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PostPosted: Sat Sep 19, 2009 5:28 pm 
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karl wrote:
It was rumored that the kit would come with 3 PE frets, is that the case?


Karl,

The rumor is true! I just got mine in the mail yesterday. It has two frets of railings and one with stairs, ladders, funnel grill and misc. No radar grids, oddly enough. It even has segmented swastikas for the deck and flags! These guys are definitely getting the message!

As usual for Trumpy, however the painting diagrams are suspect. Guess if there was going to be a problem, this is where I'd choose for it to be! Can anyone give us a straight up paint scheme for the ship in 1945 with KM color labels and so forth?

VERY nice kit! RN cruisers anyone?

Michael


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 21, 2009 4:08 pm 
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Blue Devil wrote:
karl wrote:
It was rumored that the kit would come with 3 PE frets, is that the case?


Karl,

The rumor is true! I just got mine in the mail yesterday. It has two frets of railings and one with stairs, ladders, funnel grill and misc. No radar grids, oddly enough. It even has segmented swastikas for the deck and flags! These guys are definitely getting the message!

As usual for Trumpy, however the painting diagrams are suspect. Guess if there was going to be a problem, this is where I'd choose for it to be! Can anyone give us a straight up paint scheme for the ship in 1945 with KM color labels and so forth?

VERY nice kit! RN cruisers anyone?

Michael

Thats cool, I wonder why they decided to do a 1945 version as opposed to the 1941 version


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 21, 2009 4:19 pm 
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karl wrote:
Thats cool, I wonder why they decided to do a 1945 version as opposed to the 1941 version


There is a lot of documentation on the PE after she fell into US hands. Trumpeter was able to get that info and went from there.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 21, 2009 7:02 pm 
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karl wrote:
Thats cool, I wonder why they decided to do a 1945 version as opposed to the 1941 version


Which brings up another question. After looking through my admittedly meger reference material, it looks to me as if the differences between the ship in '41 and '45 were pretty minor. Basically radar fit and less AA armament in '41. Sounds like a pretty easy backdate. Am I close to right?

Michael


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 22, 2009 1:18 am 
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Blue Devil wrote:
Can anyone give us a straight up paint scheme for the ship in 1945 with KM color labels and so forth?

About 1944/45 most heavier (eeehhh ... remaining) KM vessels were painted overall light grey. I assume this was Hellgrau 50, RAL 7001 (alternative, but much lighter: RAL 7035 - I even read about RAL 7038).

But ... not the Prinz ...
He was wearing the standard "50/51" livery of Hellgrau 50 (again RAL 7001/7035 or 7038) on the whole superstructure and Dunkelgrau 51 (RAL 7000) on the hull - it is not really dark, it is more of a medium grey with a slight blue-ish hint in it. Oddly enough, the hull below the degaussing cable was painted a 'real' dark grey, I suspect Dunkelgrau 2 (RAL 7024).

Steel decks remained unchanged in Dunkelgrau 1 (RAL 7016), which was the same shade used for the boot-topping.

This livery was refreshed in the Wilhelmshaven drydock just before the ship went over the pond.

Hope this helps,

Happy painting ~ Olaf!


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 22, 2009 1:54 am 
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Blue Devil wrote:
Which brings up another question. After looking through my admittedly meger reference material, it looks to me as if the differences between the ship in '41 and '45 were pretty minor. Basically radar fit and less AA armament in '41. Sounds like a pretty easy backdate. Am I close to right?

If you're talking "1941" then you need to differ between pre-Brest and post-Brest.

Pre-Brest, let's say at the time of the sortie with Bismarck, you would need to modify these things:

1. The two forward high-angle AA-directors are lacking their domed tops (in German: "Wackeltopf"). This pair was handed over to the Russians, together with the aft pair from Bismarck and together with the 3rd ship of the second batch of Hipper class cruisers, the Lützow (Feb. 1940). In place of the domed tops, ordinary 3m-rangefinders were installed.

2. The AA platform in front of the conning tower, directly above the Admiral's Bridge, had a surrounding solid bulwark from Brest on, whereas the earlier version just featured a railing and a searchlight instead of the Flakvierling.

