4698cfd44ed91f3c_small.jpg
CA-33 1941.12.07 076797c5ef8f4407_comment.jpg
CA-33 1941.12.07 e4d9487cf19700f9_small.jpg
CA-33 1942.12 0403308.jpg
CA-33 1943.03.03 1537-43.small.jpg

Re: Model Monkey USS Portland CA-33 Superstructure

by ModelMonkey » Sat Apr 23, 2016 8:23 am

Joe Ellias wrote:These pieces are terrific!

My only request is if Steve would provide a full schematic showing how all the pieces lay out on the ship.

Thanks
Joe Ellias
Thanks, Joe!

Hope the drawings below help.
Attachments
1-200 Portland Forward Superstructure and Aircraft Handling Deck.jpg
Portland 1942 Aft Superstructure.a.jpg
Portland 1942 Aft Superstructure.b.jpg
Drawing by Profile Morskie.
Drawing by Profile Morskie.
CA-33 1941.12.07 9449b4a22c42de51_small.jpg
CA-33 1941.12.07 6ccd7bac235b8e27_small.jpg
CA-33 1942.06.14 0403302.a.jpg
CA-33 1942.06.14 0403302.b.jpg
CA-33 1942.06.14 0403302.c.jpg
CA-33 1942.06.14 0403302.d.jpg

Re: Model Monkey USS Portland CA-33 Superstructure

by Joe Ellias » Fri Apr 22, 2016 8:36 pm

These pieces are terrific!

My only request is if Steve would provide a full schematic showing how all the pieces lay out on the ship.

Thanks
Joe Ellias

Re: Model Monkey USS Portland CA-33 Superstructure

by ArizonaBB39 » Mon Apr 18, 2016 7:40 pm

ModelMonkey wrote:Trumpeter's mistakes keep me in business. :cool_2:
:lol_pound: :lol_pound: :lol_pound: :lol_pound: :lol_pound: :lol_pound:

Re: Model Monkey USS Portland CA-33 Superstructure

by MartinJQuinn » Mon Apr 18, 2016 10:29 am

ModelMonkey wrote:Trumpeter's mistakes keep me in business. :cool_2:
(snort) :heh:

Re: Model Monkey USS Portland CA-33 Superstructure

by ModelMonkey » Mon Apr 18, 2016 8:55 am

Trumpeter's mistakes keep me in business. :cool_2:

Re: Model Monkey USS Portland CA-33 Superstructure

by tenacioustanaka » Mon Apr 18, 2016 1:26 am

Great, thank you for the heads up on this issue. Looks to me like I'm definitely going to have to make a move over at shapeways real soon. I've deliberately sat on this Classic W. kit for sooo long because kit bashing these two has never quite sat very well with me. Now it looks like it won't matter anyway and I can save the Tamiya kit for where it really belongs...... kindling for my backyard BBQ pit! :heh: Maybe not but at least there is a MUCH better replacement choice now. With my luck, watch Trumpeter or Dragon release an early war Portland. Just wait and see, you just KNOW it will happen as soon as my payment clears. :Mad_5:

Re: Model Monkey USS Portland CA-33 Superstructure

by MatthewB » Sun Apr 17, 2016 2:40 pm

tenacioustanaka wrote:I am extremely intrigued at this Portland development. I see where the recommended kits for this "conversion" are listed with the Tamiya kit being the focus. However, there is one glaring omission I'd like clarification on.

Will these conversion parts also work with the older Classic Warships resin Portland as well? I picked up one of these last remaining kits from our esteemed site owner a number of years ago but it has a few missing parts. I sought out the Tamiya kits to use for parts only yet with no intention of building the plastic version, just cannibalization.


If anyone is familiar with the CW kit.... can my concern be salved at all? The resin hull does come with a great deal of deck structures already molded on but I don't think it would be that difficult to hack it all off and replace with this 3D stuff. I'm just concerned with dimensions and making sure the resin and 3D structures match closely enough.
I am debating doing the same thing myself.

But I also have a 1942 Wooden Decking for a Tamiya 1944 Indianapolis->1942 Portland Conversion....

So I might just save the Midship Models (Classic Warships) Resin Model and Convert an Indianapolis. The Wooden Decking would not work for the Resin model.

