The Ship Model Forum

The Ship Modelers Source
It is currently Thu Nov 26, 2020 2:34 am

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 369 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15 ... 19  Next
Author Message
PostPosted: Tue Jul 10, 2012 2:50 pm 
In my humble opinion, unless you're obsessed with accuracy (or you're building on commission for a museum or collector), the important thing is to enjoy building the kit. That's the reason 99.9% of us get into this pastime in the first place.

I speak from experience when I say that there is no actual end to scale accuracy. It is literally impossible to build a 100% scale model of a particular ship (or anything else, for that matter, but especially something as complex as a warship). You could spend a lifetime on a single model, and on your deathbed, still be wondering if you got the exact number of portholes where they are supposed to be, and while you're at it, what about the hinges on the portholes?

If you want to simply enjoy building a model of a warship from a kit, then just build it out of the box. Finish the thing, and proudly display it. Would a naval historian be impressed with its accuracy? Probably not, but how many of those do you have hanging around your house?

If, after you finish it, you feel like taking your model building to the next level, then do your research, consider buying aftermarket parts and photo etched details.

My 2 cents, for what they're worth.

Rob


Top
  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Sat Jul 21, 2012 7:05 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Jan 26, 2005 10:12 pm
Posts: 1234
Location: Up The Street From Sam Wilson's House
Rob Wood wrote:
In my humble opinion, unless you're obsessed with accuracy (or you're building on commission for a museum or collector), the important thing is to enjoy building the kit. That's the reason 99.9% of us get into this pastime in the first place.

I speak from experience when I say that there is no actual end to scale accuracy. It is literally impossible to build a 100% scale model of a particular ship (or anything else, for that matter, but especially something as complex as a warship). You could spend a lifetime on a single model, and on your deathbed, still be wondering if you got the exact number of portholes where they are supposed to be, and while you're at it, what about the hinges on the portholes?

If you want to simply enjoy building a model of a warship from a kit, then just build it out of the box. Finish the thing, and proudly display it. Would a naval historian be impressed with its accuracy? Probably not, but how many of those do you have hanging around your house?

If, after you finish it, you feel like taking your model building to the next level, then do your research, consider buying aftermarket parts and photo etched details.

My 2 cents, for what they're worth.

Rob


Oh I know and understand that. I always add PE railings, inclined ladders, radar, to my models. I know no model will ever be 100% accurate, especially 1/350 scale and smaller. And I don't try to attain 100% accuracy, as I feel its more or less pointless for the reasons you stated. I'm content to have a model thats 85% accurate, or higher if it doesn't mean having to cut away 1/3 of the kit and replace it. My question about the kit was more or less about whether aside from adding PE rails, ladders, radar, does it really need one of those super detail sets that involve replacing whole areas of the kit, or are these sets just for those that want to put in as much brass as possible, even if it isn't really needed?

_________________
Thomas E. Johnson

http://www.youtube.com/user/ThomasEJohnson


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Sun Jul 22, 2012 6:59 am 
Offline

Joined: Mon Apr 18, 2011 1:30 pm
Posts: 214
The sets a giving modeler an option to create a desired level of representation.
The modeler chooses which parts are better suited for his representation of the real thing.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Tue Aug 07, 2012 6:29 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2010 3:05 pm
Posts: 384
I am building Prinz @ Cerberus and it looks like from the photo on page 29 of WP21 that the searchlight covers are still in place. Were these now covering the quad 20's or were the searchlights still mounted, or am I seeing things?


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Wed Aug 08, 2012 2:04 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jan 05, 2007 8:31 pm
Posts: 892
Location: Flensburg, Germany
Doesn't make mch sense to cover the AA guns in an RAF infested area, eh? The searchlights are still in place. The quads came later, I think during the follow-up refit at Kiel, before going to Norway. For the quads the platforms had to be enlarged (or maybe they put on completely new ones).

Happy modelling ~ Olaf!


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Wed Aug 08, 2012 8:58 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Aug 06, 2007 6:29 pm
Posts: 1816
After PE was torpedoed and lost her stern, she was repainted to mimic the Hipper before she returned for repairs. In the one photo I have seen in that scheme, she still had the domes. The quad 20's must have come after Norway.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Wed Aug 08, 2012 9:35 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Aug 19, 2010 11:39 am
Posts: 2025
Location: Harlan, Kentucky, U.S.A.
Rob Wood wrote:
In my humble opinion, unless you're obsessed with accuracy (or you're building on commission for a museum or collector), the important thing is to enjoy building the kit. That's the reason 99.9% of us get into this pastime in the first place.

