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PostPosted: Wed May 17, 2017 1:48 pm 
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Plasma_Frigate wrote:
Can't believe there are two German ones out now, that weren't even commissioned.


Well the subject of having "what-if" or "never-commissioned" warships in plastic is not new.

For example., Tamiya went ahead and modelled the Japanese aircraft carrier Shinano, which was only launched and never commissioned, though she was sunk by a US submarine during sea trials!

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 06, 2017 3:10 am 
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Has anyone got their hands on one of these and/or know of a review in the works?

I know there are some basic build-up pictures and sprue shots on HLJ and other sites but they are small and really don't tell much of a story. To me they look good on cursory inspection but do we actually know how accurate they actress are in terms of dimension and shape? And what are the differences between the two kits?

Thanks!

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 06, 2017 4:47 am 
The forward sponsons are slightly different and the lower bridge on the Victorious goes all the way around the front of the island. Those are the different parts and are contained on the same sprue. As for detail and accuracy they look pretty good, its a massive improvement on the old tooling and would be quite acceptable if it was that people discovered Flyhawk were also doing Illustrious so dismissed the Aoshima kit without actually seeing the plastic. I hope that Fujimi release the British Aircraft set they have done for the kit, the Firefly and Barracuda are quite nice but would like to get more of them to do later war year air wings as the Early stuff is covered by Flyhawk and soon to be Trumpeter.


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 06, 2017 5:23 am 
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Looking at the instructions on Hobby Search it appears that there are slight differences in the forward P/S AA platforms and bridge platforms. The kits otherwise share identical parts.


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 06, 2017 10:29 am 
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Vlad,

Here's some feedback by someone at the "Calling all Illustrious/Implacable class aircraft carriers" fans thread who actually examined the kits:

tjstoneman wrote:
Contrary to what has been written on some other sites, the recently-released Aoshima ILLUSTRIOUS appears to be a completely new moulding. The style of construction is different:

The old version had a one-piece waterline hull, with shallow boat-bays and berthing bays and anchors moulded onto the hull, a single quarterdeck piece (with oddly depicted blanks instead of openings between the upright sections of the ship's side), no foc's'le deck, each deck of the island as a separate piece, one-piece cranes, very basic aircraft, 2pdr pompoms and ship's boats.

The new version has separate port and starboard side hull pieces, with properly-indented boat-bays and berthing bays (although the sections behind each upright are, incorrectly, solid), separate foc's'le and quarterdeck, each with a separate deckhead to cover it (although the foc's'le does not extend right to the bow, as it should), separate anchors, a much better-depicted island, two-piece cranes and better (but not ideal) boats and pompoms, with a wideranging selection of aircraft (but only a few of the types included would have been onboard at any given time).

Aircraft supplied include four Swordfish (two folded, two spread), four Martlets/Wildcats, two Seafires/Spitfires, two Sea Hurricanes/Hurricanes, two Corsairs, two Barracudas and four Fulmars (two folded, two spread), plus two SB2C Helldivers and two SBD Dauntless aircraft - the latter two types never formed part of ILLUSTRIOUS' air group (admittedly the instructions indicate they are not required).
Some parts (eg cranes, wireless masts) would benefit from replacement with photo-etch parts.

All in all, a considerable improvement upon the old ILLUSTRIOUS or VICTORIOUS kits - but, on recent form, the promised Flyplane versions may be better still - time will tell!


When in doubt, always consult the "Calling All Ship Fans" (CASF) threads for your chosen class of ship.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 07, 2017 3:01 am 
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Thanks both but that's not really a huge amount of information. I was hoping someone might have started a build, taken some close-up review shots, compared to drawings/plans or at least taken a ruler to the kit. I find that really novel releases like the ICM 1/700 Konig and most things Flyhawk get huge interest very quickly but more mundane things like this seem to come and go a bit too silently. Not that having a brand new seemingly actually decent RN armoured carrier in 1/700 is mundane, more that Aoshima's kits aren't as flashy so it seems people don't pay attention.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 07, 2017 9:00 am 
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Vlad:

Our friend Mitsuoki Kubota has done a comparison of the new Aoshima HMS Illustrious kit with resized (1/700) scale plans from the Anatomy of the Ship HMS Victorious on Twitter (Illustrious and Victorious were, for all practical purposes, near-identical sisters).

His Twitter feed can be found here: https://twitter.com/fake_johnbull

Check out his feed from between December 25-27, 2016. In short, he concludes that the kit is very accurate in dimensions and shape, except for the placement of one of the searchlight platforms which is off by a few millimeters--which will be quite acceptable for most modelers.

