The Ship Model Forum

Saratoga, circa 1932

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Martin

"Tomorrow is the most important thing in life. Comes into us at midnight very clean. It's perfect when it arrives and it puts itself in our hands. It hopes we've learned something from yesterday." John Wayne

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I want to modify the Trumpeter 1/350 kit parts to the expanded flag bridge of Saratoga in 1936, but I am hesitant to start cutting up the kit parts based just on fuzzy photos. Are there any diagrams or close up photos that show what this area should look like in 1936 that I can use as a guide to modify the kit parts? Also, did Saratoga have AA guns on top of the 8" turrets in 1936? - again the photos are not clear.

Thanks for your help!

Bill

Bill,
For what it's worth here are some "work in progress" shots of mine; might help.

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-Rob <><

Thanks Rob! The photos of your work help tremendously and I now have a clear idea of the modification. One question - why is the support for the top structure a round pole instead of the square type support that the kit has (parts B29 & B30)?

Many thanks,

Bill

Good morning everyone.

I was wondering, how difficult would it be to convert the Tamiya Saratoga kit to a 1942 Saratoga? During the Battle of Eastern Solomons, specifically.

I'm assuming this Tamiya kit is late war.

I am also wondering if the glaring errors seen in the Fujimi kit, such as the hull flare mentioned in the Steel Navy review of the Fujimi kits, were corrected with this Tamiya kit?

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"Haijun" means "navy" in Mandarin Chinese.

"You have enemies? Good. It means you stood up for something in your life."- Winston Churchill

Bill,

It's been a long time since I was avidly researching Saratoga.

The square in the kit is a Trumpeter bogus kind of. The tripod leg was clearly visible in early pictures of Sara and then structure was built around. Prewar and late 30's picture show this structure gone after the 36' mod. At least that is my "interpretation".

If you don't have the Squadron Signal USS Saratoga (34004) I highly recommend it. I want to build a late thirties and a 43' Saratoga (from Lexington kit). Cheers!!!

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-Rob <><

Rob,

I see what you mean - I looked at some fuzzy photos on line and it does look like what you are saying for the time period in question. Thanks again for your help, I will use your modification as my guide.

You don't happen to know the correct AA gun set up on the top of the 8" turrets for 1936? The photos I have looked at are very confusing!

Cheers,

Bill

Rob -

That is amazing work!

_________________
Martin

"Tomorrow is the most important thing in life. Comes into us at midnight very clean. It's perfect when it arrives and it puts itself in our hands. It hopes we've learned something from yesterday." John Wayne

Ship Model Gallery

Would someone PLEASE answer my question at the following thread below?

Tamiya's 1/700 Saratoga- first impressions

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"Haijun" means "navy" in Mandarin Chinese.

"You have enemies? Good. It means you stood up for something in your life."- Winston Churchill

Hi,

It would not be too difficult; mostly eliminating all the 40mm mounts and replacing the locations/gun tubs that were present in 42' with the 1.1" guns. You'll also have to add all the 20mm mounts along the catwalks. The Flight deck was also extended aft as I remember (in 43'-44'), it's been a while. But I'd say it would not require major surgery.

I'm sorry I don't have any more specifics right now; I've got some other things going on and I hope to get back to modeling soon.

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-Rob <><

Martin,

That is way TOO KIND coming from you, you don't know what that means to me. Thank you.

Hopefully I can get everything in order and get back to my Sara, my Tico, AND my Bunker Hill...soon.

God bless and you have had, and will continue to have, my prayers for your little girl.

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-Rob <><

It is far better than the Fujimi kits, but I think that a 42' Sara wouldn't be super difficult from this kit. The Sara had her hull blistered by this point which is present in the Tamiya kit. The bridge was modified and she had the twin 5/38's. Biggest change would be removal of some of the 40mm tubs and swapping out remaining ones with 1.1 inch. She also carried a stronger 20mm battery at this time. Doyle's book would be helpful with this as far as placement. Might be an interesting conversion.

