The Ship Model Forum

The GLARAC site has a couple of photos of interest, apparently showing these two ships in camouflage. The one of ARDENT (http://www.glarac.co.uk/node/1760) has been published before, in Les Brown British Destroyers A-I and Tribal Classes (London: Seaforth Publishing, 2009) (Shipcraft No 11), but the one of ACASTA (http://www.glarac.co.uk/node/2061) is new to me. Anyone able to confirm the identities, and where/when they were taken?
Tim

The second one of the Ardent is also on the Getty Images site where it is tagged '3395654 bomb exploding ahead of HMS Ardent at Harstad, during Second World War naval and aerial action off the Norwegian coast'.

The broadside one showing the early war camouflage of Acasta is new to me also. Background looks unfamiliar too.

It is quite possible that SEVERAL of the 'A' class were dazzle painted during the Norwegian affair. See vol four page 13, of RN camouflage, Warship Perspectives. The few photos that I have seen taken of various Home Fleet destroyers during this time have the Pendant numbers deleted.

The very recently published second volume of Haarr's series on the Norwegian Campaign has one more small photo taken onboard Ardent at Harstad April 1940 (15th?) again showing evidence of this patterned scheme.

Re the location of the Acasta photo, bit of a guess, but is that a castle on a mount between her funnels? If so it reminds me of Edinburgh - so Leith maybe?

Does anyone have any info on HMS Inglefield? I've had a look in the net, with little success, whilst the shipcraft book isn't comprehensive enough.

I'm thinking about converting a Tamiya E-Class in to her as my next project.

Did she have her second TT removed and replaced by a 3", or was one of the 4.7's removed instead?

I'm thinking of modelling her in the 1941-42 period.

Any help would be appreciated!

Mike.

There's a photo in M J Whitley Destroyers of World War 2 (Cassell (Arms and Armour Press), 1988) captioned as "INGLEFIELD in November 1942 ..." and credited to IWM. It shows her in camouflage with white pennant numbers, with a 12pdr HA in "X" position, 4 (possibly 6) single 20mm Oerlikons, RDF Type 291 at the foremasthead and HF DF on a pole mainmast. There is also another IWM photo (ref no FL 22369) on line at the IWM website (search page is http://www.iwmcollections.org.uk/qryMain.php - search under "INGLEFIELD"). This photo was probably taken at the same time as the one in Whitley's book.
Tim

There is a Facebook page devoted to Inglefield. It has 4 pages of photos (mainly) devoted to her. One of them, on page 3, shows her 3 inch AA gun in its original position, in place of the aft set of tubes.

http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=2 ... hotos&so=0

Where you put the 3" depends on when you wish to model her. My guess is that it was first fitted in place of the aft tubes late 1940 and moved to X position during her Aug - Oct 1942 refit. You see it in X position in the photos of her in the zig zag hull pattern camouflage (eg FL22369 dated 9 Nov 1942 and others) but not in earlier WW2 photos of her in overall grey.

Good luck!

Thanks for the info guys, much appreciated!

Mike.

Hello,

I am chiming in very late into the Glowworm's colour scheme but someone asked if there were any photos of other early destoyers in the two tone light over dark grey schemes. In the book "River Class Destoryers of the Royal Canadian Navy" second ed, Vanwell Publishing, there are pictures of HMCS Saguenay dated Oct 1940 in AP507B and AP507C. Also HMCS Assiniboine and Ottawa in 1940 wore those colours. Again this is rather late but better late than never. According to the op histories, in Oct 1940 Saguenay was serving in Canadian waters. Ottawa's time was split in 1940 first half in Canadian waters, second half out of Scotland. The Assiniboine was in the Caribbean for the first part of 1940 and Canadian waters for the remainder.

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James W.

Dry docked:
1/72 HMCS Assiniboine DDE 234-1960
1/72 HMCS Ottawa DDE 229-1960
1/72 HMCS St. Catharines-River Class Frigate-1944
On the slipway:
1/72 HMCS Camrose-Flower Class Corvette-1943
1/72 HMCS Trillium-Flower Class Corvette-1942

Hi Guys

I'm completely new to this but wondered if you might be interested a 6 foot tinplate model of HMS Antelope which my uncles built in the 1930's and they kindly left me in their will.

It's completely scratch built in tin with a triangular piece of timber stuck on the bottem to form the keel. It is a working model and my uncles spent as much time on getting its performance right. It weighs 28kg and was originally steam powered and later converted to radio control. The motors are Decaperm and are water cooled by a mechanical pump which draws water below the waterline and dischages through the bilge pump hole. Although i've no experience I'm currently renovating it, having replaced much of the electrics with Action Electronics gear. It works fine on the bench but I hope, in the near future, to test it properly in a swimming pool as its too big for the bath.

