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PostPosted: Mon Dec 01, 2008 11:04 am 
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MartinJQuinn wrote:
PeteM wrote:
MartinJQuinn wrote:
Available Porter class models:
1/350 USS Porter, by Yankee ModelWorks
1/350 USS Balch, by Yankee Modelworks
1/700 USS Porter (pre-war), by Combrig
1/700 USS Porter (early war), by Combrig

These are just off the top of my head - if there are more, please feel free to add them.


Martin, You can add the Iron Shipwright USS Moffett 1/350 to that Porter class list. I've actually just started it and was wondering if anyone knew of any decent references for the ship or class. The web is pretty sparse photo wise. Hence the dragging of this thread to the top! :wave_1:


Peter, it looks like that is OOP. It's not one of the kit listed for sale on the ISW site.


Didn't realize that. I first noticed this particular kit at my LHS about 2 years ago but it was priced really high. I waited them out and they eventually dropped the price to $60 around 8 months ago and I pounced on it. I have no idea how long they actually had it but I guess it was a while longer than two years.

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 10, 2009 9:45 pm 
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A couple of photos I found at NARA.

DD-361 Clark sometime in late 1941 alongside ENTERPRISE. She appears to be in Ms 1 to me.
Image

DD-381 Somers on 16 February 1942 at Charleston Navy Yard.
Image


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 Post subject: USS Porter & Somers guns
PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2011 10:08 am 
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Hello,
I had a look at several photo on navsource.org to know the weapons outfit of Porter and Somers destroyers during the Pacific war. Something is clear to me, but much else is not.
For example, some ships were rebuilt with DP 5" guns and Mk37 directors, the first being Selfridge after her battle damage in oct 1943. Some other were rebuilt later but were in the Atlantic fleet.
Anyway there were other less extensive modifications.
All ships had 2 quad 1.1 AA guns at the beginning of the war, and Friedman says that Porter and Clarck had 3 mounts.
They were replaced by twin Bofors, and a quad Bofors replaced sometimes the No. 3 5" gun turret.
It seems to me that Porter (DD-356) was lost with all 4 5" turrets still in place, and probably with 1.1 guns also.
Selfridge (DD-357) was damaged with all four turrets in place as well in late 1943. But I can't see if some Bofors were already fitted.
Phelps (DD-360) was possibly the first to land No.3 turret, and probably to have Bofors 40 mm fitted in late 1942. She was rebuilt only in late 1944 but with Altantic fleet.
Clarck (DD-361) was refitted (no No. 3, plus Bofors) sometimes before mid 1943.
Balch (DD-363) was refitted as Clarck in july-august 1943.
Sampson (DD-394) ad Warrington (DD-383) landed no. 3 turret sometimes before march 1943. Maybe at the same time landed a quad TT as well.

Any corrections are really welcome
Max


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 Post subject: USS Porter & Somers guns
PostPosted: Mon Jan 17, 2011 8:04 am 
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Is somebody able to see if in this photo of Selfridge there are still 1.1" guns, or if the new Bofors were already fitted?
http://www.navsource.org/archives/05/0535720.jpg

Thanks in advance
Max


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 24, 2011 5:49 pm 
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Is somebody able to see if in this photo of Selfridge there are still 1.1" guns, or if the new Bofors were already fitted?
http://www.navsource.org/archives/05/0535720.jpg

Thanks in advance
Max


Max, I've been digging for info on USS SELFRIDGE recently and I believe the picture referenced was taken just after Pearl Harbor affixed a false bow to DD-357 after it was blown off by a Long Lance (Type 93) torpedo. I believe the upgrades from 1.1" quad mounts to 40mm Bofors were part of the yard period at Mare Island, CA where the new permanent bow was mounted along with a variety of weapons mods and new fire control directors, hence after this picture.
FWIW, my interest stems from the relative of mine that was likely riding SELFRIDGE when this picture was taken (Ship Fitter 1/c Donald Bolton -- onboard for the 07DEC41 'festivities'; recently passed away March 2011).


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 11:28 am 
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Thank you!
It's the same I found. Selfridge was still armed with 1.1" quad guns at the time of the battle.
Anyway the other questions are still open.

Max


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 09, 2011 11:46 am 
uss clark dd 361 was in san diego naval yard 6 dec. 1941, she could not be refuling at that time must have been later in the war in the south pacific


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2011 4:18 pm 
uss clark lost # 3 mt and put 40 mm on in the canal zone before may1942


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2011 5:37 pm 
i goof it would may 1943 uss clark dd 361 lost #3 gun mt. and 40mm were installed in the canal navy yard


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2011 6:47 pm 
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guest wrote:
uss clark lost # 3 mt and put 40 mm on in the canal zone before may1942

I have a problem with the "May '42" timeframe. 40MM only became available in the stateside yards in July of '42. Pearl started getting some a couple of months later. The canal zone definitely had no 40MM to install in May of '42.


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2011 8:35 am 
Dick J wrote:
guest wrote:
uss clark lost # 3 mt and put 40 mm on in the canal zone before may1942

I have a problem with the "May '42" timeframe. 40MM only became available in the stateside yards in July of '42. Pearl started getting some a couple of months later. The canal zone definitely had no 40MM to install in May of '42.

dick that was a typo on me it was before may 1943


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 3:24 pm 
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Question in regard to the bridgework of DD-357 and the rebuilt members of the 356 class in general.

