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PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2018 7:54 pm 
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BB63Missouri wrote:
In my version of the plan handbook, the paper version, I think the plan view may be incorrectly drawn. It shoes the Infra Red Device with the half circle facing the ship and the flat portion facing out. The disc version of the plan book may be different, I don't know as I have not seen this version. Looking at the photos it seems to me the semi-circular portion should be facing out. The light pattern I think would be 5 lights, one at the top, 2 in the middle and 3 at the bottom. Mounted on a semi-circular face this pattern would be visible through 180 degrees I think.




There are 6 lamps on the X2A. See page 33 of the following digitized document:

https://www.scribd.com/document/30156212/Naval-Combat-Operations-Dec-1945

While the mounting may be somewhat improvised and differ from ship to ship, I see no clear evidence that the X2A is different between ships.

I believe the early IR signaling devises actually uses a normal visible light bulb as source, and use a ceremic IR pass filter in front of the bulb to block visible light and let through IR through. It must have been quite inefficient. The X-2A unit with 6 separate lamps in a small fridge sized metal housing must have been quite large and cumbersome. It seems clear that some time after the war, the X-2A were superseded by much smaller Omni-directional dome light.

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2018 9:49 pm 
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After looking over the print version of the Plan Book I tend to agree with BB63MO in that the plan view is not completely correct and should be shown with the round beacon housing facing OUT not IN.

Thanks Chuck for the link to the Nancy Hanks article (which you can Snip and save as a .jpg, BTW) which gives a bit more detail as to the development of this type of equipment. I think we are in agreement that the prototypes of this equipment as used on a few of the BB's and perhaps one CB as well as cruisers, were still being developed and a "standard" location and mounting framework was yet to be decided upon. It's quite interesting to note that NORTH CAROLINA's units were set quite far out from the upper conning tower while WASHINGTON's and MISSIOURI's were mounted fairly close in - if the intent was for actual 360° visability for both transmission and reception, then I would think that BB-55's mounting would have become the "std" for that particular model. Having NOT found any photographic proof that any of the SDAK class BB's or any of the other IOWAs carried this equipment, it could be that by 1945 the developement by the vendors (RCA and others) had surpassed the X2A design and Navy brass simply decided to not spend more money outfitting more ships with an outdated model.

I'm curious now as to how far in real terms these IR lamps could be detected and what type of device was used for receiving - was it simply a special set of goggles worn my SMs on the receiving ship? Or did I miss something in the mentioned article?

You (Chuck) mention the size/weight of these devices with the 6 lamps - yes, this early electronic equipment was (certainly by today's stds.) quite bulky and heavy. Keeping in mind that electronics in general was still in it's infancy back then, the housings were massive. When I was serving in NEW JERSEY I was tasked with removing old gear from the after main director tower (below the optical rangefinder/RADAR unit) in order to make space for a personnel storage area. We removed and deep 6'd a number of extremely heavy radio sets (these weighed each over 150 lb. and req'd 2 men to carry them) that were located there. The comparable equipment today is probably less than 25 lbs and can sit in the space of a desktop computer box. Those old multi-tube radio Xmtrs & Rcvrs were the Cat's meow in their day, but development soon made them obsolete. But, this is true of all things mechanical - they are refined, compacted, and with each improvement, a smaller, lighter footprint.


Hank

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Builder's yard:
USS PENNSYLVANIA (BB-38) Late '40 1:200
USS STODDARD (DD-566) 66-68 1:144
Finished:
USS NEW JERSEY (BB-62) 67-69 1:200
USN Sloop/Ship PEACOCK (1813) 1:48
ROYAL CAROLINE (1748) 1:47
AVS (1768) 1:48


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 26, 2018 12:16 am 
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BB62vet wrote:
1945 -
Attachment:
BB-63 Conning Twr 1945_1.JPG


Hope this helps,


Is this the Missouri? Did the Missouri ever carry the sk-1 radar? I thought she was completed with SK-2?