I don't know how you attach photos, but will find out if anyones interested.

John

That sounds really neat! We'd love to see some pictures. Instructions for posting photos can be found here: viewtopic.php?f=12&t=1261

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De quoi s'agit-il?

New to forum,buliding a 1/350th HMS hero from ISW Hesperus kit.Deciding between 1940 Narvik(camo 507a or b?) or service in the Med.1940-42.Have pix from internet and from Raven book(vol.1) Any advice re Hero's equipment(2xTTs or 3'AA) at either Cape Spada or 2nd Sirte.Also funnel bands and hull numbers,some pix show them present and others do not. Thanks for any help.

MODS: A to I Class thread?

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Danny DON'T "waterline"...!

Any suggestions on how to start a 1/350 HMS Ithuriel?

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--
Sean Hert

Currently finishing the book of Electra gunnery officer LtCmdr T J Cain. He speaks on some occasions that the 3'' gun, the Oerlikons, the point fivers (Vickers 0.5) and THE Bofors firing at enemy planes. Was this ever confirmed that Electra had a Bofors aboard?

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"Build few and build fast,
Each one better than the last"
John Fisher

Dear all

I am keen on building one of my Tamiya E class as HMS Firedrake, inspired by reading the excellent Firedrake association website and particularly moved by the story of the handful of survivors of her sinking, who clung on to the stern section and fired a star-shell from her 3" gun and managed to attract attention from another escort.
Firedrake wore a camouflage pattern in the Med during 1941 and a different one after refitting in Boston. Unfortunately I can only find photos for her starboard side for either pattern. Does anyone have any information on her port side? Especially for the pattern used in the Med, which was definitely different each side (there's a bows on shot in drydock in Gib that shows this). These pictures can be viewed at http://www.hmsfiredrake.co.uk/firedrake25.htm.

Any help appreciated: maybe someone might recognise one of the schemes as also carried by another vessel?

Thanks

Martin

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On the drawing board
HMS Gurkha (1/700)
On the slipway:
HMS Sheffield 1/600
HMS Lance 1/700

Good question Martin, and I hope that maybe someone will come up with clear photos of the port side in both schemes. However, if they do not, it seems to me looking at the photos on that Firedrake page that the portside photo with the bow out of the water shows the portside in a different scheme to what is visible of the portside in the bow photo in the dry dock. I think that the website has got it wrong with the three abreast and only the starboard side and bow photos show her in the same scheme.

What little you can see of the camouflage scheme in the portside view with the bow out of the water looks identical to the same areas on the starboard side in the later scheme. So I would guess that there is a good chance that the whole of the portside in the later scheme was a mirror image of the starboard side in that scheme.

Addendum: I've changed my mind re the later scheme perhaps being a mirror image both sides. I have found this picture which I think shows Firedrake at the end of her repairs at Boston ie in the later scheme. Looking at X gun shield and both funnels it does not look like the paint job was symetrical both sides.

I've now worked out why the little you can see of the camouflage scheme in the "portside" view with the bow out of the water looks identical to the same areas in the starboard side views of Firedrake in the later scheme - that website has got that photo back to front. It actually shows the starboard side.

Dear Dick
Thanks for your careful viewing of these pictures. You're right, it does look like the 'port side' picture has been transposed, as it looks very similar to the two pictures of the 1942 scheme worn in the Atlantic, and which is the one in the picture from Boston NY, I think. However, there are some similarities to the part of the port side we can see in the bows-on view in dry dock in Gibraltar: notably the rather odd configuration of the boot-topping: the camouflage seems to run over this - and a similar thing is just discernible in one of the Atlantic starboard side views. The camouflage on the aft funnel doesn't seem to change between the schemes, and could be the same on both sides: there's an on board view portside that suggests this. Could the pattern have orginally been different port and starboard and then during the Boston refit the starboard side only repainted, so that it matched the port? Though I take your point from the Boston picture that it doesn't look like a symmetrical scheme.
Intriguing.

Martin

Dear Martin,

Is this the onboard view portside that you are referring to? If so it certainly is not a portside view - there was no pair of davits abreast the aft funnel portside. Another back to front photo? Is it even Firedrake? Is it even an F class destroyer (shape of funnel)? The look of the searchlight platform reminds me more of the A class....



Here is a clearer view of the funnels in the Boston photo - definitely not symetrical.



We need a clear portside view.

Best wishes.