HTH

Matt

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In the yards right now:
USS Utah AG-16
On Hold
1/350 USS Portland CA-33 1942
1/350 Trumpeter Texas with a twist

It is hard to find photos of those guns close enough to glean much detail, but there is one in the Squadron Saratoga book that gives the most info I have been able to find. On top of the #2 and #3 8in turrets there are circular platforms which mount (what appear to me to be) dual .50 cal machine guns. There is a complex looking mount, slightly primitive, with a frame for the guns, seats, and traverse and elevating mechanism.

Someone else may be able to be more precise about the dates (I am just going from memory) but the initial AA configuration on the turrets in the early 1930's was what I described above. Around 1936-37 they had a shield placed around the AA guns on those turrets. It remained for a period of time and then was removed because it obstructed forward visibility from the armored conn. Hopefully that was helpful.

I am including those AA mounts on my current build, but am going to represent them with canvas covers on. Considered scratching the entire mount but in many photos those covers are on, so I just went with it to save some time.

Here is the best reference I can provide from my current work. I suggest picking up the Squadron book, though. It has been invaluable.

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Cap'n Price

Fitting out:
1/350 USS Saratoga 1936

On the ways:
1/72 Gato

This should really help in converting a Tamiya 1/700 Sara to her 1942 Eastern Solomons appearance:
viewtopic.php?f=16&t=160714

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Have fun, Monkey around.™

-Steve L.

Complete catalog: - https://www.model-monkey.com/
Follow Model Monkey® on Facebook: - https://www.facebook.com/modelmonkeybookandhobby

Hope this is a help to those building a pre-war Saratoga. You can see in this rendering the evolution of the island over a 13-year period.

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Have fun, Monkey around.™

-Steve L.

Complete catalog: - https://www.model-monkey.com/
Follow Model Monkey® on Facebook: - https://www.facebook.com/modelmonkeybookandhobby

Here are two drawings that showing the three major wartime configurations of the bridge tower. Some common details have been omitted in these drawings so that the major differences are more apparent.

Notice there are subtle changes to the shape of the venturi for each year. By 1943, the pilot house's windows were replaced with portholes. In 1944, the armored conning station below the pilot house was removed, the signal deck extended aft, and other details such as cable trunking and a portside walkway were added.

_________________
Have fun, Monkey around.™

-Steve L.

Complete catalog: - https://www.model-monkey.com/
Follow Model Monkey® on Facebook: - https://www.facebook.com/modelmonkeybookandhobby

A question for you experts:

Hello,

I know this question was asked before from another member of this board but I'm uncertain with the answer.

The question is which color Saratogas flight deck got in summer 1944 as she recieved her Ms 32/11a camouflage paint scheme at Bremerton ?
I know there was a change at 1944 from Flight deck stain 21 ( similar to Oceangrey ) to a new flight deck stain which looked more darker, more like the revised deck blue.

Tracy White has sent a link before, which explained this circumstances but has given no proof answer which color Sara's flight was, flight deck stain 21 or the new one which was a darker one ?

Hope someone can give me a answer !

best regards

Chris

I don't have any textual records that state her flight deck color, but I'm going to go with the revised Flight Deck Stain and not the original. While her camouflage design sheet doesn't show any vertical surfaces, the tops of her twin 5"/38 mounts in this photo on her Navsource WWII page closely matches the flight deck color and the design sheet shows those mount sides to be painted in 5-O, which is what the original Flight Deck Stain 21 was matched to. So, the flight deck would match the turret SIDES and not tops if it were the earlier stain.

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Tracy White -Researcher@Large

"Let the evidence guide the research. Do not have a preconceived agenda which will only distort the result."
-Barbara Tuchman

Model Monkey 1936 island and the turret set showed up today.

The island, compared to the partially assembled kit parts



And the turrets:


Very impressive looking.

_________________
Martin

"Tomorrow is the most important thing in life. Comes into us at midnight very clean. It's perfect when it arrives and it puts itself in our hands. It hopes we've learned something from yesterday." John Wayne

Ship Model Gallery