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PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 4:26 am 
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Hi everyone,

I really upset when I see it happen because I either respray the whole thing or touch-up the bleed. The former is such a nightmare which may suffer bleeding again or even more but the latter looks really ugly.

I have seen some answers for this but I still suffer from bleeding a lot. A useful answer to avoid bleeding is to spray a thin later of the same colour under the masking tape first before applying your desire colour. Then take off the masking tape just before it is dry. It works but I still want to have more insights to fix this problem.

Another question is about the way you fix it. I tried touching up but it usually ends up in a different colour because the airbrush's paint is much more dilute than the paint brush. However, if I dilute the paint too much on the paint brush. The paint becomes too wet and turns into a wash. I am thinking of diluting it and do a dry brushing. Do you think I am on a right track?

Many thanks for your help and all suggestions are welcomed! :thumbs_up_1: :smallsmile:

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 4:47 am 
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Do not apply too thick layers; better airbrush the model twice or more than trying to get a good covering layer at once. A primer might be required for some paints. I use enmals that are their own primer, most of the times. Never keep your airbrush aimed at the same location, but move it over the model and never start your airbrushon the model, always start aiming next to the model (avoid a possible sprinkler effect). Airbrush paint should be thin, or you'll clog up the airbrush, you'll build up paint at the tip (with possible tip-dry) and the paint may become grainy on the model. It should also not be too thin or if may run. I started practicing on scrap with acrylics and enamels. I know people get very good results with the latter, but I find enamels much more pleasant to work with. Better control for very fine part, they dry up beautifully, and I find them easier to use when applying them by brush.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 6:08 am 
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I used to find this a problem, but now just spray much finer layers to build up the colour. This is partly done by getting the paint thinned correctly, but I also turn the air pressure down quite low, and test spray until I get a nice fine opaque layer, and build up colour that way.

An added benefit is I can sometimes use 'dynamic' masking with very low pressure air brushing, that is using a loose piece of card to mask parts being sprayed locally, and moving the card along as the painting moves along - this can be so much quicker than going through the drudgery of spending hours sticking masking to the model before painting. Another added benefit is this also helps if applying a bit of shading variation.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 9:47 am 
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EJFoeth wrote:
Do not apply too thick layers; better airbrush the model twice or more than trying to get a good covering layer at once. A primer might be required for some paints. I use enmals that are their own primer, most of the times. Never keep your airbrush aimed at the same location, but move it over the model and never start your airbrushon the model, always start aiming next to the model (avoid a possible sprinkler effect). Airbrush paint should be thin, or you'll clog up the airbrush, you'll build up paint at the tip (with possible tip-dry) and the paint may become grainy on the model. It should also not be too thin or if may run. I started practicing on scrap with acrylics and enamels. I know people get very good results with the latter, but I find enamels much more pleasant to work with. Better control for very fine part, they dry up beautifully, and I find them easier to use when applying them by brush.


Rob-UK wrote:
I used to find this a problem, but now just spray much finer layers to build up the colour. This is partly done by getting the paint thinned correctly, but I also turn the air pressure down quite low, and test spray until I get a nice fine opaque layer, and build up colour that way.

An added benefit is I can sometimes use 'dynamic' masking with very low pressure air brushing, that is using a loose piece of card to mask parts being sprayed locally, and moving the card along as the painting moves along - this can be so much quicker than going through the drudgery of spending hours sticking masking to the model before painting. Another added benefit is this also helps if applying a bit of shading variation.


Thanks you everyone for your inputs! Rob, what do you mean by "finer layers", do you mean using low pressure plus thinned paint applying close (or far?) to the surface multiple times to obtain an opaque layer?

Just asking, how come using much thinner paint could avoid bleeding? I suppose the bleeding would be less obvious as it is thinner but you still get an obvious bleed after the colour has built up layer by layer.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 10:47 am 
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Location: Mesa, Arizona
I always make sure to go over all of my tape lines and burnish them with something smooth (end of a Sharpie works well) to make sure the edge is sealed good. Using good tape will help this, some is better than others. For example, I've had terrible luck with "Scotts Blue" painters tape, bleeds and doesn't stick to itself.

Most of the time I use 3M fine line tape for the edges and use 3M yellow masking tape for covering larger areas. The fine line tape is similar to Tamiya tape but is intended for automotive use (as is the yellow tape), so when properly applied it seals well and will not bleed. Also, it comes in larger rolls than Tamiya tape so it's cheaper in the long run. The 3M fine line works well for touch ups, I always use an airbrush to do touch ups unless it's not possible to reach.