I speak from experience when I say that there is no actual end to scale accuracy. It is literally impossible to build a 100% scale model of a particular ship (or anything else, for that matter, but especially something as complex as a warship). You could spend a lifetime on a single model, and on your deathbed, still be wondering if you got the exact number of portholes where they are supposed to be, and while you're at it, what about the hinges on the portholes?

If you want to simply enjoy building a model of a warship from a kit, then just build it out of the box. Finish the thing, and proudly display it. Would a naval historian be impressed with its accuracy? Probably not, but how many of those do you have hanging around your house?

If, after you finish it, you feel like taking your model building to the next level, then do your research, consider buying aftermarket parts and photo etched details.

My 2 cents, for what they're worth.

Rob


Ron, I totally agree with your statements on this point. 100% accuracy is simply unattainable in any kit unless you have fantastic scratch building skills and are willing to put a tremendous amount of time into research and into building your kit. Like you, I'm content to get a reasonable representation of the subject that I'm modeling.
Like you, I do this for fun and relaxation and I find that stressing over every little detail simply sucks the fun and enjoyment out of building for me. As to PE and other after market, I usually get a basic PE set for each kit I'm building and use, of course, the railings, ladders and any other items that my skill level allows me to work with successfully. I long ago came to the realization that my builds are never going to rise to the level of many of the masterpieces we see in the gallery - and that is just fine for me. I do the best job I can with the skills and talent I have and if I feel that I've done my best within my limitations, I'm happy with what I do. As an example, I'm currently working on Italeri's P.T. 593. In a lapse of sanity I bought the LionRoar upgrade set and I've discovered that much of the PE included in it is either well beyond my skill level, or requires more excruciating detail work than I am prepared to put into a kit that builds up very nicely out of the box. So, I use the parts from the upgrade set that I feel I can successfully manipulate and which actually add something to an already nicely detailed kit.

For those that want to produce a result that is as accurate as possible and has all of the after market bells and whistles, I say "go for it, good for you!", but that approach simply isn't for me. I do try to push myself just a bit with each kit to try to improve my skills, but not to the extent of sucking the fun out of what I'm doing. For what it is worth, I display some of my better builds in my office and a lot of my clients do comment on them. For all of that, I've yet to have somebody point out an error in a model for what it is supposed to represent.

I think you are spot on that most of us build for fun and relaxation. Surely our hobby is a big enough tent to allow the "fun and relaxation" builders to have a seat at the table along with the rivet counters.

IMHO,

Bob

_________________
Give me a fast ship, for I would like to get out of harm's way!


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Wed Aug 08, 2012 9:52 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jan 05, 2007 8:31 pm
Posts: 892
Location: Flensburg, Germany
Dick J wrote:
After PE was torpedoed and lost her stern, she was repainted to mimic the Hipper before she returned for repairs. In the one photo I have seen in that scheme, she still had the domes. The quad 20's must have come after Norway.


Yup, you are correct, I was wrong. :thumbs_up_1:

Happy modelling ~ Olaf!


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Wed Aug 08, 2012 10:11 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2010 3:05 pm
Posts: 384
Thanks guys, I can now proceed with zee channel dash Prinz. I was going to retro to the TR kit to the time with Bismark per earlier posts but it occured to me after making many KM ship models with pristine paint jobs, it would be fun to do a real blochy rusty version and use some of the same modeling technics armour and aircrafts guys use. The best examples of pictures of Prinz during this period have come from Eric Leon. I know I have read this elsewhere but how do you get a blochy effect from and air brush? High pressure thick paint, low pressure thin paint, stand back 2 feet?


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Mon Aug 27, 2012 3:33 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Sep 26, 2006 5:15 am
Posts: 600
Location: England
I'm nearly finished my Trumpeter 1/700 Prinz Eugen 1945 and a quick question has arisen. The instructions say she had a swastika on both the bow and stern and that the swastikas were on a white circle background.

