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PostPosted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 12:15 pm 
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Location: EG48
I was handed a copy of the kit by surprise on Saturday and was asked to do a review for Model Paint Solutions, but since it was more or less from the manufacturer direct they were interested in getting as much exposure as possible and John (owner of the above site) is a good guy I figured there wouldn't be any problem in doing a WIP here on the way to the review. Quick review in 20 words(ish) or less(ish) - a good effort, entirely buildable, few challenges seen so far, a few goofs, and great potential for detailers.

A few resources - I've popped a Booklet of General Plans for the class online as well as a document I found with an early exercise here. The later has some interior photos - unfortunately none in color, but it does confirm a lot of the basic features that AFV Club put into their hold / vehicle bay, which I have started and primed:

Attachment:
File comment: Deck and starboard bulkhead glued and primed.
AFV_73515_LST_01.jpg
AFV_73515_LST_01.jpg [ 66.26 KiB | Viewed 13774 times ]


Fit has been really good so far as long as you take the time to make sure you have cleaned up the mating surfaces - sanding down the nubs from the tree left a wee bit of a raised edge on the corners, which could affect fit if not subsequently stripped off. Below is the stern showing the lower hull (easy waterline!) held up to the port and starboard hull halves:

Attachment:
File comment: Three pieces held together.
AFV_73515_LST_02.jpg
AFV_73515_LST_02.jpg [ 40.46 KiB | Viewed 13774 times ]


Now a bit on the hull. As you might notice, there is distortion and oil canning molded into the hull as well as some ribbing and bumpers. While LSTs did have this, it is a touch over done for my tastes. The oil canning is very well done where present, however it stops short of the stern and bow and it just looks a bit off to me. There should be less of it in these areas, but there should still be some. The box was neither too tight or loose with parts, however the bow had some visible stress discoloration and the bow is spread wide. The stern has a bit of a gusset plate so I focused on gluing that first and ignored the bow joint for now. The below photo shows the stressed plastic and how far the bow joint is spread with the main deck more or less in place:

Attachment:
File comment: This gives me a sudden desire to go watch "The Spy Who Loved Me."
AFV_73515_LST_03.jpg
AFV_73515_LST_03.jpg [ 64.78 KiB | Viewed 13774 times ]


Plan is to once again start with the stern and work my way forward. Once the hull is glued up to the bend I'll do some closer looking and work it into shape.

Superstructure has gone together really well. The pilot house has two main pieces - the smaller being the front three faces. While not slide molded as some other pieces were, the port holes on the angled surface lack the oblong elongation that Trumpeter's DE England did. One potential omission is porthole covers - the two portholes on the main piece have them hanging below, whereas the forward bulkheads have them omitted. I haven't combed through my scanned images yet to see if this was a typical feature, but even if so I'm going to skip trying to fix it as those are the only two portholes on the kit that appear to have this feature.

Attachment:
AFV_73515_LST_04.jpg
AFV_73515_LST_04.jpg [ 52.07 KiB | Viewed 13774 times ]


The main deck superstructure is three pieces, with the outboard bulkheads as separate and the forward and aft bulkheads and aft overhang a single piece. The side pieces fit into a chamfered joint extremely well with the caveat about cleaning up the mating surfaces above reiterated. I think just a touch of Mr Surfacer would be the most needed, and am fairly confident that any visible joint at the deck edge will be easily hidden by the railings.

Next step is to mask off and paint the hold deck in #20 Deck Gray. Once that's done the hull and deck should go together fairly quickly.

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 12:53 pm 
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Details look nice. Agreed the oil canning looks a bit overdone from your photo.

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 2:27 pm 
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I think the oil canning would be A-OK if it weren't for the raised detail. I have one on pre-order from FreeTime and am contemplating sanding the external ribs off on that one to see how just the oil caning alone looks.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2018 11:09 am 
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I did not get any painting done last night and might not this weekk - however I did get the lower hull about 75% glued on. It's attached up to the point of the "bend" that there was in each hull half:

Attachment:
AFV_73515_LST_05.jpg
AFV_73515_LST_05.jpg [ 55.57 KiB | Viewed 13689 times ]


I wanted to wait until the joints I had glued were fully dry before I start pushing the bow into shape. The plastic's thin enough I don't anticipate much problem, and I should be able to hold the upper forward deck in place to have upper and lower guides while the glue sets.

