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 Post subject: Thanks, Tracy...
PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2007 9:01 pm 
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Always glad to de-bag a cat. I've been interested in this stuff (turret colors) since the early 1960s, but I only got some of the answers about five years ago. (Turns out that some of the Naval Aviation researchers had this stuff 2-3 decades ago!) I'd planned on wrapping things as one of my retirement projects, and the release of the new Arizona model at Pearl Harbor convinced me to shake a leg. Either I publish soon, or everything I've got will be old news...

Anyhow, I'm dropping some of the artwork materials with Dave Klaus at Meteor Productions tomorrow, visiting Ships' History on Tuesday, and finishing everything else by the end of the month. There should be a small monograph on the subject called Turrets and Tails; Navy Fleet Colors of the 1930s in May or June.

As most of my research is aviation-oriented, I won't have a lot to offer here, but I hope to hang around, just to learn some of the great stuff you guys have come up with.

Cheers,

Dana


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 Post subject: Hurrah!
PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2007 10:08 pm 
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Dana, glad to here you are publishing a book on the subject! I will definitely get that one, being a slingshot Navy fan. Nice to see something get published on the turret top colors too.

Charles Landrum - IPMS Tidewater


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 16, 2007 1:43 pm 
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I should have read page 4 before responding to Gary...........

Dana M Bell wrote:
Hi Gary,

I'm not sure about the ettiquet of post this under Arizona, but here goes...

I’ve been using Larkins for most of my ship assignment data, but I hope to get some more-detailed primary data in the next couple of days. You managed to select the one date where I’ve got the most confusion on San Francisco, but here’s what I do know:

In July 1935, San Francisco was in CRUDIVSIX (VS-11) and would have used green for the forward turrets and black for the after turret - if the turrets were color coded at that time.

By July 1936, SF was flag of CRUDIVEIGHT (VS-14S). I’ve nothing yet on this unit, but if the turrets were painted, the after turret would have used red.

By 1937, SF was flag of CRUDIVSEVEN (initially VS-12S, VCS-7 on 1 July 1937). Forward turrets were a green stripe, after turret used red (generally a red disc at this time).

In 1940, SF moved to back to CRUDIVSIX (VCS-6), which by this time was using a single black stripe on the forward turret; SF would probably have used black on the after turret, but I need to confirm this.

That probably doesn’t help much. I’ll see what turns up in the next few days, especially for the assignments in 1936. I’ve not yet turned any documentation on turret numbers, though most appear to have been used in 1934 and 1935; I suspect they were often in divisional colors.

Cheers,

Dana
(The book will be available on line from Meteor Productions - I'll make sure that details and a review copy surface here.)

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 16, 2007 4:13 pm 
Hi Guys,
"...to 5-S or not to 5-S........."
Last night; in a continuing 1/700 Dragon Arizona kit build, I applied my first coat of Testors Acryl 5-S.
Looks a lot like the Flight Deck Stain 21...at first glance.
I am using this color in light of recent, "new information". This is one of the reasons I have chosen to build the Arizona. I have had a few, "light", discussions with Tracy about Arizona, and I then decided to build her. I am able to finish a 1/700 ship in about 1/3 the time it takes me to build a 1/350; so this is my reason for choosing 1/700.
I will post some pics of little consequence soon.
The kit:
Dragon has lately tried to re-invent some of their ships kits with additional, "newer", details, and the Arizona is one such kit. I am using the Arizona kit prior to the most recent, "Premium Edition", release. I don't know how old this kit is, but it looks okay to me. The biggest problem to date, the three piece deck arrangement. I had to insert .010" strips in numerous locations to fill the gaps. Not so funny. Worse yet.............it is STILL quite visible. I primered the deck areas filled in, and it still shows. :lol_3: Enough time spent. Onward!
The superstructure is coming along, but I was unable to use the finished model on the sides of the box to refer for mast alignment reference, as the mast arrangement is wacked-out-of-alignment. Why did'nt Dragon have a modeler build the "box" model with more care?
No problem here, as the hobby shop I work at part time has the Stillwell book on Arizona available on the consignment shelf. I have confirmed the mast positions.
Blue huh? 5-S huh?
Was the very popular image seen of Arizona in drydock from November 1941 supposed to be 5-S? Film quality etc. etc. aside, still looks very...very...dark to me.
I went with 5-S anyhooo.
Decks are painted with Floquil, "Mud", a railroad color and lightened a little with Reefer White. The upperworks will be 5-L lightened with white too.
Tony


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 16, 2007 7:53 pm 
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Anonymous aka Tony Bunch wrote:
Blue huh? 5-S huh?
Was the very popular image seen of Arizona in drydock from November 1941 supposed to be 5-S? Film quality etc. etc. aside, still looks very...very...dark to me.