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 26, 2018 3:38 am 
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The X2A system was for large ships only.
In the description of the article Chuck has linked to it states that the unit has a signalling range of 5 miles but a greater range for identification. Each beacon utilises 6 Nancy units, so arranged as to cover 180 degrees of azimuth. Each beacon weighed over 250 pounds. The procedure used for the X2A is outlined in chapter 24 of Pac 70 (B) which also contains all Nancy doctrine.
Just a few points I picked up from a very interesting article.
Hope this helps as it will for me when I get to build these for my own model.
David


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 26, 2018 6:47 am 
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Chuck wrote:
Quote:
Is this the Missouri? Did the Missouri ever carry the sk-1 radar? I thought she was completed with SK-2?


Here's a somewhat clearer photo of BB-63 in May 1945 (clip from NARA #80-G-470349) - as listed in NavSource
Attachment:
BB-63 Conning Twr 1945_2.JPG
BB-63 Conning Twr 1945_2.JPG [ 64.45 KiB | Viewed 796 times ]
.
I myself am suspicious of the listed date - I'm not sure when BB-63 was carrying this particular RADAR suite on her foremast.

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Builder's yard:
USS PENNSYLVANIA (BB-38) Late '40 1:200
USS STODDARD (DD-566) 66-68 1:144
Finished:
USS NEW JERSEY (BB-62) 67-69 1:200
USN Sloop/Ship PEACOCK (1813) 1:48
ROYAL CAROLINE (1748) 1:47
AVS (1768) 1:48


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 Post subject: NJ 20mm Twin Mounts
PostPosted: Fri Oct 26, 2018 1:28 pm 
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Does anyone know when the NJ had 20mm twin mounts. There was a pair mounted at the bow during the ship's first trip to Korea (when all other 20mm mounts were gone). By the second trip, the bulwark had been replaced with the one seen today and those mounts were gone.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 26, 2018 2:10 pm 
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BB62vet wrote:
Chuck wrote:
Quote:
Is this the Missouri? Did the Missouri ever carry the sk-1 radar? I thought she was completed with SK-2?


Here's a somewhat clearer photo of BB-63 in May 1945 (clip from NARA #80-G-470349) - as listed in NavSource
Attachment:
BB-63 Conning Twr 1945_2.JPG
.
I myself am suspicious of the listed date - I'm not sure when BB-63 was carrying this particular RADAR suite on her foremast.


I believe that's a misidentification of the ship itself - the features fit Wisconsin better, which did have both the SK-1 radar and the 40mm on Turret II. Looking through the other Navsource photos of Wisconsin, you can see the beacons.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 26, 2018 4:49 pm 
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Timmy C - You'd man!!! That's (miss-id of BB63 by NavSource) the problem. Those photos are of WISCONSIN not MO. So, we now know that BB-64 also had the IR Beacons.

Good catch - always helps to have additional eyes on the target!!!


Hank

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HMS III
Mocksville, NC
BB62 vet 68-69

Builder's yard:
USS PENNSYLVANIA (BB-38) Late '40 1:200
USS STODDARD (DD-566) 66-68 1:144
Finished:
USS NEW JERSEY (BB-62) 67-69 1:200
USN Sloop/Ship PEACOCK (1813) 1:48
ROYAL CAROLINE (1748) 1:47
AVS (1768) 1:48


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2018 12:32 pm 
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On the Missouri, there were 3 sets of fighting lights. One is on level 11 just under the Mk38 Director, the second on level 08 outboard of the elevated conning station, and the third on level 05 on the splinter shield for the bofor mount. The 3 sets of light form a vertical line. Within each set 3 separate lamps are also arranged in a vertical column.

I understand fighting lights are 2 blue over 1 white. Does that mean the top 2 sets were blue and the bottom set white? Or are the three lamps in each set blue - blue - white?

Also, does anyone know how the fighting lights are used?

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 1:47 pm 
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Chuck:

My understanding of the use of fighting lights was that the order of the colors was variable, set for a particular operation. Useful for IFF type purposes when flashed at night. WWII aircraft also used a similar system on occasion.

Cheers: T


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 31, 2018 1:51 am 
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What’s the best PE set for the Meng 1/700 Missouri kit?

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 02, 2018 1:20 am 
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Does anyone make a PE set for the 1/700 Trumpeter 1991 Missouri that includes the bulkhead details for the 01 and 02 level bulkheads, which appear to be smooth on the kit?