3. The large tyfon directly under the foretop gallery was located - or let's say, "protruding", from the bulwark around the foretop gallery, on stb of the ship's centre-line. I had difficulties fixing this on my 1/700 model as it interfers with the searchlight. With a Flakvierling mounted there, the logical step was to relocate the tyfon at the u/s of the foretop gallery (where it was located to a more afterly position when compared to the position before).

4. The AA platforms on either side of the funnel were searchlight platforms pre-Brest (if I remember correctly).

5. Additional torpedo stowage containers. If you want to represent a 1940 Prinz, the two triple “flat” containers aft of the funnel and the double “upright” torpedo container at the stb funnel base need to be removed. Just aft of the funnel, boats were stowed in 1940 (and I have yet to find out to which location they moved). I’m not quite sure WHEN this happened but if you are doing a 1941 Prinz during Op. Rheinübung, then the torpedo containers are correct.

6. The four triple torpedo launchers did not feature their anti-spray copula.

7. The additional deckhouse beneath the searchlight platform of the main mast needs to be removed.

8. Aft of this additional deckhouse, between the main mast and the aft rangefinder/gun director base, there are a few changes in the layout of the bulwarks. I don’t have access to photos right now but check p.4 of this thread here. There is a photo which shows the additional bulwark. I’m pretty sure it wasn’t there in 1941.

Of course, there are many more minor changes and you already noted the AA and radar arrangement, but the above are the main things I can recall from memory.

Hope this helps,

Happy modeling ~ Olaf!


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 22, 2009 5:05 am 
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Olaf Held wrote:
3. The large tyfon directly under the foretop gallery was located - or let's say, "protruding", from the bulwark around the foretop gallery, on stb of the ship's centre-line. I had difficulties fixing this on my 1/700 model as it interfers with the searchlight. With a Flakvierling mounted there, the logical step was to relocate the tyfon at the u/s of the foretop gallery (where it was located to a more afterly position when compared to the position before).



Sorry Olaf but what is a "tyfon" please?

Francis Macnaughton


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 22, 2009 6:40 am 
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FrancisMcN wrote:
Sorry Olaf but what is a "tyfon" please?


No need to say sorry, I could have named it "fog horn" ...

Something like this, but larger and not manually driven:

http://www.shiphorns.com/faketyfons.html

Best ~ Olaf!


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 22, 2009 2:03 pm 
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Interesting reading... Just ordered my Prinz Eugen at local dealer...
Maybe with new revell Bismarck..... maybe... maybe 41


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 24, 2009 1:30 am 
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Here is one of first reviews of Trumpy's PE '45 with photos of sprues:
http://www.cybermodeler.com/hobby/kits/tru/kit_tru_5313.shtml


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 25, 2009 9:33 am 
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Olaf Held wrote:
3. The large tyfon directly under the foretop gallery was located - or let's say, "protruding", from the bulwark around the foretop gallery, on stb of the ship's centre-line. I had difficulties fixing this on my 1/700 model as it interfers with the searchlight. With a Flakvierling mounted there, the logical step was to relocate the tyfon at the u/s of the foretop gallery (where it was located to a more afterly position when compared to the position before).


Sorry, I was confused, the "tyfon" or fog horn was placed directly under the AA-platform (the former searchlight platform) after Rheinübung ...

Happy modelling ~ Olaf!


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 27, 2009 10:56 pm 
Blue Devil wrote:
karl wrote:
Thats cool, I wonder why they decided to do a 1945 version as opposed to the 1941 version


Which brings up another question. After looking through my admittedly meger reference material, it looks to me as if the differences between the ship in '41 and '45 were pretty minor. Basically radar fit and less AA armament in '41. Sounds like a pretty easy backdate. Am I close to right?

Michael



Yes. The 20mm mounts are all that wasn't there in 1941 as far as my research shows. I am about 75-80% complete on the kit now and it is really nice - Trumpy's best yet. The photoetch is very good. Fortunately I have two sets of Eduard Bismarck p-e and will rob one for the radar.

