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Topic review - Calling all HMS York class (HMS Exeter-WWII) fans
Author Message
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all HMS York class (HMS Exeter-WWII) fans  Reply with quote
Exeter's upper deck (lowest continuous deck accessible from outside - ie the level at which "Y" turret, torpedo tubes etc were mounted) was planked, as were parts of the foc's'le deck (next one up), including the foc'sle and the area around the catapult, and parts of the superstructure deck ("B" gundeck).

Contiuing to be pedantic :smallsmile:, the RN terminology for deck naming/numbering was different to the USN's. Even after numbering instead of naming was adopted (after the Second World War?), the RN system differed.
Post Posted: Sun May 09, 2021 1:21 am
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all HMS York class (HMS Exeter-WWII) fans  Reply with quote
Also on the topic about HMS Exeter, Just need clarification about her wood decks.
To what deck where the decks planked? Main deck, 02 level and 03 level?

This is for an Exeter at the battle of Java Sea

James
Post Posted: Sat May 08, 2021 10:02 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all HMS York class (HMS Exeter-WWII) fans  Reply with quote
Changing topic again... I am adding the open bridge equipment to my 1/350 HMS Exeter (Trumpeter), and have doubts about the actual size (and position, and nature) of some items provided in plastic and PE. Any pictures showing in more detail the HMS Exeter´s open bridge? The one below is the only one I´ve got decently showing some detail.

Image

Marco
Post Posted: Wed May 05, 2021 10:56 am
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all HMS York class (HMS Exeter-WWII) fans  Reply with quote
tjstoneman wrote:
dark grey (not gray - she would have been using RN paints, not USN).


Side note but related - this is why I absolutely will never use "Turret A" to describe a USN turret nor "Turret 1" for a RN or DKM one. Part of the growth that comes with study is the correct use of terms and I believe it's more respectful and accurate to use the terms of the country and navy in question. It leads to a deeper knowledge and appreciation.

Yeah, it's pedantic and I don't advocate jumping on people when they don't use the technically correct jargon, but helping keep history alive is part of what brings us here.
Post Posted: Sun May 02, 2021 2:07 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all HMS York class (HMS Exeter-WWII) fans  Reply with quote
James M asked about Exeter's transfer to the Pacific theater. In the Royal Navy, the US term "theater" wasn't used - and nor was the British spelling "theatre". The only time Exeter went to the Pacific was in 1938-39 when she visited several ports on the west coast of South America; at that time she was part of the South American Division of the American and West Indies Station, and was still in peacetime colours, so her wooden decks would have been unpainted (what is a "deck painter"?).

When she deployed to the East Indies Station in 1941-42, her wooden decks seem to have been painted dark grey (not gray - she would have been using RN paints, not USN).
Post Posted: Sun May 02, 2021 12:59 am
  Post subject:  Exeter Deck  Reply with quote
Can someone tell me, when the Exeter was transferred to the Pacific theater, did she have a wooden deck painter deck gray or did she have a steel deck, thanks ?
Post Posted: Sat May 01, 2021 4:54 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all HMS York class (HMS Exeter-WWII) fans  Reply with quote
Thanks lads for all the info. I really don't know that much about this ship and how she was laid out at the time of her sinking, so I appreciate the feedback.
Post Posted: Sat May 01, 2021 7:57 am
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all HMS York class (HMS Exeter-WWII) fans  Reply with quote
DavidP - the page linked to merely says "Tubs for single 20mm were fitted on B and Y turrets" - not that the guns were fitted.

Leonidas - you wrote "... when she was sent to the Pacific ..." - I don't believe she was sent there after her 1940 repair (although she had been in the Pacific in 1938-39 whilst in the South American Division), she operated on the East Indies Station in 1941-42.
Post Posted: Sat May 01, 2021 6:41 am
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all HMS York class (HMS Exeter-WWII) fans  Reply with quote
As Brett Morrow has said, this issue re no 20mm's was settled long ago. Although it is no surprise that this perennial issue re 20mm's in the tubs raises it's head, given the amount of models and even 'schematics' one sees with the 20mm in both tubs.

However, the answer re X tub is not elusive. So, for the record, again, when the wreck was discovered in 2007 there were no guns whatsoever in either tubs, 20mm or otherwise. Below, is an image of X tub on the wreck, pulled from video, and an historical photo of X tub during a funeral service in the Indian Ocean for the crew of the Walrus that had crashed (and which almost took Capt Gordon, as he was going to fly in the Walrus that day).

As for the pom-poms, their position can be seen in the lower photo.


Attachments:
Empty-tub-X-turret-Exeter.jpg
Empty-tub-X-turret-Exeter.jpg [ 45.58 KiB | Viewed 253 times ]
HMS-Exeter-burial-at-sea.jpg
HMS-Exeter-burial-at-sea.jpg [ 98.44 KiB | Viewed 253 times ]
Exeter-Stbd-pom-poms.jpg
Exeter-Stbd-pom-poms.jpg [ 53.69 KiB | Viewed 250 times ]
Post Posted: Sat May 01, 2021 3:38 am
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all HMS York class (HMS Exeter-WWII) fans  Reply with quote
As ever, study of photographs is helpful - eg https://www.iwm.org.uk/collections/item ... /205185265, where the port pompom mounting can be seen just forward of the tripod mainmast, above a single carley float.
Post Posted: Sat May 01, 2021 12:42 am
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all HMS York class (HMS Exeter-WWII) fans  Reply with quote
tjstoneman wrote:
According to a post on this thread (admittedly 11 years ago - 5 January 2010!), the 20mm were never fitted in the tubs on "B" and Y" turrets, with mountings for single machine guns instead. Not sure if any weapons were ever fitted in the tubs abreast the mainmast.
The single 2 pounder pompoms had been replaced by quadruple Vickers 0.5" machine guns some years before the war. The four single 4" HA guns had been replaced by 8 4" guns in four twin mountings, and two octuple 2 pounder pompom mountings added, during her 1940 repairs.