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 03, 2018 3:20 pm 
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Would the wire antenna and stays and guy wires for the masts be painted in the same color as superstructure or left in something like gun metal?

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 04, 2018 2:17 pm 
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Standing rigging is not generally painted.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2018 4:00 am 
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I looked on Shapeways but didn’t see them. Didn’t someone make some 3D printed parts for the 1/700 Iowa kits? I remember a rounded bridge for the 1943 New Jersey, and a correct O-10/O-11 level housing for the 1980’s Iowa, Missouri, and Wisconsin.....

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2018 7:24 am 
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a few weeks ago...I had my parents on visite (they live in Belgium and me in Switzerland)..and they brought an USS Iowa old kit I made...some 40 years ago...not to my today standard and under a big load of dust.
so I decided to check on her today...washed her completely(some paint came of) ...as she doesn't look so bad in proportions... I started to think...what if I re-do this...but needly
state as now:
first...the paint...well as a kid you make silly choices ...brilliant paint for a warship...pfff..awell...then ..red superstructure and silver main guns...man what was I thinking of...
mesuring her she is 50cm so I suppose its a 1/550 scale.
1 secondairy gun missing...2 quadrupple AA guns also missing
before I start a new USS IOWA building topic I wanted some info about what kit this might be and how the aftermarket for this would be...joined you see her together with my newly bought 1/400 Kangnam USS Missouri.

all input are welcome


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2018 8:57 am 
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Does anyone know if there are no signal flags flying, where do the signal halyards tie off on?

The signal flag locker on either side of foreword funnel has a horizontal polished brass rail on the rear. Is this where the halyards tie to?

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2018 1:52 pm 
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Triumph68 wrote:
a few weeks ago...I had my parents on visite (they live in Belgium and me in Switzerland)..and they brought an USS Iowa old kit I made...some 40 years ago...not to my today standard and under a big load of dust.
so I decided to check on her today...washed her completely(some paint came of) ...as she doesn't look so bad in proportions... I started to think...what if I re-do this...but needly
state as now:
first...the paint...well as a kid you make silly choices ...brilliant paint for a warship...pfff..awell...then ..red superstructure and silver main guns...man what was I thinking of...
mesuring her she is 50cm so I suppose its a 1/550 scale.
1 secondairy gun missing...2 quadrupple AA guns also missing
before I start a new USS IOWA building topic I wanted some info about what kit this might be and how the aftermarket for this would be...joined you see her together with my newly bought 1/400 Kangnam USS Missouri.

all input are welcome

Looks like the classic Revell 1/535 Missouri. The hull is pretty distinctive.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2018 3:58 pm 
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Timmy C wrote:
Triumph68 wrote:
a few weeks ago...I had my parents on visite (they live in Belgium and me in Switzerland)..and they brought an USS Iowa old kit I made...some 40 years ago...not to my today standard and under a big load of dust.
so I decided to check on her today...washed her completely(some paint came of) ...as she doesn't look so bad in proportions... I started to think...what if I re-do this...but needly
state as now:
first...the paint...well as a kid you make silly choices ...brilliant paint for a warship...pfff..awell...then ..red superstructure and silver main guns...man what was I thinking of...
mesuring her she is 50cm so I suppose its a 1/550 scale.
1 secondairy gun missing...2 quadrupple AA guns also missing
before I start a new USS IOWA building topic I wanted some info about what kit this might be and how the aftermarket for this would be...joined you see her together with my newly bought 1/400 Kangnam USS Missouri.

all input are welcome

Looks like the classic Revell 1/535 Missouri. The hull is pretty distinctive.

yep it is , txs ...actualy its the 1979 Iowa version of that kit

your input helped me searching, decided to buy the tom's Modelworks railings, radars ...gonna re-do her

darn...if you buy both guns (5" and Main) plus the gun directors from shapeways...its close to 50 dollars....thats crazy
looks like...gonna have to scratch build


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2018 6:06 pm 
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Signal Halyards? Several feet forward of the flag bags there is a rail, much like a hitching post in an old west town.


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