Attachment:
AFV_73515_LST_06.jpg
AFV_73515_LST_06.jpg [ 52.69 KiB | Viewed 13689 times ]


One side note - Bureau of Ships photo 64319 on USNDazzle.com's LST-340 page has a fairly good example of how the hull external ribbing and oil canning might look like.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2018 12:48 pm 
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Thank you much for this preview and construction series. I've been eagerly anticipating this kit for a while (grandfather was a plankowner of LST-174) and am very interested to see what it looks like, how it builds up and how it can be improved. Looking forward to what's ahead.

Jodie Peeler


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2018 3:35 pm 
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The kit should work well for LST-174 as it's basic configuration works for LSTs through the LST-491 class (basic difference is that the LST-1 through 490 had a forward elevator whereas LST-491 and beyond replaced the elevator with a ramp and raised the pilot house up a level for better visibility when a LCT was embarked). Decals are included for LSTs 140, 141, and 178 in what I am going to call the "ETO style" (started with a "US" and then had hull number whereas in the {URL=http://www.researcheratlarge.com/Ships/S19-7/1944MayAuxiliaryHullNumbers.html]Pacific they just had the hull number but in larger numbers[/URL]) so you should have a few to cobble together. Taking a quick survey at LST-174's Navsource page (because I'm trying to learn a it more about what common variations there may have been). it looks like there's some differences in the forward AA tubs around the LCVP davits to sort out - unfortunately there's no clear photos of her stern to see if she had the platform over the aft winch the way the kit does, etc..

Almost lunch time at work.. going to get one of the hull sides glued forward.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2018 9:24 pm 
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I very much appreciate that detailed response, Tracy. Somewhere around here I have some copies of a few on-board snapshots from my grandfather's things. If I can find them and if they have anything that might be of use in sorting out variations, I'll let you know.

Thanks for all of this, and although I know you did it for broader purposes, it still means a lot. I owe you a lovely beverage of your choice someday.

Jodie Peeler


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:57 pm 
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I've seen you help others - you deserve the same back. :thumbs_up_1:

If the research mob ever makes it to SC or we can tempt you & yours up to DC, we'll buy each other drinks :big_grin:

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 6:28 pm 
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Anybody know at what point LST's transitioned to a flat stern?


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 7:31 pm 
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I might be miss-understanding what you mean, but even LST-1 had a squared-off stern.

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"Let the evidence guide the research. Do not have a preconceived agenda which will only distort the result."
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 9:07 pm 
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That's what I thought but it appeared that the model being showed had a rounded stern so I thought there might be a possibility that the early LST's were different.

Thanks!


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 10:29 pm 
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The "Mk 1" LSTs were different - British built and converted from tankers and other non purposely-built hulls. I'm away from the bench but will try and post a picture Sunday night when I'm back of this feature. It's actually the worst kit fit I've found so far, but I was hoping to post a single image that showed the before and after so I hadn't got to that yet.

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"Let the evidence guide the research. Do not have a preconceived agenda which will only distort the result."
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2018 11:31 am 
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I wrote my last reply in a bit of a rush and tired state. The LST-1 class was considered a "LST Mk 2." and was different than the Mk I, so there were LST's with different configurations - just not nearly as many.

Here's the picture of the stern I promised, with the main deck sitting (but not glued) in place:

Attachment:
AFV_73515_LST_07.jpg
AFV_73515_LST_07.jpg [ 42.65 KiB | Viewed 13353 times ]


Also - the previously unknown CVLST:

Attachment:
AFV_73515_LST_08.jpg
AFV_73515_LST_08.jpg [ 48.42 KiB | Viewed 13353 times ]


:big_grin:

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"Let the evidence guide the research. Do not have a preconceived agenda which will only distort the result."
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2018 11:32 am 
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Not a lot of visible progress this week due to work, but I did get the bow bulkhead glued in place on Monday:

Attachment:
AFV_73515_LST_09.jpg
AFV_73515_LST_09.jpg [ 32.49 KiB | Viewed 13231 times ]

Note the two knocking pin marks on the bulkhead above the door. They won't be too visible but obviously I didn't want to leave them.

