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PostPosted: Wed Dec 20, 2017 1:12 am 
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Hi

I recently purchased the Trumpeter Tsesarevich and was surprised to find that it doesn’t contain any rigging diagrams as part of the otherwise good instructions. I’m specifically interested in the 1904 version. Where is the best place to find some?

Also I can find a partial SBS by Tracy White on the build, does anyone know of a full one?

Cheers

Neil


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 20, 2017 2:20 am 
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:welcome: to modelwarships.com!!

Ships of that era often had amazingly complex rigging.
Much of which was flag signal halyards to the yards for communication
as well as the shrouds to various levels of he tall masts to make them stay up
along with rigging fwd and aft to give the masts stability in that plane
coupled with the funnel stays etc


Your best bet as a starting point will be photos of the period.
a specific rigging diagram I cannot think of at immediate moment -

... as a guideline to what she ( may have !! ) looked like earlier in her career...

herewith a couple of images of my model of Tsesaravith in 1/700 scale I built back in 1999.
( 35 mm scans ! ) hence not amazingly sharp...

Kind regards

Jim Baumann
Image

Image

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 20, 2017 6:50 am 
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It may be wroth a Pm chat with Chris Medding who built a 1904 Tsesaravitch

link below

viewtopic.php?f=60&t=163669&hilit=meddings#p704655

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 20, 2017 1:09 pm 
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Hi Jim

Thanks for the welcome and info. Very nice build by the way. I will PM Chris.

Cheers

Neil


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 20, 2017 8:19 pm 
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Neil - for future consideration. Rigging diagrams in model instructions are rare. Even in my time researching at the US National Archives I have yet to see an official "rigging diagram" in any of the plans I have looked through. So, even if Trumpeter were to actually look at official plans of a ship (they usually just use what they can download for free or in a scanned book), there isn't a lot for them to work on without putting some time into research and understanding the ship in question. Jim's suggestion is generally how we start. In some cases there may be a good book with some schematics and drawings, but even those are often incomplete.

(Welcome aboard, by the way!)

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 2:43 am 
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Kilsh wrote:
I’m specifically interested in the 1904 version.


JIM BAUMANN wrote:

Image



:heh: Jesus Christ.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 01, 2018 3:12 am 
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Hi Tracy

Thanks for the info and warm welcome.

I did see a SBS which you had started did you ever complete it?

Regards

Neil


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 01, 2018 12:37 pm 
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I have not. I started the 1917 kit, but really wanted to do 1905. I have since picked up a cheap 1905 kit to use as a template to scratch-build the missing structures, but ran into two other issues (well, three - it's now winter and not model building season since I work in an unheated garage) of paint (Linden Hill was out of the colors I needed at the time) and a curved inclined ladder on her aft platform I wanted to have consistent with the other photo-etch but wasn't sure how best to create:


Attachments:
Tsesarevich_Curved_Ladder.jpg
Tsesarevich_Curved_Ladder.jpg [ 95.19 KiB | Viewed 485 times ]

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 05, 2018 1:42 am 
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Thanks again Tracy.

I may wait until someone who knows what they are doing like yourself posts more info or a SBS before I start mine. I’m new to ship modelling, I usually paint busts but am alwAys impressed and inspired by the ship models I see at shows especially the pre dreadnoughts and thought that this would make a nice change and a great retirement project for me.

Regards

Neil


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 22, 2018 9:30 am 
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Hi Kilsh,
have you decided on the paint scheme, or are you just following the in box instructions?
Appearently, Tsesarevich's paint scheme is a topic and a half all by itself, since it varies by time period, also there are no exact color codes etc.
I just ordered the Trumpy 1/350 1904 fit and am planning to build her as she was at the Battle of the Yellow Sea, and am struggling somewhat to find a reliable source.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 22, 2018 12:46 pm 
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Lord_Calidor wrote:
Appearently, Tsesarevich's paint scheme is a topic and a half all by itself, since it varies by time period, also there are no exact color codes etc.


I'm basing my build color choices on this thread and AKAN paints. If nothing else, using paints from Russia seems appropriate.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 22, 2018 11:43 pm 
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Hi Lord Calidor

I haven’t decided on colour scheme as yet, as you rightly say it varies greatly by the exact period in her life. I haven’t decided yet what period I will build as to determine colour. Tracy’s input on colour schemes and AKAN paints looks invaluable though.

Thanks Tracy for this lead.

If there are a few of us looking at research and build around the same time perhaps we should create a new thread covering as aspects of Tsearevich 1904 as this thread was originally just regarding rigging.

For example I am interested in people’s views regarding the Hunter wooden deck,as an option, yes or no?

Cheers

Neil


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 23, 2018 6:58 am 
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Ditto, thanks Tracy, very useful info. I guess we should look into AKAN's color choices.
What got me confused are pics of Tsesarevich from Port Arthur and Qingdao, directly before and after the Battle, which clearly show 2 tone hull, one on the armored belt, and other above that. Since we know that Imperial Russian Navy did not paint the boot-topping on their ships at the time, could this color on the armored belt be the anti-fouling, lower hull red or green?
See these pics (oh, which could also be used as a template for rigging, so we keep in topic :smallsmile:)

Image
Image
Image

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 23, 2018 11:44 am 
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I'm not convinced there were two colors. The top picture looks the same at the bow and the second is really close. The slope will lighten the color due to reflectivity.

*edit* forgot to add that I noticed that the Imperial Russian Navy set was back in set yesterday and ordered one... should be here in about a week. I'll try and spray color swatches for evaluation as well as paint review, etc.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 24, 2018 3:50 am 
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I was thinking the same Tracy, first two pics look like reflections/different slopes issue. However, bottom pic show distinct two tones. Could it be AKAN 73103 for the armored belt, and 73102 for the upper hull? Some sources suggest using 73103 for the complete upper hull, everything above the anti-fouling lower hull paint, however it looks too dark to me, almost as a "soot" color of the Russian Baltic squadron (Borodinos et all).

Looking forward to your test of the Russian color set!

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 24, 2018 6:51 pm 
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They look like two different colours to me, too.

The reflectivity seems to be working in the opposite direction... it’s the change in angle of refelected light that brings the two tones closer together...

The bottom picture shows the two in non-direct light which is why they look more clearly differentiated.

I’m sure others will chime in with more than an opinion though... there are a couple of people with extensive knowledge of this era who will come across this thread at some point and give more definitive answers.

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 27, 2018 11:35 pm 
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Some useful stuff being added here but we are way off topic, as Bill says others will come across this discussion at some point but would it be sensible for me to re-title it something more generic for Tsesarevich research and build to enable wider input? Happy to take guidance from more experienced members.

Cheers

Neil


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 28, 2018 12:45 pm 
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There is a Calling all Russian Pre-Dreadnought Fans! thread we could have this merged with or potentially turn this into a Tsesarevich-centered CASF as the models are going to drive specific interest.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 30, 2018 4:21 am 
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Well still a n00b here, so not that my voice counts as much, but I'm all for merging this with CASF Russian Pre-Dreadnoughts. That topic is quite empty as it is, and I think there are a number of us fans of those ugly-majestic ships.
There is CASF topic for Tsushima Borodinos which is quite busy (or was, some time ago), and as much as I trawled through some 49 pages of it, I saw the mention of Tsesarevich and other Russian pre-dreads.

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