The Ship Model Forum

Maybe good to note: I have started this new build topic: [b]Zr.Ms Wassenaar - Dutch Ship of the Line of the T�m�raire Class[/b], which triggered my research in all these Pluton ships built in Antwerp and Amsterdam for that matter.
[url]http://www.shipmodels.info/mws_forum/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=317938&p=934745#p934745[/url]

Hi Maxim!

Thank you for the reply! I had lots of fun translating that little Danish booklet! And the story it tells is jaw-dropping, especially where it comes to the point of the impending mutiny and the insubordination of the two Danish commanders, Rosenvinge and Holsten.
They spent half a year in prison, even after they had just been knighted in Danmark! Fortunately not in France or Belgium, but in Kastellet in Copenhagen. I learned that from the story of one of the officers, J�rgen Conrad de Falsen, who told about the same episode, escaping the same emprisonment narrowly. He refers to 'Frederickshavn Citadel' which is to my knowledge the same fortress.
[url]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/J%C3%B8rgen_Conrad_de_Falsen[/url]

As for other ships which names got mutilated: I only had to look at the list of 'Battle class ships'

HMS A[b][u]g[/u][/b]incourt - referring to the French town of A[u][b]z[/b][/u]incourt

HMS Cressy - referring to the French town of Cr�cy (with the emphasis on the second syllabe, not the first!)

HMS Camperdown - referring to the Dutch town of Camperduin or Kamperduin (the pronunciation of which I will not try to summarise here)

HMS Sluys - OK, the town is called today 'Sluis', but for centuries 'Sluys' was an acceptable spelling.

HMS Alamein - regardless transcription of the Arabic, the town is always called 'El Alamein', so with the article before it.

HMS Corunna - in Spanish this is 'La Coru�a', but today the official name in Galician is 'A Coru�a'. Again with the article, as in French as well.

HMS Oudenarde - in Dutch this has always been 'Oudenaarde' The British never had problems with African words like 'aardvark', so why then trouble with the Dutch aa?

HMS Dunkirk - OK, this coastal town had that name in England for many centuries, but in fact it was Duinkerken (the old Dutch name) or Dunkerque as it is presently a French town.

HMS Poictiers - I have no idea where the 'c' comes from, it was Poitiers from early medieval times!

HMS Ypres - this town in Flanders was always called Ieper or even Ieperen, and only the distant French used to call it Ypres. Why did the British take the French name, for God's sake? The town was never French!

HMS Jutland - OK, another customary foreign name from many ages ago, when the '[b][size=150]Jutes[/size][/b]' lived there [b][size=150]before they invaded Brittany[/size][/b] :big_grin: :big_grin: But at the time of the Battle of Jutland (!) the inhabitants called it 'Jylland' as they still do today! Funny that the adversaries called the same confrontation the 'Skagerrakschlacht'. Battle of the Skagerrak would have been more appropriate maybe... and less referring to the Jute invaders of the British Isles...

Thank you for the story!

It would be interesting how many similar stories are there.

There are at least two misspelled names of British/Commonwealth warships:

HMS Curacoa (should be Cura�ao, named after the Dutch island attacked by the British during the Napoleonic Wars)

HMAS Warramunga (should be Warumungu, named after an the Warumungu Aborigines)

Hi,

Maybe already an old topic, then I have missed it.

I was just researching several Napoleonic warships, and came across references that raised more than an eyebrow! :eyebrows:

French T�m�raire class ship of the line 74 guns: [b]'Le Pultusk' [/b](built 1807 in Antwerp, which was then part of the French Empire under Napoleon).

The name refers to the Polish town of [b]Pu?tusk[/b] (pronounce Poow-toosk, the little scribe through the l isn't there for nothing, it turns the pronunciation from l into w! And the name has nothing to do with pulling the teeth of a boar... :big_grin: ) [url]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pu%C5%82tusk[/url]
Well, I can understand the French didn't have the letter[b] ? [/b]at their disposition in those days.

But now the story begins to be really funny! While researching the topic of the class of this ship (the Pluton sub-class of the famous T�m�raire...) I came across this little [b][i]Danish[/i][/b] booklet: [b]'The Danes on the Scheldt'[/b] [i]De Danske Paa Schelden[/i] [url]http://www.marinehist.dk/orlogsbib/L/LytkenSchelden.pdf[/url]
Fortunately it is also available in editable form here: [url]http://www.gutenberg.org/files/64487/64487-h/64487-h.htm[/url]

With a little help from Google I quickly had a translation made, and found in the annotations:

[size=85]The ship of the line was named in memory of the [b]Battle of Pultusk[/b], but the French had given the ship the twisted name [b]�Pulstuck�.[/b] The Danish officers soon drew the attention of the French to the misspelling, but the ship now had the distorted name; thus it was in the official lists, regulations, etc .; it was no easy matter to get it changed, at least not without much correspondence, and it therefore remained, both officially and in everyday speech, even among the Danes among themselves, to be called �Pulstuck,� until shortly before our crews were recalled when [/size][size=150][b]the Emperor[/b][/size][size=85]accidentally became aware of the error and gave the order to correct it with the remark:[/size]
[size=200][b] �The French do not know therefore even the name of their victories.�[/b][/size] :big_grin: (Archive of the Navy, 8th vol.).

So if you look around on the internet, you can find many references to 'the battle of [b]Pulstuck[/b]' in 1806, in the form of coins, paintings, drawings etcetera. :big_grin: :big_grin:

But you may now ask: what the hell did those Danes do on the Scheldt in 1808? Well, the short version: in 1807 after the abduction of the Danish fleet in Copenhagen after defeat by the British, they seeked for help from Napoleon. As the emperor was in need of crews for his newly built warships in Antwerp, he quickly made a deal: the Danes would get his assistance in return for three. later two complete crews. This arrangement was quickly executed, but a year later, the two captains were arrested by the French for insubordination and the crews were returned to Denmark, without having had much to do in Flushing, where the ships were stationed then. So not much fun for either party in the end!

But nevertheless an interesting piece of reading! I found it after someone directed me to a set of rudimentary plans in the Danish Orlogsv�rfted archives, of the sister ship '[b]Dantzick[/b]' - also a different spelling then what you find in Wikipedia! This was the other ship crewed by the Danes. In this case the spelling was the correct and the common spelling in French for the town we know as [b]'Gda?sk'[/b] today.