And the Resin Model would need to have decking re-scribed next to the forward deckhouse. The Forward Deckhouse for the Portland was narrower than the Indianapolis.

MB

Re: Model Monkey USS Portland CA-33 Superstructure

by tenacioustanaka » Sun Apr 17, 2016 9:13 am

I am extremely intrigued at this Portland development. I see where the recommended kits for this "conversion" are listed with the Tamiya kit being the focus. However, there is one glaring omission I'd like clarification on.

Will these conversion parts also work with the older Classic Warships resin Portland as well? I picked up one of these last remaining kits from our esteemed site owner a number of years ago but it has a few missing parts. I sought out the Tamiya kits to use for parts only yet with no intention of building the plastic version, just cannibalization.


If anyone is familiar with the CW kit.... can my concern be salved at all? The resin hull does come with a great deal of deck structures already molded on but I don't think it would be that difficult to hack it all off and replace with this 3D stuff. I'm just concerned with dimensions and making sure the resin and 3D structures match closely enough.

Re: Model Monkey USS Portland CA-33 Superstructure

by Frank Fowler » Wed Feb 03, 2016 2:50 pm

Sorry, my last post should have said turret 3 of Pensacola not turret 4 (I have corrected). Also, Helena had a pair of single 20 mm tubs like the Portland pair.

Re: Model Monkey USS Portland CA-33 Superstructure

by Frank Fowler » Wed Feb 03, 2016 1:58 pm

Steve, Just a note on your Portland 20 mm gun tubs. The tubs you have provided for Portland 1942 have uses on many other ships during the 1942/43 time period. The tub for turret 3 on the Portland is the same as the tub on turret 3 of the Pensacola and the two other tubs were also installed on the Chicago during her refit after Salvo Island and the Honolulu received a pair of these during her October 1942 refit. For Honolulu these were part of her fit during Kula Gulf and Kolombangara. They were placed either side of the aft superstructure on the main deck aft of the 1.1" guns. So your tubs are very useful for other models. Thanks for doing these.

Re: Model Monkey USS Portland CA-33 Superstructure

by ModelMonkey » Wed Feb 03, 2016 7:53 am

Hi, Matt!

Actually, where the forward two turrets are located, the main deck has considerable shear and is not flat at all. This shows up in plans and photos of the ships. Look carefully at the bottom of the base ring for Turret #2 in the photo of Portland's forward deckhouse below. Notice how the deck is higher at the front of the base ring than it is at the back. This is due to the deckhouse roof's shear.
CA-33 1944.07.16 0403332.crop.jpg
On most, if not all, pre-war designed USN cruisers, the roof of the forward deckhouse also has shear (slope), following the upward curve of the main deck. Additionally, the decks of these ships have subtle camber (arched when viewed fore-aft), which, among other benefits for a rolling hull, helps with water runoff.

But a heavy turret rotates best when level. Because of the need for a level platter for the turret to rotate upon, and the presence of deck shear, the forward base rings are flat on top but appear sloped on the bottom. The real base rings actually pass through the deck and have no shear. But for modeling purposes, the 3D-printed base rings lie on top of the deck, not through it. When the 3D-printed parts are fit to your model, they will match the deck's slope while being flat on top, just like the real ship.

Hope this helps!

Re: Model Monkey USS Portland CA-33 Superstructure

by MatthewB » Wed Feb 03, 2016 7:04 am

Wasn't turret #1 the only one where the deck had any sheer?

Turret #2 was mounted to the deck house.

What does this "Sheer" do exactly, since the deck is essentially flat at those locations?

MB

Re: Model Monkey USS Portland CA-33 Superstructure

by ModelMonkey » Wed Feb 03, 2016 6:58 am

For those who would like proper base rings for the turrets of any of your USN cruiser builds, CA-24 through CA-35, here you go.

Base rings for turrets 1 and 2 have bottoms with accurate shear (sloped deck). The base rings for turrets 3 and 4 are flat-bottomed. For Pensacola and Salt Lake City, you'll need the base ring for turret 4. They are connected together for printing purposes by sprue attached to the bottoms, easily removed with care.
Attachments
Pensacola base rings.png
Pensacola base rings.a.jpg

Re: Model Monkey USS Portland CA-33 Superstructure

by ModelMonkey » Fri Jan 22, 2016 8:43 am

Good questions, Matt!

