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PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2018 10:19 pm 
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Hi everyone.

Bought Trumpeter’s 144th Seawolf about a month ago and got most of it together . . . along with LOTS of interior supports for the hull. A sincere thank you to everyone who took the time to mention the problems.

Now, I had looked at the kit supplied propulsion setup and garbage canned it immediately. It was just so wrong. I decided to order a new unit from Shapeways. Cost about 30 USD. I was excited when my little package arrived; however, upon opening it, I was horrified to find that every surface looked like it was printed from the gravel in a parking lot.

No amount of sanding was gonna smooth the surface as the parts were built up from some material that I would describe as being nylon-like. On the surface of the propeller, the layers were so well defined that they looked like layers of tree bark.

I tried painting the parts with DupliColor primer/sealer/filler which helped but not enough. So tonight I have painted every surface with CA to see if that might get things smoother. I’ll let you know.

So, be warned if you decide to try and up the detail with 3D printing. You could have problems.


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File comment: Here is the unit I purchased.
629570CD-6436-47B3-B4EA-62921EFED67B.jpeg
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2018 11:39 pm 
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Did the vendor offer different types of materials for higher resolution printing (and at a higher cost)?

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2018 6:40 am 
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Joined: Sat Aug 20, 2005 9:27 pm
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That design is offered by a Spanish vendor named Luis from his shop "Panzer vs. Tanks". The product is available in two material options, relatively inexpensive "White Processed Versatile Plastic" which is in fact nylon, and a much more expensive material called "Smooth Fine Detail Plastic", which is acrylic (chemically related to Plexiglas).* For static display models, "Smooth Fine Detail" is the better 3D-printed material.

3D-printed materials do not behave like injection-molded polystyrene or other resins. Our years of modeling experience can actually work against us when it comes to using 3D-printed materials.

"Versatile Plastic" and "Fine Detail" 3D-printed materials are very different. Their cost is very different, too, and there are several reasons for that. Each of these materials has its own strengths and weaknesses. Here's a brief summary of them:

"Versatile Plastic" (nylon) is generally not suitable for static display models where surface smoothness and detail are important. "Versatile Plastic" is better suited for large-scale Radio Control models where material strength and durability are more important than surface smoothness and detail.
- relatively inexpensive
- strong and water-tight, takes a beating
- surface texture is pebbly
- print layers are relatively thick meaning print lines are very noticeable
- does not sand easily, surfaces are difficult to smooth
- accepts fewer primers and paints, generally only those made specifically for nylon. Few other paints will adhere to it.
- fewer adhesives work with it

In my Shapeways shop (Model Monkey), this material is only offered for very large-scale products intended for Radio Control models (<2% of my 1900+ designs). A warning about this material is included in the product description. Most of my customers are only building static display models so the other 98% of my products are only offered in "Smooth Fine Detail" and/or "Smoothest Fine Detail" acrylic. Nameplates are available in real metals like brass, bronze and silver, too.

"Smooth Fine Detail Plastic" and "Smoothest Fine Detail Plastic" materials are both the same acrylic made from the same printer (the difference between them is how the print resolution is set, giving different layer thicknesses - "Smoothest" has the thinnest layers, just 16 microns). "Fine Detail" acrylic material is best for static display models.
- relatively expensive
- relatively brittle, and therefore unsuitable for radio control
- easily sandable
- cuts easily
- surfaces can be further smoothed, if desired, using an "Air Eraser" without harming detail: https://www.harborfreight.com/air-erase ... 69277.html
- uses a waxy material to support overhanging features during printing. Most, if not all, of the waxy support material is melted away in a low-temperature oven at the factory before it is shipped to the customer
- stubborn waxy bits can be cleaned easily in dish-detergent (Dawn, Fairy, Simple Green, baby shampoo, etc.) and hot water (< 175 degrees F)
- accepts many more kinds of paint including popular hobby acrylic paints and enamel paints
- must be exposed to direct sunlight or other UV light source for a few hours by the customer to fully cure the plastic, a must if using enamel paint. This is called "post-curing".
- should be painted soon after post-curing and cleaning to seal the plastic

Here's a link to detailed descriptions of the various material choices offered by Shapeways: https://www.shapeways.com/materials

Here's a link to some other advice and FAQs as part of my shop's catalog: https://modelmonkey.wixsite.com/modelmonkey

Hope this helps!


Shapeways recently changed the names of some of their materials based on customer feedback. *Versatile Plastic" was formerly known as "Strong and Flexible" plastic. "Smooth Fine Detail Plastic" was formerly known as "Frosted Ultra Detail" (FUD). Same materials, just new names.

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Complete catalog: - https://www.model-monkey.com/
Follow Model Monkey® on Facebook: - https://www.facebook.com/modelmonkeybookandhobby


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2018 7:49 am 
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Thanks Steve for the lesson. I knew a bit of the difference, but not to this extent.

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2018 8:57 am 
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Thanks for the update on 3D printing Steve.

Yes, the “ultra detail” material was available; however, at a more than 100% price increase, it was too much for my modeling piggy bank. I had hoped against hope I guess for a useable product within my budget. Obviously I was mistaken.

So back to the CA/sand, CA/sand, CA . . . you get the picture.

My hope in making this post was to advise others to take care when ordering.

Oh, may I suggest you reprint your post somewhere on the Forum where others might benefit from my adventure?

Thanks again,

Jim


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2018 9:36 am 
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Model Monkey
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Joined: Sat Aug 20, 2005 9:27 pm
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Location: USA
Hi Jim, sure will.

If the CA technique doesn't give you the quality you desire, another technique that may work for you is to use primer intended for nylon to help smooth those surfaces. Apply thin layers of primer, then smooth the primer.

Sorry I'm not more help.

I do regret that the acrylic material is expensive.

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Have fun, Monkey around.™

-Steve L.

Complete catalog: - https://www.model-monkey.com/
Follow Model Monkey® on Facebook: - https://www.facebook.com/modelmonkeybookandhobby


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