The piece of Enterprise Ron found that had fresh 5-D on it had a munsell value that was DARKER than BLACK. Compared to that the photos of the ships @ Pearl have just got to be showing ships in 5-S. Otherwise there'd be a lot of "black hole" shots on the freshly-painted ships.

By the way, I'll be splitting the San Fran stuff out here in a bit.. not sure where we'll put it yet.

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 Post subject: 5-S pics to look at...
PostPosted: Mon Apr 16, 2007 9:48 pm 
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Location: Santee, CA
Hi Guys,
Here are some pics of Arizona today....
Sub-assemblies so far painted......
Image
Image
The forecastle seams still visible.....
Image
The stern quarterdeck seamwork is visible.......
Image
I am going to buy the Stillwell book on Arizona, as this book is quite useful; for the historian and modeler alike.
Thanks guys, and I'll try to make the future posts a little more exciting.
BTW, this model will be on an,"ocean", type display base with an OS2U flying overhead...no doubt attached to the Arizona.
Tony

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Last edited by Tony Bunch on Mon May 07, 2007 10:26 am, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2007 8:57 am 
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Location: Hilliard, Ohio
ImageHi Guys,

Thought you all may like this painting I just got of the Arizona.


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PostPosted: Tue May 08, 2007 8:39 pm 
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Just found out yesterday that Eduard has just released two photo etched detail sets for USS Arizona in 1/350 scale. One contains the railings, which in my opinion does not add anything to what has already been done in other sets. But the other set seems to be a real winner! At least 50% of it are parts not done by any of the other manufacturers. The best part of it are all the side walls with portholes for the decks and the superstructure. This will cover/replace those ugly parts of the kit with the joint halfway up the walls and oversized, and incorrectly placed, portholes. In addition to that the set also contains new platforms for the masts, including all the supporting girders underneath, a lot of extra details for the ship's boats including supports for stacking them, etc. Check Eduard's website, http://www.eduard.cz/ , and click on the May Newsletter. The 10-page instructions for the set is available on the site. It certainly looks like this set will go a long way of correcting most of the worst areas of the Banner kit. As you can probably guess, I have already ordered this set! :big_grin:

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PostPosted: Tue May 08, 2007 9:48 pm 
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Sten Ekedahl wrote:
Just found out yesterday that Eduard has just released two photo etched detail sets for USS Arizona in 1/350 scale. One contains the railings, which in my opinion does not add anything to what has already been done in other sets. But the other set seems to be a real winner! At least 50% of it are parts not done by any of the other manufacturers. The best part of it are all the side walls with portholes for the decks and the superstructure. This will cover/replace those ugly parts of the kit with the joint halfway up the walls and oversized, and incorrectly placed, portholes. In addition to that the set also contains new platforms for the masts, including all the supporting girders underneath, a lot of extra details for the ship's boats including supports for stacking them, etc. Check Eduard's website, http://www.eduard.cz/ , and click on the May Newsletter. The 10-page instructions for the set is available on the site. It certainly looks like this set will go a long way of correcting most of the worst areas of the Banner kit. As you can probably guess, I have already ordered this set! :big_grin:


OOOOOOH pretty! Looks like it doesnt just fix some problems, but completely replaces them (fighting tops for one) Beautiful. Now I should start collecting everything for a brand new 1/350 build, now with all these beautiful aftermarket pieces.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri May 11, 2007 10:32 pm 
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Just returned this afternoon from the Arizona memorial, and just have to say congrats Don Preul on an absolutely beautiful model!!