Instructions would have you glue this to the hold deck and bulkheads, but I wanted more control over the fit of this piece without having to fight alignment of the hold itself or main deck if I had it off center.

The hold is as painted as I'm going to do. It tests fit in very well against the forward bulkhead and the side pieces that hold it up off the hull bottom:

Attachment:
AFV_73515_LST_10.jpg
AFV_73515_LST_10.jpg [ 67.52 KiB | Viewed 13231 times ]

Super detailers and photo-etch companies have the opportunity to add some platforms at the aft end of this space as per the plans i posted up top as well as some lateral girders on the overhead that are missing and visible through the bow doors if your viewing vantage point is low enough.

Hopefully some more modeling time on Sunday - I want to get the bow bulkhead primed and painted so I can glue in the hold and get on to the two deck pieces.

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"Let the evidence guide the research. Do not have a preconceived agenda which will only distort the result."
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2018 12:49 pm 
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Not a lot of progress lately due to a week-long vacation out of town and the lead up and wrap up at home and work.

I did get the propeller/rudder skegs attached though, just to have some movement:

Attachment:
AFV_73515_LST_11.jpg
AFV_73515_LST_11.jpg [ 39.91 KiB | Viewed 13086 times ]


Fit is really well but one item of note I haven't really had a chance to think through for my next one. There's a doubler plate of sorts on the skegs - visible in a couple of photos here. Only the outboard side on the kt has them molded in, but anyone who gets close enough to figure this out is either going to be a contest judge or having their hand slapped for getting too close, so it's really not a big deal.

However, the doubler can give the impression of a gap at the joint that is not properly filled. I tried to show that with my photo, but it's cell-phone quality and perhaps a bit unclear. Fill it and smooth it anyway? Install the skegs on opposite sides with the plate on the inside so the step creates an illusion of a gap on the inside where no one will see it?

More soon, hopefully!

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"Let the evidence guide the research. Do not have a preconceived agenda which will only distort the result."
-Barbara Tuchman


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 03, 2019 8:13 pm 
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I've been making what I consider decent progress. Lots of test fitting. Two items to watch for affect the main deck fit. One is the joint between the two deck pieces. There are tabs on each piece to help line them up, but I found they pushed the bow piece up at an angle with enough force to resist being pushed down slightly:

Attachment:
AFV_73515_LST_12.jpg
AFV_73515_LST_12.jpg [ 54.12 KiB | Viewed 12883 times ]


It won't fight too hard, but if you simply cut the tabs off the front piece it lays down nice and trouble free with almost no gap:

Attachment:
AFV_73515_LST_13.jpg
AFV_73515_LST_13.jpg [ 47.21 KiB | Viewed 12883 times ]


Note that this is just laying in place and the gap should be non-existent when glued in place. The second item is the main deck - note the gap on the starboard side in my photo. This gap is not present when test-fitting without the tank deck, indicating that this assembly is (was) causing problems. I found the tolerances to be very precise and the fit very tight - but this pushes the hull shell outwards a touch and spreads it wider, causing the gap. Sanding down the shelf the tank deck assembly fits into on it's vertical surfaces effectively widened them and fixed the problem. Since there is a horizontal strip this assembly mates using, you can go at it with a coarse sanding stick, have it fixed in a minute, and not worry about any appearance or problems keeping the tank deck mounted properly.

Attachment:
AFV_73515_LST_14.jpg
AFV_73515_LST_14.jpg [ 52.08 KiB | Viewed 12883 times ]


I decided to do my first as LST-262, which was one of the 100+ LSTs at D-Day. She was in Measure 22, and the first coat of hull red and Haze Gray are on the hull:

Attachment:
AFV_73515_LST_15.jpg
AFV_73515_LST_15.jpg [ 46.4 KiB | Viewed 12883 times ]


Need to get some trucks painted and placed before I get the main deck on, but I hope to have that done by the end of the weekend.

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"Let the evidence guide the research. Do not have a preconceived agenda which will only distort the result."
-Barbara Tuchman


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2019 7:48 am 
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Looks very good, Tracy

The CVLST configuration has definite potential. :smallsmile:


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2019 2:35 pm 
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Two of the LSTs I want to build were aircraft carriers - I find them fascinating for some reason. More so the Brodie Rigs of LSTs 393 and 776 but
LST-906's flight deck (video) would probably be fairly easy to scratch build as well.