I have the kit, and I will say that except for the treatment of the open port and starboard galleries, which are depicted as deep cubby-holes, it is a very, very nice kit. The knuckle is nicely rendered, as is the hull plating, armor belt, etc. The slightly raised catapult platform on the flight deck is missing (though the catapult is there), and the island is very nicely done. The enclosed cable deck and quarterdeck are either lacking in detail (the former) or have inaccurate details (the latter) and purists will want to rectify this, though both are nearly impossible to see once installed, so this is not a major drawback.

However, I believe that the fit for Illustrious combines several features that were never present at the same time (the submarine observation stations on her forward sponsons--which come with the Victorious kit--are missing, but were present during the early phases of Illustrious's career, when her compass platform did not yet wrap around the face of the island). This, however, can be corrected by using the appropriate parts from the Victorious kit, which also includes the version of the compass platform which wraps around the front of the island. Aoshima also made some bone-headed mistakes--they molded the draft lines on one side of the hull in relief (really?!) and a representation of the accommodation ladder as well, which will have to be removed--this is a pain in the neck (I was able to do so without removing the plating lines that run through them--though it was not easy). Fake Johnbull highlights these gaffs in his Twitter review. I have not had time to look at the aft round-down to see if it is accurate for both ships. I believe that the kit of HMS Victorious is accurate out of the box.

The main weakness of both kits is that the secondary armament and antiaircraft guns, searchlights, and boats are all pretty crude and will need to be replaced to be convincing. I think all are available as aftermarket items. But the basic kit is very nice, and very sound. Overall, the Illustrious and Victorious kits will build into very nice models.

Here are some build threads for the new Aoshima HMS Illustrious kit from some Japanese Twitter feeds:

Warfare's (@i_hate_liar) Twitter feed from April 14-27, 2017): https://twitter.com/i_hate_liar

Harukano Sugano's (@EnjakuHaruzono) Twitter feed from March through May of 2017: https://twitter.com/EnjakuHaruzono

As you can see, with some work, and the dedicated PE set that Aoshima has produced, it builds ups very nicely.

HTH

Mike E.

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Last edited by Mike E. on Wed Jun 07, 2017 3:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 07, 2017 11:45 am 
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Thank you, that's exactly the kind of thing I was after, would never have found the tweets without the dates let alone the link. Never used Twitter but I have to say it's a horrible platform when you're trying to scroll for something specific :heh:

Anyway, the kit actually looks very impressive. I would say surprisingly so, not to belittle Aoshima in general, but certainly above my expectations for the price. The minor detail issues I can live with, the spot on size and shape are what makes this so great. It looks like the Victorious kit would be more versatile for mid war fit of any of the first three ships of the class.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 08, 2017 7:57 pm 
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A nice build of the new mold Aoshima HMS Victorious on this gentleman's Twitter feed, the entry dated May 23, 2017. The colors are off, but the workmanship is nice.

https://twitter.com/hakurai

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 09, 2017 7:57 am 
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Yes, very nice indeed. I'm very tempted now to get one of these.

I noticed the first page of this thread has a lot of talk about sources for AA fit, but no actual conclusions or findings. Do we have a summary of what AA was added to the ships of this class and when?

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 13, 2017 2:53 am 
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No takers on the AA? So far I've worked out Illustrious in 1944 had 19 or 20 twin Mk.V Oerlikon mounts plus a dozen or so singles. I can work out from the pictures where 8 of the twins are with some certainty, 4 more with some speculation, leaving 7 or 8 i can't place at all. And I can't place any of the single mounts. Most models I see that claim the ship is built in 1943/44/45 have correct for period camouflage and airgrpup but pretty much as-built AA. Is there really that little research on the subject?

Mike E. wrote:
A nice build of the new mold Aoshima HMS Victorious on this gentleman's Twitter feed, the entry dated May 23, 2017. The colors are off, but the workmanship is nice.

https://twitter.com/hakurai


By the way, why do you say the colours are off? Raven's camouflage book states the pattern was AP507A, MS3 and white, and that build looks spot on to me.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 25, 2017 12:38 pm 
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Apparently at least 2 Shapeways vendors produce HMS Indefatigable in smaller wargaming scales such as 1/1800.

1/1800 carrier HMS Indefatigable by Miniatures

1/2400 carrier HMS Indefatigable by Tiny Thingamajigs

Now, if only we could convince them or another Shapeways vendor to produce it in 1/700... :heh:

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Last edited by Haijun watcher on Sun Jun 25, 2017 1:33 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 25, 2017 1:28 pm 
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Haijun watcher wrote:
Apparently at least 2 Shapeways vendors produce HMS Indefatigable in smaller wargaming scales such as 1/1800.