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 Post subject: RE: Pearl Harbor Model
PostPosted: Sat May 12, 2007 11:02 pm 
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Image

Hi all-
I am hoping this picture works. Don's model was FANTASTIC! I have more photos but have been wrestling with my photo editors to get one a decent size. Again I hope it works and will post more soon if this goes well.
Jeff


Last edited by Seeling on Sat May 12, 2007 11:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sat May 12, 2007 11:11 pm 
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Seeling's pic:

Edit: took out the image, as Seeling's got it figured =)

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Last edited by Timmy C on Sat May 12, 2007 11:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: RE: My pics
PostPosted: Sat May 12, 2007 11:17 pm 
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Yahoo! I finally made it all the way through. I had to modify it and resubmit but it made it. Thanks to Timmy C who also helped out when I could not make it work. Now I will have to start downsizing the rest of the photos since that one was my "test" pic. The photos are from late March - sorry it has taken so long to post.
Jeff


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 Post subject: Eduard PE set
PostPosted: Sun May 13, 2007 7:44 am 
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Eduard ahs just released a new 1/350 set for the Arizona. Has any body seen a review or seen the set in person?

Thanks

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PostPosted: Sun May 13, 2007 8:25 am 
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Dick,

Scroll up to see Sten's link a few posts above.

I haven't see a review yet, but the set on Eduard's site looks incredible.

Bob


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PostPosted: Sun May 13, 2007 9:28 am 
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Here's the direct link.

I'm actually disappointed in their set. I will probably pick one up, but there's plenty they could have done better. For instance, while having a replacement set of fighting tops is nice, they're over simplified. The open windows should have some framing texture and there were hatches on the tops that they missed.. plus openings into the fighting tops they could have left as open holes.

They give you replacement superstructure bulkheads but nothing for the 5"/51 broadside guns that were in open casemates, not turrets as the kit depicts them. It's like they studied SOME aspects of the ship but not others. At this point I would rate it as a nice addition, but middle of the road as far as an accuracy scale goes.

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"Let the evidence guide the research. Do not have a preconceived agenda which will only distort the result."
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Last edited by Tracy White on Sun May 13, 2007 9:39 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Eduard PE set
PostPosted: Sun May 13, 2007 9:31 am 
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Elvis:

I have seen the pictures in their site and I have to agree with you it looks stunning. I already have the GMM set and I was thinking about combining them. I really like GMM railing, and doors among som other items as well. But Eduard splinter shields are over tht top and I would love to use them.

And since my buddy Tony Bunch is building her as well I want to see if I could finish her before Lighting Tony finishes his :heh:
I picked up the Stillwell book on her at our IPMs show this past Feburary for only 25 bucks!!

See ya guys

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PostPosted: Sun May 13, 2007 11:40 am 
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Hi Guys,
Hi Dick,
Go get em!
I see a very nice 1/350 Arizona on the horizon!
My 1/700 Az is stalled......life is interfering!
Be well Gents, Tony

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PostPosted: Sun May 13, 2007 5:45 pm 
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Quote:
I have seen the pictures in their site and I have to agree with you it looks stunning. I already have the GMM set and I was thinking about combining them. I really like GMM railing, and doors among som other items as well. But Eduard splinter shields are over tht top and I would love to use them.


Dick,

After reading Tracy's take, I looked closer and agree with the lack of some relief etching, like on the fighting top windows.

I already have the WEM ultimate Arizona set. I think I'm going to get this set to compliment it. I'm planning on adding a wooden deck, and I like some of the deck PE Eduard has in their set, along with the PE bulkheads to cover the rather ugly MHM joins.

Tracy,

Heard anything new on the rumored 5"/51's that L'Arsenal was supposedly working on?

Bob


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 Post subject: Eduard PE set
PostPosted: Sun May 13, 2007 5:58 pm 
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Elvis:

I agree with you as well. I too gave it another hard look and I will use GMM as the main set.

I will for one thing not use Eduards chain as it is all wrong. I will use regular chain, but I will use a plier to crimo down in the chain to get a more elipircal shape. I know one fellow who adds bits of plastic to the middle of each link to reallt get teh proper look.

I hope to get started in a couple of months on her. I will keep you all posted.

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