Use several light coats instead of one heavy coat when spraying. The first coat of paint is not supposed to be full coverage, more like a dusting of paint. Then on the 2nd coat put a little more paint down to mostly cover everything. The use the 3rd coat to make sure everything is the same color. If you use that technique your bleeding issues should cease to exist.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 12:11 pm 
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Location: Leeds, UK.
gordonf35 wrote:
Thanks you everyone for your inputs! Rob, what do you mean by "finer layers", do you mean using low pressure plus thinned paint applying close (or far?) to the surface multiple times to obtain an opaque layer?

Just asking, how come using much thinner paint could avoid bleeding? I suppose the bleeding would be less obvious as it is thinner but you still get an obvious bleed after the colour has built up layer by layer.


It's not really about making the paint thin, only thin it to ensure it works ok. The trick is to lower the compressor pressure (might need a bit of turning up and down to get it just right) and make quick passes over the subject with a light paint spray to get a fine coat on the subject so it looks like it hasn't fully covered it in solid colour (that's what I mean by opaque) - the advantage is it dries almost immediately and there is no excess paint to run, so it's almost impossible for bleeding to occur. After going over two or three (or more if needed) times the colour quickly builds up to give the full colour coat. It takes a bit of practice to get the technique right, and needs concentration on applying all spray lightly and sparingly, keeping the airbrush moving at all times (as even a slight pause can cause paint to accumulate and running/bleeding to occur).

I think this is exactly what the other responses are describing too - hope this helps :smallsmile:

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Completed: QE class battleship 'HMS Warspite'
Recently completed: Astoria class cruiser 'USS San Francisco'
Recently laid down: Essex class carrier 'USS Essex'


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 13, 2017 12:28 am 
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Rob-UK wrote:
gordonf35 wrote:
Thanks you everyone for your inputs! Rob, what do you mean by "finer layers", do you mean using low pressure plus thinned paint applying close (or far?) to the surface multiple times to obtain an opaque layer?

Just asking, how come using much thinner paint could avoid bleeding? I suppose the bleeding would be less obvious as it is thinner but you still get an obvious bleed after the colour has built up layer by layer.


It's not really about making the paint thin, only thin it to ensure it works ok. The trick is to lower the compressor pressure (might need a bit of turning up and down to get it just right) and make quick passes over the subject with a light paint spray to get a fine coat on the subject so it looks like it hasn't fully covered it in solid colour (that's what I mean by opaque) - the advantage is it dries almost immediately and there is no excess paint to run, so it's almost impossible for bleeding to occur. After going over two or three (or more if needed) times the colour quickly builds up to give the full colour coat. It takes a bit of practice to get the technique right, and needs concentration on applying all spray lightly and sparingly, keeping the airbrush moving at all times (as even a slight pause can cause paint to accumulate and running/bleeding to occur).

I think this is exactly what the other responses are describing too - hope this helps :smallsmile:


Of course it helps, very clear, precise and easy to follow, thank you Rob again for explaining! I am sure it is also helpful to the others reading this! :thumbs_up_1:

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2017 12:53 pm 
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Location: California
You might find this helpful
https://youtu.be/UDS5CCs5LQo


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http://paulbudzik.com/current-projects/Neptune/Lockheed_Neptune_Model_Budzik.html
http://paulbudzik.com/tools-techniques/outside_the_box.html


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2017 7:05 pm 
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Location: Los Angeles and Houston
OH! Duh!

I almost forgot one of the most important tricks in "The Arts" I was ever taught, which applies largely to Airbrushing:

"Practice."

Instead of taping off your model, and then shooting the color on it as a first step, try this:

• Mix up the color you are going to be using (even if this just means thinning the paint for the airbrush).

• Then getting some styrene scraps...

And if the part you are going to be masking and spraying has details running across the masked area, then gluing some small strips of styrene, or something else to "simulate" the details on your part.

And then spraying them with your foundation color (Lets just pretend that it is some version of "Ship Grey" of some sort) and letting it dry.

• Then you go about masking off the "fake part" as you would the real part, and you test out your spraying of the new color for which the mask is intended.

• If you got everything right, then try making another "fake/practice part" and doing it again, to make certain you got it right.

• However, if you got bleeding, then try thickening your paint just a LITTLE, and/or holding the airbrush slightly further away from the part and/or applying a lighter coat of paint.

• Repeat as necessary until things "work."

• Once you have confirmed that the first time wasn't a fluke, then go about masking off your part in exactly the same way that you did your practice pieces, and spraying them the same way as well.

————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————

Also... It is possible to fake an airbrush by drybrushing over the masked line, until you have a thick enough coverage to be able to blend the airbrushing into the drybrushing without actually having to spray paint at the intersection of the masking. This vastly reduces the risk of bleeding, as you are never spraying directly over the masking tape.

This can be tricky to learn though, so I suggest trying it on practice parts first.

MB

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