In this photo you can see a pair of small tubs on two different levels on the sides of the bridge. Did she keep them or lose them at some point, and was she unique in having them? I can't seem to find any other evidence of such tubs on the others but then again finding good quality photos of the rebuilt ships is like a needle in a haystack.

http://www.navsource.org/archives/05/0535716.jpg
The upper tub seems to be a sky lookout and the lower has the signal light mounted.

http://www.navsource.org/archives/05/0536002.jpg
DD-360 lacks them and seems to have a larger open bridge level as do the other rebuilt DDs.

I am interested in building one of these rebuilt DDs and I want to know how to treat the bridge.

Any and all help is appreciated as always,
-Mike

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 4:44 pm 
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As the first rebuild, DD357 was a bit different. Did you also notice that the funnel caps on her were different from those on the other rebuilds?


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 5:17 pm 
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Honestly I hadn't but I was aware that they were shortened. Seems like DD-357 was more or less the prototype for the rebuilds then correct?

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 12, 2013 2:09 am 
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Hi All,

I am currently involved in building the ProModel (Gremir Models) 1/200 Scale USS Selfridge, DD-357 as she would have appeared after her rebuild at Mare Island in 1944 after the Battle at Vela Lavella. Looking for any information as to where to place some of her compliment of 20MM Oerlikon Mk IIIA single mounts. I am aware of the two on either side of the Bridge Wings and the two on either side of the aft Stack on the raised decking above the level of the Engineering Deck House. My question comes from having read that she had 8 20MM Oerlikon Single mounts on a Wikipedia entry. I don't know if this is correct or not as other entries on other sites state that she had 8 40MM Bofors mounts and only 4 20MM Oerlikon singles. This jibes with the compliment of AA weapons as the ship is modeled by Maciej Poznanski, author of this card model kit.

Overall I am liking the larger scale of these card model kits as they provide better detailing options being in the larger scale. I am using RB Models 20MM Oerlikon Mk IIIA single mounts, a very nice set that builds into a pretty good copy of this weapon. So the opportunity to add an extra 4 mounts, if correct, is entirely within my wheel house as it were.

Image

So if anyone has some good information as to exactly where on deck these extra 4 mounts were positioned, I would like to hear about it.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 12, 2013 4:52 pm 
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She had two on each side of the after stack, for a total of 4 in that area. Added to the two forward of the bridge, that makes 6. Some ships with the "British style" bridge later mounted 2 in the after part of the wings of the bridge, but I have no photos that confirm that for Selfridge.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 12, 2013 5:28 pm 
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Hi Dick J,

Thanks for that bit of information Dick J. The way the model is set up that might be an issue to add 2 more to the second level decking around the after stack. The author designed it as sort of a three leafed clover shape with a hole for the stack to go through. The two 20MM Oerlikon mounts go on the centers of the clover leafs on either side of the stack like so.

Image

While I am not averse to changing anything, most of the references that I have show that to be the correct configuration, i.e.. a Morskie Monograph (PM 30) on the Selfridge, you can see the color print out of the two view of the ship behind the model in the photograph. Do you have a photo of the 4 gun mount configuration so I could follow it?

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 12, 2013 8:43 pm 
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There are a number of shots on Navsource. They are not overhead shots, and so are not as obvious, but the different shape of the aft funnel platform can be made out if you look closely. The after pair of 20MM were more abeam the searchlight with a second pair forward of them. I have seen clearer images in some of my books, but these should give you a bit to go on. The tub extensions for the after pair are painted with the lighter color and the forward pair are painted the darker color, making them a bit harder to make out.

http://www.navsource.org/archives/05/0535724.jpg
http://www.navsource.org/archives/05/0535715.jpg
http://www.navsource.org/archives/05/0535719.jpg

The next two are Phelps, but the basic shape of the platform is about the same.

http://www.navsource.org/archives/05/0536011.jpg
http://www.navsource.org/archives/05/0536002.jpg


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 12, 2013 10:19 pm 
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Hi Dick J,

Thanks for getting back to me so quickly, I do appreciate it.

All I can say about that camouflage paint work on the Selfridge is that it definitely worked! I had already dredged up that photo and had it saved in the file I am using for this project. I though I had looked at for all I could get. Blowing it up to almost the point of pixilation, makes it much easier to see that there are indeed 4 gun positions around the stack and that the author of my card model also missed that one. Now that I can see what it is actually supposed to be shaped as, time to do some redesign work and get things corrected.

Again, thank you for assisting me in such a timely manner. :thumbs_up_1:

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 15, 2013 4:19 am 
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Hi All,

With Dick J pointing out the needed change to my USS Selfridge project, I worked things over and think I may have come up with something that will work for me. Aside from having to change the shape of the upper deck from a three leaf clover shape to a four leaf clover with a rectangular bill on the after end of it, I also had to add the projections that came out from the sheets of armor plate that surrounded the decking. These were probably where the sheets were butted up next to one another and welded to shape. Once all of the armor was around the decking I had to come up with a way for the crew to get up there to man the gun mounts. There was already two ladders that ran up on either side of the Engineering Deck House bulkhead, running the railing around there I did leave clearance holes to allow for them. As there was a ladder way that went up the stack, I had to leave a little room for that for clearance. Adding a square cut out was not much of a stretch in that area and then putting a stair case ladder way with a safety rail coming up from the roof of the Engineering Deck House seemed like the best way to get the numbers of crew required up there in a timely manner. I also had to add a second pair of ammo lockers, thank goodness for just being able to pop another copy of that particular sheet out. I added the two already made 20MM Oerlikon mounts that I had on hand to the forward position, tomorrow I can make up another pair and do a proper paint job on all four. I also had to add another section to bring the search light mount up to clear the armor plating.

Image

Image

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