No worries about the photos. There are three really good sets of photos available that helped ensure the accuracy of these designs.

1) The first set of very highly detailed, high resolution photos were taken by Life Magazine about December 7th, 1941. They show incredible detail. But some of the features in those photos had been removed or changed prior to Coral Sea and Midway. They are available from Getty Images but are very hard to find using their search engine. You have to be patient and persistent on their site, but it's worth it. Example (low-res version to fit on this site):
CA-33 1941.12.07 4698cfd44ed91f3c_small.jpg
2) photos taken in 7 and 14 June, 1942, just after Midway (Portland was a participant at Midway). These photos show which major features were present in the summer of '42. Link: http://www.navsource.org/archives/04/033/04033.htm Example:
CA-33 1942.06.07 0403306.jpg
3) photos taken in November, 1942 and closely later, showing the massive torpedo damage to the stern, and subsequent photos taken of the repairs in progress. They confirm major 1942 features present and some details (e.g., turret bolt location and type). Same link as above. Example:
CA-33 1943.03.03 1537-43.small.jpg
The major features and details were confirmed present or absent by the "Midway Photos" and the "Torpedo Damage Photos" and carefully cataloged against 2D plans. The "Life Magazine Photos" could then be used to design the details (planking extents, door type, splinter shield shape, 5" service ammo locker details, porthole and vent position, etc.) since they are so good. A word of note about the Life Magazine photos - they are simply fantastic but several of them were reversed when published! Since many features of the ship are asymmetrical, I spent a great deal of time determining which photos were reversed and "flipped" those accordingly.

Several 2D drawings were studied to make the designs. No one set of 2D drawings turned out to be perfect when compared to photos. For example, you may have the Portland '42 Profile Morskie drawings, which are indeed very helpful (the Midway and Torpedo Damage photos show that Profile Morskie drew major features essentially correctly for the summer of '42), but they have some minor accuracy issues as shown by photos and Navy plans (door type, turret dimensions, porthole placement, tripod shape, splinter shielding shape, etc. aren't quite right). They proved very good for cataloging features that then need further research to confirm shape, extents, and details.

You can be sure that these designs are well-researched.

Regarding the boats, I omitted boat cradles for those two boats, primarily because PE is a much better medium for cradles because of its thinness. These two boats (at least the starboard boat) do appear in a June 14, 1942 photo. The cradle type and location can be inferred by the modeler from the position of the boats.
CA-33 1942.06.14 0403302.f.jpg
Hope all this helps.

Re: Model Monkey USS Portland CA-33 Superstructure

by MatthewB » Fri Jan 22, 2016 7:10 am

Will those boats actually fit on the boat decks there?

Or will we have to get creative with their cradles?

I also thought the earlier photos were for a different conversion than with this kit.

MB

Re: Model Monkey USS Portland CA-33 Superstructure

by ModelMonkey » Thu Jan 21, 2016 11:27 pm

phlevels wrote:Is there any chance that you could produce plans/drawings to illustrate how to use the parts?
Phil
Here you go. As you can see, they aren't plans or instructions per se, they are renderings to show how the parts are arranged:
1-200 Portland Forward Superstructure and Aircraft Handling Deck.jpg
Portland 1942 Aft Superstructure.a.jpg
For most kits, the parts are nearly direct replacements for the Indianapolis kit's parts, except for the hull surgery needed for the plastic model's hull to accept the much longer aircraft handling deck and the much shorter forward superstructure. Some very good photos of how another modeler performed the hull surgery can be found earlier in this thread.

Hope this helps!
Attachments
Aft gun tubs location.  Drawing by Profile Morskie.  Unlike this drawing, photos of the ship show that the fantail tub does not have an opening.
Aft gun tubs location. Drawing by Profile Morskie. Unlike this drawing, photos of the ship show that the fantail tub does not have an opening.

Re: Model Monkey USS Portland CA-33 Superstructure

by phlevels » Thu Jan 21, 2016 10:39 pm

Is there any chance that you could produce plans/drawings to illustrate how to use the parts?
Phil

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