The paint scheme as shown in the kit is indeed suspect - the black dividing line between upper/lower hull is too wide - drop it half the width shown and all is well. KBismarck.com has paint scheme for 1941, which is what I am doing.


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 28, 2009 1:11 pm 
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Hi "Guest" ~ Are you referring to this painting instruction?

http://www.modelwarships.com/reviews/ships/dkm/prinz-eugen/350-tsm/color.jpg

For 1945 it is correct but the boot-topping should be wider (and the rest of the hull, between the dark band and the main deck should be a bit darker - it needs to be darker than the superstructure). The boot-topping is shown as a very thin line between the red-brown antifouling and the dark grey band around the upper hull. The boot-topping on the actual ship was 2 m in height (almost 7 feet) - and it was NOT black!

The dark band from the boot-topping to the degaussing cable belonged to the camouflage pattern in 1945. It is believed this was painted "Dunkelgrau 2" - RAL 7024 which is a bit lighter than the RAL 7016 boot-topping (and steel decks).

Did you find other things to be changed in order to back-date the model to 1941? Could you please share photos?

I would like to know if I got the differences right I posted earlier ...

Best ~ Olaf!


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 30, 2009 6:46 am 
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Olaf,

Help a confused guy here. I know you said pre-Best or post-Best. I would like to build the Prinz when she was with the Bismarck during the Hood engagement. So is that pre-Best or post-Best. Thanks


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 30, 2009 8:54 am 
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Robin wrote:
Olaf,

Help a confused guy here. I know you said pre-Best or post-Best. I would like to build the Prinz when she was with the Bismarck during the Hood engagement. So is that pre-Best or post-Best. Thanks


Pre-Brest.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 30, 2009 9:33 am 
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Martin,

Thanks.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 04, 2009 3:49 pm 
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Visualisation of the list I posted on the previous page, on my Tamiya 1/700 model:

Image

#5, the additional torpedo stowage containers are not visible from this angle. Anyway, they where there during the sortie with the Bismarck. I don't know if the new Trumpy model features them and if so, then maybe only the two 'flat' tripple containers at the aft edge of the funnel but not the upright double container on the stb base of the funnel.

#9 ~ The one I forgot in my list. Before Brest, there was a 3m AA rangefinder at this position. On later photos the upgraded version - now with night vision capability - is apparent. I think it was upgraded during the time in Brest as well. That Tamiya kit features the upgraded version and I had to downgrade it by bending a strip of paper into the round shape of the bulwark, soaked with superglue and painted. The rangefinder was cut out from some spare PE railing.

Happy modelling ~ Olaf!


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 06, 2009 4:26 am 
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Hi
My Frist Post
Do you think that Trumrpter will do the Admiral Hipper in 1/700 :smallsmile: as thay are doing it in 1/350.I wil be getting the Prinz Eugen in 1/700 by Trumrpter do you think the WEM PE Set will work for these ships
i am geting back to model makeing after 25 years :thumbs_up_1:
all the best
nord


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 21, 2009 3:22 am 
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Thanks for the info on Eugen for Rheinübung. I'm going to moan like I have on every other forum as to why she was blimmin done in the later fit! She would be much better with the Trumpeter Hood and Revell Bismarck!
Still it might be fun backdating, test my meagre modelling skills hmm... :thinking: :yeah: :anyone: :help_1: :please: :lol_3:
I'm sure I'll be fine.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 21, 2009 8:11 am 
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Hello fellows,

Now we have such a wonderful detailed 1:350 Trumpeter model of the Prinz, I'd like to know if anybody can shed some light on this:

In the nice Warship Pictorial 21 booklet on the ship, already on the cover it is very clear that turrets Anton and Bruno (A and B that is) had names on them, in a very German Gothic typeface. Turret A is named "Graz" and turret B "Braunau". These are both town/cities in Austria, which is not entirely strange.

Does anybody know names of the two aft turrets? And just as interesting: is there a story attached to these names?

And, by the way, was this also practice on other German warships? I can't recall I had seen it elsewhere.

Anyway, I think I'm going to make some nice little decals for these names.

Maarten

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