Aside from one-each of those I'd like a LST with a barrage balloon on the deck, a later model with an LCT on deck and some Rhino barges or causeways on the sides, and LST-821 Harnett County with the Seawolves in Vietnam. Not sure how many, if any, I'll pull off.

A quick update. I pulled out some old L'Arsenal GMC trucks I had (my set was all covered) as the AFV set, while nice, is essentially two each of a wide variety, which was not the usual LST load out. They are too wide, however, to fit around the elevator (aft tires are resting on top in the picture below):

Attachment:
AFV_73515_LST_16.jpg
AFV_73515_LST_16.jpg [ 59.44 KiB | Viewed 12792 times ]


The AFV club trucks are thinner and do fit, but Not with a clearance that I feel many drivers would feel comfortable with. I honestly don't know if this is L'Arsenal's fault or if the vehicles drove around or over the elevator and their dimensions are bang on. The plans show portable ramps at either end whereas the kit only has one, more permanent looking ramp. It looks like the deck to either side of the elevator platform might be too narrow for the larger trucks even in real life, but I don't have any good photos of a tank deck loaded up to know how this generally looked or how they unloaded.

Attachment:
LST-1-491 Elevator.jpg
LST-1-491 Elevator.jpg [ 153.06 KiB | Viewed 12792 times ]


Being familiar with the Washington State Ferries and how they load and unload, I had planned on having one truck on either side of the elevator platform driving around it, but now I'm leaning towards having a "wall" of trucks aft of the elevator to represent the unloaded vehicles waiting with a line of 2-3 between, one at the door and maybe one driving down off the elevator platform like below:

Attachment:
AFV_73515_LST_17.jpg
AFV_73515_LST_17.jpg [ 79.75 KiB | Viewed 12792 times ]


Not that much will be visible with the deck on - it at least appears it will fit without causing issues:

Attachment:
AFV_73515_LST_18.jpg
AFV_73515_LST_18.jpg [ 34.97 KiB | Viewed 12792 times ]

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Tracy White -Researcher@Large

"Let the evidence guide the research. Do not have a preconceived agenda which will only distort the result."
-Barbara Tuchman


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2019 1:53 pm 
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A nice surprise 36-hour power outage earlier this week put a crimp in my plans so I'm not as far as long as I'd like to be. Waiting for acrylic paint to cure lead me to hit the main deck structures a bit more. The bracing for the aft platform worked out pretty well with rectangles on both the main deck and platform overhead. I did one at a time, placed in the overhead holes, hit with Tamiya extra thin cement, fit to the deck, and set aside to dry. The single 40mm tub that sits above was a bit more fiddly. I wound up gluing both "legs" to the tub bottom, fitting it to the deck and pushing the tub around a bit until it looked level by eye and then letting it sit. It's not completely level but that might be a difference in leg height brought on by inadequate/unequal cleanup of the tops and bottoms. Something I'll check out this weekend and will hopefully be able to true with some sanding stick work. It's not really noticeable unless you're directly aft of it, and there's a 20mm bandstand behind that will prevent this, so I'm not all that worried:

Attachment:
AFV_73515_LST_19.jpg
AFV_73515_LST_19.jpg [ 42.9 KiB | Viewed 12662 times ]


Here's the stack as it is now:

Attachment:
AFV_73515_LST_20.jpg
AFV_73515_LST_20.jpg [ 40.2 KiB | Viewed 12662 times ]


The supports are a bit thick but not too bad and should be workable for those that don't want to deal with a lot of really fragile parts. AFV has announced / released a photo-etch set for it though that includes new trusses:

Attachment:
AFV_73515_PE.jpg
AFV_73515_PE.jpg [ 180.77 KiB | Viewed 12662 times ]


Lacking instructions it's hard to write a 100% quick review, but I can see lots of things that a company like Pontos might release in a supplemental set.

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"Let the evidence guide the research. Do not have a preconceived agenda which will only distort the result."
-Barbara Tuchman


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2019 10:51 pm 
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I think I just had an accident. Must have that photo etch set!! Thanks for finding that Tracy.


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