The Ship Model Forum

The Ship Modelers Source
It is currently Thu Nov 23, 2017 5:25 pm

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 146 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 4, 5, 6, 7, 8
Author Message
PostPosted: Sat Dec 31, 2016 1:54 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Apr 16, 2011 7:31 pm
Posts: 25
I was back at the archives recently and just for grins managed to get a proper color scan of the Monadnock turret engine drawing. In case the color lines encode useful info, the scan is posted here:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/149550464 ... ed-public/


Report this post
Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2017 7:31 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Apr 28, 2005 8:46 pm
Posts: 176
Magnificent! Thank you for finding and posting this, Cliff!
Michael


Report this post
Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2017 9:22 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Apr 16, 2011 7:31 pm
Posts: 25
My pleasure :-).

I've had a chance to check out a few more drawings at the NARA and stumbled across this drawing from the Passaic class ships (which appear to be the design that immediately followed the Monitor):

https://www.flickr.com/photos/149550464@N04/32571476231

It's undated unfortunately, and it documents the "Battery Engine" rather than mentioning the turret, but the style of the text and look of the drawing make me wonder if it might date to the civil war period.

Also, if Wikipedia has it right ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Passaic_(1862) ) the civil war ironclad Passaic was in service in one form or another until late 1898. That may indicate that the following drawing also pertains to the same ship, although it's not immediately clear what alterations were made over the years that would be reflected in the drawing:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/149550464@N04/32693655015

There may or may not be any useful info in these, but I thought I'd mention them in case :-).

Cheers,
CY


Report this post
Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Wed Sep 13, 2017 10:25 pm 
Cliff and Michael
I just joined your Forum, but thought I would poke in on this .
Yes, the Passaic was the next Monitor built after the famous battle on March 9, 1862
It was the same-yet different. The hull design was changed( rounded) and was bigger and most notably, the Captain and Helm were moved to the top of the turret .
You might say that it was the first Super Structure & Bridge ship
The engine was close to the Monitor's design, except for the Exhaust/Condenser piping ( 2 instead of 1 )which required a different porting on the engine.
The Monitor had an Asymmetrical Engine and the Passaic had a Symmetrical Engine design.
It took well over 7 months (as I recall) for the Passic to be built, far more time than the Monitor's 100 days
The Passaic first met up with the Monitor in Washington Navel yard on Christmas day 1862 and of course, the Monitor was lost a week later on Dec 31 when it went on a mission.

I suspect the turret drive was the same.
I can't get the link to display your Passaic Battery Drawing, but suspect it is the one in the National Archives file with a 3-3-32 number on it.

It has been fabulous to follow the comments and drawings here...thanks fellows !
Rich


Report this post
Top
  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Sun Sep 17, 2017 4:27 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Apr 28, 2005 8:46 pm
Posts: 176
Hello Rich, welcome to the forum. That's interesting about the dual condensers, I had not known that.

Here are some Passaic type links pulled together from past posts and other collections.
Image
This is the cover of Ian Marshall's book of watercolors, Ironclads and Paddlers. There is an excellent narrative journal written by a sailor on the USS Nahant, here:

https://www.amazon.com/Monitor-Destruct ... 0872497615

In the Scientific American for December 12, 1863, on page 372, there is a long article entitled "The Monitors". This volume of the Scientific American (V9) can be downloaded as a pdf from Google Books. The article is dense with specifications and dimensions for the original USS Monitor and for the nine Passaic class monitors that followed it.

I was surprised to learn that the Czar built ten Passaic class monitors for the Russian navy, beginning in 1865, following the American plans. Presumeably this was under a licensing agreement from Ericsson.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uragan-class_monitor

Re the turret drive, I agree the V-twin engine was essentially the same as that of the original monitor. The drive configuration was quite different because, as you point out, the turrret axis was like a tree supporting the pilothouse, and the turret had to rotate around this fixed tree.

A diagram is posted here:

viewtopic.php?f=27&t=66949&start=40#p413439

And here is a photo of the same general type of system aboard the Camanche:

download/file.php?id=35583&mode=view

The reversing engine drives a crown gear that rotates in the plane of the lower deck, and is a little hard to see in this photo. It is geared to the vertical shaft at right, which ascends through the ceiling to drive the turret via a large diameter gear mounted below turret floor.

Finally, here is a link to Devin's expert model of the USS Weehawken:

http://www.devinjpoore.com/models/weehawken/index.htm

best, Michael


Report this post
Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 5:10 pm 
Thank you Michael for the info !
I looked at Scientific American in 1861 and 62, but not 1863, so I have to do that
I haven't dropped Devin a note yet.
Life has been extremely complicated since my post last month and delayed my response, but this is not the place for that.
Sorry if I mislead you on the condenser, there was only one, but the exhaust manifold had TWO pipes, which meant they had to have a "Y " pipe feeding the condenser.
I need to visit the National Archives in Washington DC to follow up on the drawings if available.
I am working with the Mariners Museum on publishing a book about the Monitor's Engine. Taking a Solidworks Class to help me in that venture !

Erickson built monitors for Russia and Sweden..and a South American country (??)
The Swedish monitor called the SOLVE'
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HSwMS_S%C3%B6lve
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hildur-class_monitor

It was smaller than the USS Monitor and only carried a single gun
I am Swedish and had a relative check it out for me as I do not read/write Swedish and the Swedish Marine museum did not understand my requests.
My cousin told me they gutted the original engine and used the ship as a barge before it was placed in the museum.
They also have no drawings or details of the original installation, even though John Ericsson is a real hero over there.

Rich


Report this post
Top
  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 146 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 4, 5, 6, 7, 8

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You can post new topics in this forum
You can reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group