That's very interesting. Where would the octuple pom poms have been mounted?
Post Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2021 8:32 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all HMS York class (HMS Exeter-WWII) fans  Reply with quote
I thought this weapons subject had been put to bed way back, Tim is almost on the money.
She never got oerlikons, whilst the answer concerning X tub is elusive, an earlier image shows 2 single Mk I 303 Vickers fitted, an early 42 image shows B tub fitted with what appears to be 2 twin Lewis.


Attachments:
EXETER, early 42.jpg
EXETER, early 42.jpg [ 212.75 KiB | Viewed 294 times ]
Post Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2021 5:27 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all HMS York class (HMS Exeter-WWII) fans  Reply with quote
According to a post on this thread (admittedly 11 years ago - 5 January 2010!), the 20mm were never fitted in the tubs on "B" and Y" turrets, with mountings for single machine guns instead. Not sure if any weapons were ever fitted in the tubs abreast the mainmast.
The single 2 pounder pompoms had been replaced by quadruple Vickers 0.5" machine guns some years before the war. The four single 4" HA guns had been replaced by 8 4" guns in four twin mountings, and two octuple 2 pounder pompom mountings added, during her 1940 repairs.
Post Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2021 3:13 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all HMS York class (HMS Exeter-WWII) fans  Reply with quote
I thought she only got the tubs, but never the 20 mm guns themselves.
Post Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2021 11:24 am
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all HMS York class (HMS Exeter-WWII) fans  Reply with quote
2 single 20mm guns located on "B" & "Y" turrets. https://www.world-war.co.uk/York/york_class.php
Post Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2021 11:10 am
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all HMS York class (HMS Exeter-WWII) fans  Reply with quote
Random subject change...Did Exeter have her anti aircraft armament increased when she was sent to the Pacific, or did she just keep the two Pom Pom and four 4 inch guns only?
Post Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2021 10:51 am
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all HMS York class (HMS Exeter-WWII) fans  Reply with quote
Wise move, Marco! Mr Morrow may be correct in suggesting that the ship was complemented with paravanes additional to those attached to the bridge superstructure screen and may be basing this suggestion on an item that can be seen resting on the deck outboard of "B" barbette (I presume that this is on the port side) in the first photograph in his post of 10.22pm 27 April. However and it is a big "however," because we cannot see the location of the starboard paravane in that picture, it COULD be the starboard paravane that was temporarily stowed there. That said, it could be a spare. The only way that you are likely to be able to establish the number of paravanes allowed to the ship, together with their locations with any accuracy, is to ask the Historic Photographs and Ships Plans section of the National Maritime Museum to check the "As Fitted" drawings of the ship.

Finally, while Mr Morrow advises that it was not uncommon for cruisers to be fitted with a second spare set of paravanes, I believe that HMS EXETER is your ship of interest therefore you need to confine what you need to know to that ship.
Post Posted: Thu Apr 29, 2021 3:14 am
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all HMS York class (HMS Exeter-WWII) fans  Reply with quote
Thanks Brett, the first image is pretty clear about both possibilities, wall or floor, being possible. I'll use the wall option. Great info!

Marco
Post Posted: Wed Apr 28, 2021 10:05 am
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all HMS York class (HMS Exeter-WWII) fans  Reply with quote
Different images of Exeter at different times show she shipped a set of paravanes supported on brakets as seen in the above image. Other shots show her shipping a spare set located on deck, some images show her carrying none. A second spare set was not uncommon for cruisers and the location of that set was moved around, sometimes they were moved to the deck beside the barbette, at other times they were stowed behind the barbette. The cropped image below, which appears earlier in this thread, shows a second set located qtr aft of the barbette. They were deployed and recovered with the PV derrick which is in the stowed position in above image, the second image below shows the derrick erected.
I would not disagree with guest that the paravane shown may at that time have been white, but like many pieces of equipment they painted them different colours at different times. Images can be very deceiving, other equipment including the recovery winch also appear a lighter colour.


Attachments:
MID 39.jpg
MID 39.jpg [ 75.74 KiB | Viewed 486 times ]
EARLY 42.jpg
EARLY 42.jpg [ 219.51 KiB | Viewed 486 times ]
Post Posted: Tue Apr 27, 2021 10:22 pm
  Post subject:  Re: Calling all HMS York class (HMS Exeter-WWII) fans  Reply with quote
Guest wrote:
Marco,

Good question!

You see the paravane secured to brackets on the bridge superstructure "screen" in your picture. This may have been the normal position: out of the way of gun blast. They are likely to have been moved further forward and down onto the forecastle when required for use but I cannot be sure. You surmise that some of the fittings on the ship's upper deck may have been painted white. I agree (educated). This was a "smartness"/"pride in ship" measure (the Royal Navy word was "tiddly:" it has nothing to do with being drunk!). However, be careful, painting fittings white was largely confined to such things as fairleads, bollards/bitts, capstans/cable holders and reel covers, nothing else. Fixed structure/superstructure was left grey and that is what the barbette structure of "A" mounting is in the picture. White fittings and all bright-work was painted grey on mobilising for war unless it was left white as a counter-shading measure.


Thank you for the input, Guest, quite useful! I will put the paravene attached to the wall (screen as you name it, I am not an expert in naval terminology), I have some pictures from other RN ships showing that was the standard way of storing these. Regarding the lighter color, I suppose it would have been standard procedure to paint light gray every highly visible item on deck, and white would be highly visible. Good for parade, bad during war, absolutely.

Marco
Post Posted: Tue Apr 27, 2021 10:02 pm

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