The Ship Model Forum

The Ship Modelers Source
It is currently Thu Mar 28, 2024 3:28 am

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 306 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 ... 16  Next
Author Message
PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2008 11:17 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Dec 09, 2006 6:12 pm
Posts: 1173
Location: campbell river.b.c canada
hope this is the right place to talk about jean bart,richelieu w.w 2 vintage.i am thinking about starting to build jean bart in 1/192 or1/200 scale.does anyone know where i could find plans,poto-etch,fittings etc etc.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2008 1:45 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2005 1:40 pm
Posts: 8159
Location: New Jersey
With the new Trumpeter kits hitting the market, I thought it appropriate to split Russ' post out into it's own thread.

Please chime in if I've missed anything, here's a partial list of kits of these fine looking ships, some of which I took from Rajen's List.

1/400 Heller Jean Bart
1/400 Heller Richelieu

1/700 HP Jean Bart
1/700 HP Richelieu
1/700 High Mold Richelieu
1/700 Trumpeter Richelieu

1/800 Del Jean Bart
1/800 Del Richelieu

A 1/700 Jean Bart has also been announced by Trumpeter, as has a 1/350 Richelieu. While I can't recall if the 1/350 Jean Bart has been announced, I imagine one would be forthcoming.

Here's some of the Richelieu and Jean Bart models on this site:
Peter O'Donnell's 1/400 Heller Richelieu

Roger Torgeson's 1/400 Heller Richelieu

Christoph Mentzel's 1/700 High Mold Richelieu and in another scheme here

Pierre Fourneau's 1/400 Heller Richelieu

Anthony Tow's 1/400 Heller Richelieu

_________________
Martin

"Tomorrow is the most important thing in life. Comes into us at midnight very clean. It's perfect when it arrives and it puts itself in our hands. It hopes we've learned something from yesterday." John Wayne

Ship Model Gallery


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2008 1:48 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2005 1:40 pm
Posts: 8159
Location: New Jersey
More...

Song Jung Gun's 1/200 Scratchbuilt Richelieu

Kjetil Lindahl's 1/400 Heller Richelieu

Claudio Matteini's 1/700 High Mold Richelieu

Joe Cano's 1/400 Heller Richelieu

Didier Michel's 1/400 Heller Richelieu

Bernd Villhauer's 1/400 Heller Jean Bart

Sebastien Berti's 1/400 Heller Jean Bart

Angeleye's WIP of the 1/700 Trumpeter Richelieu

_________________
Martin

"Tomorrow is the most important thing in life. Comes into us at midnight very clean. It's perfect when it arrives and it puts itself in our hands. It hopes we've learned something from yesterday." John Wayne

Ship Model Gallery


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2008 5:50 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Dec 09, 2006 6:12 pm
Posts: 1173
Location: campbell river.b.c canada
thanks for adding a link for jean bart,richelieu,i am torn between one or other,like looks of jean bart 1949 best so far,but richelieus rebuild in 1943 has u.s. a.a guns which are available from h.r fittings.also am wundering if she also had u.s type fire contol and radar


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2008 6:45 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Aug 26, 2005 6:53 am
Posts: 542
Location: France
A nice drawing of Jean Bart

Image



Jef :wave_1:

_________________
Current 1/700 WL
HMS Repulse


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2008 2:23 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Dec 20, 2006 11:18 pm
Posts: 282
Location: Snohomish WA USA
That is a NICE CG drawing of Jean Bart. I had no idea of her armament mix... IMHO she is better looking than her sister. And Gascogne too...

_________________
Gerard>
Snohomish, WA USA
If you don't know the definition of erudite, you're not.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2008 4:31 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Dec 05, 2007 12:37 pm
Posts: 1111
Location: Smith's Falls, Canada
So am I correct in assuming then that the Jean Bart had additional heavy AA on her broadside, what appears to be double the quantity on Richelieu? I guess when I do my work on the Germanized version, it will require work, notably in the lighter AA, to properly redesign it, since the 37mm guns would be smaller than the 40mm positions, and conversely, the 20mm would be larger.

_________________
Die Panzerschiffe - Putting the Heavy in Heavy Cruiser since 1940.

It's not Overkill, it's Insurance.

If you think my plastic is crazy, check out my Line Art!
http://s37.photobucket.com/albums/e58/S ... %20Images/


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2008 9:42 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Dec 09, 2006 6:12 pm
Posts: 1173
Location: campbell river.b.c canada
when richelieu went to the usa she had american qaud 40,s and 20 mm,s added.jean bart
in 1949 had100mm,s and57 mm,s plus 20mm,s
still looking for plans for j.b. found some on internet,from french defence ministry but all in french. also they listed at 1/100 but is that metric or feet and inches.
would appreciate any leads on 1/192 or 1/200 plans 1/192 would be best


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2008 9:37 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Dec 09, 2006 6:12 pm
Posts: 1173
Location: campbell river.b.c canada
heres a cool pic of jean bart and richelieu together
Image