Is this correct, if not what would be correct for 1945?

thanks
Mike


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Thu Sep 06, 2012 8:32 am 
Offline

Joined: Mon May 25, 2009 9:37 am
Posts: 27
Thomas and others I am building the 1/350 Prinz and am using the Flyhawk PE set, master barrels for AA and the Pontos deck. (a first for me with these mfg.). I did this with the intention of really immersing myself in a somewhat long term project. The more I build this kit, though, the more I am convinced that it is a well engineered kit and would make a decent build OOB, but the Flyhawk PE really hits on many details that are necessary to produce the majestic qualities of this ship. For example, the numerous port and window covers, the delicacies of the pierced plating and supports of overhead decking as well as the delicate radars. I admit that there are some details in the Flyhawk set which are downright torturous and will not be applied but I have to say I am totally impressed with this set and recommend it, but not for the faint of heart or PE novice.

Above all have fun no matter how you build.

Gil


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Thu Sep 06, 2012 2:22 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jan 05, 2007 8:31 pm
Posts: 892
Location: Flensburg, Germany
baycolony wrote:
Above all have fun no matter how you build.


Well spoken, Gil! :thumbs_up_1:

Happy modelling ~ Olaf!


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Sat Sep 15, 2012 9:00 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2011 9:37 pm
Posts: 42
I am going to make some purchases for my Prinz Eugen 1/350 kit, which I intend to backdate to 1940 or 1941. To note I have to obtain additional spotlights and obtain extra range finders.
I wanted to know whether the headlights in this Veteran set are suitable, and, if I use them, if the difference between the veteran parts and the kit parts would be so substantial as to oblige to replace all spotights with the veteran.

http://www.luckymodel.com/scale.aspx?item_no=VTW35058

Also, I take it the extra range finders I need are the same as part g59. For what it is worth, these are replaced in the lionroar after market set.
I noticed these flak directors (also by Veteran, lower right corner). https://www.whiteensignmodels.com/p/Vet ... 5059/9845/

Do they provide a suitable basis from which to fabricate the range finders I need?

Finaly, I am contemplating purchasing after market decks for 1/350 Bismarck and Prinz Eugen kits I have in my stash. Pontos products are half of what KA Models decks are. What is the difference betwee the two? Which line is to be recommended? Thanks.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2012 12:11 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2010 3:05 pm
Posts: 384
If you can find a Revell/Germany Bismark second hand or on sale, it has the range finder parts and also the funnel hood for the searchlights you will need for PE 1940-41.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2012 4:05 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2011 9:37 pm
Posts: 42
Dan Banks wrote:
If you can find a Revell/Germany Bismark second hand or on sale, it has the range finder parts and also the funnel hood for the searchlights you will need for PE 1940-41.


I know that--I am not dropping 80.00 to hundred on a kit for a couple of parts. I have he Bismarck btw, intend to build them as a pair in their glorios Baltic schemes.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2012 6:28 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2010 3:05 pm
Posts: 384
Your options as of now are to scratchbuild, make resin casts of the Bismark parts, or pay to play.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2012 8:54 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2011 9:37 pm
Posts: 42
Dan Banks wrote:
Your options as of now are to scratchbuild, make resin casts of the Bismark parts, or pay to play.



So the veteran searchlights are NOT suitable? There is a link above to the product in question. ...


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 7:41 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2010 3:05 pm
Posts: 384
Veteran searchlights are the best! I was talking about the 3 and 4 meter rangefinders and the drop down searchlight cover on each side of the funnel. When veteran came out with the KM sets he said he didn't have good enough documentation to do the rangefinders. He made a set for the small ones but not the large ones. Those are the ones that can be gotten from the Bismark kit. I guess another option is to see if anyone would sell or give you just those parts. I am doing a Blucher out of the Hipper kit and making a PE during cerberus, so I am afraid I don't have another set to spare.
Good luck Dan


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 9:49 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2011 9:37 pm
Posts: 42
Oh ok, well that's the most important thing. Did you see the other veterna set, I understand the flak range finders are not the same, my question is whether they offer a suitable basis to make them. I have looked at the parts, and should not be too hard to fabricate. Also, the Lion Roar set provides replaces, so I can dress up the kit parts up to the Lion Roar standard.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 12:18 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2010 3:05 pm
Posts: 384
There is nothing in either Lion Roar or Veteren sets that will help with rangefinders you are talking about. If you have a local hobby store they probably sell evergreen styrene plastic structural shapes and sheets. If you go to picture posts,completed models, DKM Blucher 1940, 1/350 Trumpeter scratch, you will find a picture that might be helpful to build your own. Hope this helps Dan


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 369 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15 ... 19  Next

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 16 guests


You can post new topics in this forum
You can reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group