1/1800 carrier HMS Indefatigable by Miniatures

1/2400 carrier HMS Indefatigable by Tiny Thingamajigs

Now, if only we could convince them or another Shapeways vendor to produce it in 1/700...


I'm currently painting a 1/2400 Fuso I bought from that Tiny Thingamajigs shop as a "test". I was considering buying some of these to collect variations on ships I like (e.g. a whole class where I build a "main" one in 1/700 and all the sisters and/or camouflage variations in "tiny" scale) without completely running out of shelf space. The problem is they're actually quite expensive for their size. I think 1/2400 is too small, but 1/1800 could be good within reasonable cost limits. And if it's something not available in a larger scale, I would go for it. I am not holding my breath for a 1/700 Implacable class...

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 25, 2017 1:36 pm 
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Vlad wrote:
I am not holding my breath for a 1/700 Implacable class...


Shouldn't kitbashing an Aoshima Illustrious or Victorious into Implacable or Indefatigable not be a problem for a Master kitbasher such as you? :big_grin:

I think there's a thread where someone else is converting the Heller 1/400 Illustrious into Indomitable, if I can recall correctly.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 25, 2017 2:16 pm 
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Haijun watcher wrote:
Shouldn't kitbashing an Aoshima Illustrious or Victorious into Implacable or Indefatigable not be a problem for a Master kitbasher such as you? :big_grin:

I think there's a thread where someone else is converting the Heller 1/400 Illustrious into Indomitable, if I can recall correctly.


Yes, I asked that earlier in this thread I think and someone replied with pictures of that conversion. I gave it some serious thought but shelved the idea, the hull surgery required is enormous, and that's just for Indomitable. For Implacable it would be easier to scratchbuild than kitbash.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 25, 2017 11:57 pm 
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Vlad:

The rendering of MS3 on the model of Victorious on Twitter that I posted is way off. I think he used IJN colors that he had on hand. MS3 is a much more subtle gray-green.

HTH

Mike E.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 2:26 am 
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Mike E. wrote:
Vlad:

The rendering of MS3 on the model of Victorious on Twitter that I posted is way off. I think he used IJN colors that he had on hand. MS3 is a much more subtle gray-green.

HTH

Mike E.


Ah ok that makes sense, I thought you meant he shouldn't have been using MS3 in the first place.

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 6:59 pm 
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Mike E. wrote:
Vlad:



Here are some build threads for the new Aoshima HMS Illustrious kit from some Japanese Twitter feeds:

Warfare's (@i_hate_liar) Twitter feed from April 14-27, 2017): https://twitter.com/i_hate_liar

Harukano Sugano's (@EnjakuHaruzono) Twitter feed from March through May of 2017: https://twitter.com/EnjakuHaruzono

As you can see, with some work, and the dedicated PE set that Aoshima has produced, it builds ups very nicely.

HTH

Mike E.


Thanks for sharing these. I'm tempted to do an aircraft carrier. I'm intimidated by painting the deck. Is that the typical technique people use - mask off everything that way and paint it? Or are there usually appropriate decals?


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 09, 2017 7:31 am 
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mikasa wrote:
Thanks for sharing these. I'm tempted to do an aircraft carrier. I'm intimidated by painting the deck. Is that the typical technique people use - mask off everything that way and paint it? Or are there usually appropriate decals?


Most kits have appropriate decals for deck markings. The new Aoshima kits of Victorious and Illustrious definitely do. But some people prefer to go the extra mile, depending on the quality and accuracy of the kit decals, because you can get thinner lines by masking and more control over colour and later weathering. It's not particularly difficult, just tedious.

Having said that, it seems in the first blog the whole flight deck is only masked for the purpose of spraying the hull, which is no different to masking the deck on any ship to spray the rest (in fact it would be much easier because there are no small surface details to mask around). If you're brush painting you don't need to worry about that at all.

Is that what you meant?

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 09, 2017 9:24 am 
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Yes, exactly, thanks very much!

Maybe I should have shared some background. I've done a lot of AFV modeling. Most people use decals and they are fine, but I've met folks who go to great pains to find, or make, stencils for the AFV markings because they can be more realistic, and the edge of the finished decal doesn't effect later weathering (this seems a little over the top for me, but some folks notice apparently). So I assumed there were flight deck decals but I didn't know for sure.


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