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2008 2:11 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2008 2:44 am
Posts: 17
Location: Germany
The computer images of Jean Bart are very nice but... hate to say it again - wrong! Jean Bart was fitted with torpedo bulges and had an increased witdh at the waterline - 3 meters more than Richelieu. The bulge is hard to spot on photos because it blends well with the hull contours but it is still a feature that cannot be neglected. I am really curious whether Trumpeter have included this major "detail" in their recent 1/700 model.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2008 2:33 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2005 1:21 pm
Posts: 3374
Location: equidistant to everywhere
Actually, it's very hard to tell if the images are wrong because the way Jean Bart's new torpedo defenses are designed and the angle of the CG drawing. Jean Bart's new torpedo defenses are not an external add-on bulge like most retrofitted torpedo bulges. Instead the French actually dismantled the original internal torpedo defense of Jean Bart, and built a new, deeper internal torpedo defense system in its place by pushing the underwater sides of the ship outwards. So the new defense is completely integrated into the internal structure of the ship, faired smoothly into the side of the ship, and there are no easily detectable seams where the original lines of the ship ends and modified sides begins. The above water hull line of Jean Bart is essentially unaltered and identical to Richelieu's. Starting from the waterline, the sides of Jean Bart's hull smoothly turns outwards to provide the additional depth. The sides of Richelieu continues straight down.

The image of the Richelieu, on the left, certainly seems to show the correct rectangular hull section midships. The image of Jean Bart, on the right, is at a bad angle for seeing whether the model incorporated the new expanded underwater sides.

_________________
Assessing the impact of new area rug under modeling table.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2008 12:45 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Oct 28, 2007 11:30 pm
Posts: 346
I disagree,you can see the bulges above the waterline.It's subtle but visible in photographs.Jean Bart has a different look to her hull sides because of it.At Netmarine you can see pictures of Jean Bart with the bulges visible above the waterline.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 3:16 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Oct 15, 2006 8:27 am
Posts: 160
Location: Northern Va. USA
I can't tell by the foggy pictures I've found but if Iwanted to make the Jean Bart as she was when attacked by U.S. forces during Op. Torch, would I want the Trumpeter Jean Bart(1950) or the Richilieau kit?

_________________
So many models... So little time...


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 3:28 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Dec 09, 2006 6:12 pm
Posts: 1173
Location: campbell river.b.c canada
hey guess guess what guys ,i think i got it fiqured out,on the french navy site found good stuff

http://www.servicehistorique.sga.defens ... php?id=227 all in french but pretty darn good.most plans in 1/100 i am building in 1/192,but with a lot of head scrathing and lots of printer paper i got a nice set of hull drawings in 1/192.on my printer i went to 52% and the size came out to lenth of 50.6", and beam of7".when you add 1/8" all around for sheeting in comes to lenght 813.6ft and beam of116ft over the bulges
the web site has lots of drawings :smallsmile: very nice :thumbs_up_1:


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 3:34 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Dec 09, 2006 6:12 pm
Posts: 1173
Location: campbell river.b.c canada
in op. torch jean bart had no bulges, they were added during her 1946-49 rebuild,so if one wanted to model her as 1942 you would use richilieu.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 4:43 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Oct 15, 2006 8:27 am
Posts: 160
Location: Northern Va. USA
Thanks Russ, now just to pick the kit...

_________________
So many models... So little time...


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 6:45 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Dec 09, 2006 6:12 pm
Posts: 1173
Location: campbell river.b.c canada
heres a picture of plans done on my printer 20 sheets of paper,underneath is massachusetts scratch built 1/192 scale
Image]


Last edited by russclark on Thu Feb 28, 2008 11:18 am, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 10:57 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2005 1:21 pm
Posts: 3374
Location: equidistant to everywhere
Jeffcsr wrote:
I can't tell by the foggy pictures I've found but if Iwanted to make the Jean Bart as she was when attacked by U.S. forces during Op. Torch, would I want the Trumpeter Jean Bart(1950) or the Richilieau kit?



The Richelieu. Besides the bulge, In 1942 Jean Bart's tower bridge design was also nearly identical to Richelieu's. Only after the war was her tower bridge was drastically truncated to the low squat design you see in the computer rendering.

BTW, in 1942 Jean Bart was far from complete, almost all her secondary armaments were missing, her B turret had no roof and no guns, and her directors on top of her tower bridge were also largely missing, and the internal communication tube was exposed. In addition she had a float plane hanger on the fantail as per her original design. So you will have a lot of scratch building to do.

_________________
Assessing the impact of new area rug under modeling table.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 10:59 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2005 1:21 pm
Posts: 3374
Location: equidistant to everywhere
When the Richelieu comes out in 1/350, I intend to back date that all the way to the original 1939 design of the ship, which featured 2 more wing 6" turrets midship, and a aircraft hanger in the back.

_________________
Assessing the impact of new area rug under modeling table.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Thu Feb 28, 2008 11:28 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Dec 09, 2006 6:12 pm
Posts: 1173
Location: campbell river.b.c canada
i have started to build jean bart in 1/192 ,i was wondering if there would be any intrest in me posting my progress on to build board.Image


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 306 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 ... 16  Next

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 52 guests


You can post new topics in this forum
You can reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group