The Ship Model Forum

Thanks Bill. Thanks Jose. I also think she's one of the best looking ships of her time. Model wise I'm glad to finally see some real progress. It seems like I've been doing a lot of little stuff, but getting now where til recently. I moved the capstans back to their correct position relative to the breakwater. I hoped that the little extra bit of chain would help with the long look of the bow. I'm debating on whether to add the smaller chains to the main chains. Not sure though, since my other german ships don't have them. I'm not gonna do the cable reels or single guns this weekend since I don't really need them yet. I'll do the boats. I don't know if black lower hulls or red is correct. I've seen builds with both. I'm leaning towards black to match my other ships. Windows will be a problem. Initial spot light test fit has also failed. I'll have to go back to my prefered method. I also want to start working on the main mast. It's another area of the ship I really like. Dan.

Hi Everybody.

Well, things are slowing down again. At this rate, I wont finish it before my vacation. Guess I was overly optimistic.

There's only one or two problems with the instructions this time, depending on how you look at it.

1)G9 is located incorrectly.
2)From the pictures I've seen, (K30) should not be used in this time period, or at least not in this location. And it's mounting brace should be removed.


This is the first time I've ever used search lights with clear lenses. I didn't like it at all. They look terrible in my opinion. So I've started altering them to the way I like. First I drilled them out in order to make the walls as thin as possible. I went with a 9/64 in. drill bit, followed by a slightly larger 5/32 bit. I've repainted the silver insides and will now let them sit for a week to make sure the silver is totally dry.


The boat area is pretty much done. Just need some touch ups. I thought the windows looked way too thick so I tried the transparent blue marker that others have used on larger ships. It's not too bad, although I would have preferred windowless photo etch.


I've started applying the decking to the rear superstructure. I also decided to paint the thin area that outlines the decking in my dark deck color.


The mast is another one of my favorite areas. It's nice to finally be able to start working on it.
The pieces are kind of picky but it looks nice when all together. Rigging has started also. I'm hoping that it will be easier to do now rather than later. I'm basing it on a number of different pictures, so it's probably not going to be the most accurate. The first four strands have been applied. I painted them so that the camera could see them better. I figure another 20 strands and I'll have the main mast rigged. Almost forgot... I originally positioned the photo etch catapult boom in the same place as where the plastic one would have been. Now that the mast legs are in position, I found that the boom was too far back and couldn't clear the legs if it turned. So I managed to break off the boom and air tanks. Glue the air tanks back, and move the boom about 1/8 in. forward so now it has clearance.


Thanks for looking.

Dan.

Very nice, thanks for sharing.

The PE pipes around the turret barbettes - I don't have my instructions here with me to compare, but with your numbering you don't have "missing" parts?

Oh, when you tackle the ammo lockers on the deck on either side of the funnel, don't trust the instructions to get the correct halves of them glued together (look at their hinges) ...

You will find a missing bulwark around the aft 37mm twin mount on port side (Rob's plan has it, the kit not, the same applies to the degaussing cable, btw). The position of the ammo lockers there and on starboard side is very dubious as well ... (again the hinges ... which could be locks as well).

The smaller boat cranes ... I'm not sure about three PE pulleys on the end of the crane boom ...

Oh, and for anyone as blind as me, who didn't know where to put part M4 ... this is the centre stanchion connecting the two halves of the forward breakwater.

Happy modelling ~ Olaf!


EDIT: I just saw that you already explained all those problematic areas. I didn't see all the photos before replying. WTF?

Here you go on the small boat crane, Olaf.

Thanks Olaf. That's weird, the pictures not showing up. I didn't mean that the PE pipes are missing, just that the instructions are unclear on the correct way to shape them.

Rob, thanks for the information you supplied on kubaro's build thread. That explains the platform mystery. I think you did a great job designing her. Now I'm off to rebuild a couple things.

Dan.

I wish I could contribute more to your thread, Dan but most of the stuff you have touched on relates to the instructions, which I will agree need work. I spent a week going over those instructions to try and find every mistake I could. They were corrected a dozen times, but some of it you can't really know is wrong til you build it. Sadly I have not had time to do that.

Hi Dan ~ I think the problem was between my own ears ... I read page 1 and replied, not seeing the other pages of your build ...


True, the parts feature grooves telling you where to bend them. As for missing parts, the instruction shows part MA 29 on turret C and a fifth on turret A. My PE fret has only four of them.

Thanks for the clarification on the (not) missing bulwark K73 and the (not) missing platform L24. We could make a contest out of this, just cut off all the parts from the trees, throw them into the box, shake it well and then build the kit, HA! (or we should make your build log sticky for all future Scharnhorst builders ...)

@ Rob ~ Thanks a lot, now it makes sense!

Happy modelling ~ Olaf!

Well, I took the liberty of inserting a link to this thread in the first post of the Scharnhorst CASF thread, so it should have some semblance of permanence!

_________________
De quoi s'agit-il?

Thanks Tracy.

Thanks for your clarification Olaf. I haven't gotten that far in building the main guns yet, so I hadn't noticed the missing pipe. I'll have to deal with that when I get to that point. It should be easy enough to work with since I have other plans for that area already.

Dan.

Hi, everybody.

First of all, thanks Timmy C for posting the link. I was skimming quickly, and thanked the wrong person. Oops.

Rob, no problem, your renders have been extremely useful.

Olaf, you're right, about the missing pipe. I still haven't built that area yet. As far as I can tell, the mistake is with the pipes at the rear of C turret. The instructions call for a MA28 and a MA29 to be placed next to each other. Based on all the other pipes, that would be wrong. They curve in opposite directions and a situation like that is only seen at the center front of A turret. The curve seems to be based on air flowing from bow to stern, outward and around the turrets, with the solid down pipe getting hit by the wind first. So, with that in mind, I would guess that MA28 shouldn't even be there. Instead, I'd turn it over so that it curves in the same direction as the rest of the pipes on that side of the turret, and use it as a replacement for the missing 5th MA29.

******

What I weekend.....

Looking for more builds to watch and learn from, I stumbled upon a discussion of my build over at Finescale. I had no idea that cutting off the bow made me a "fanatic". Or that trying to log all the mistakes makes me a "nanny". Oh well, just opinions.

I filled the search lights with clear epoxy resin. Unfortunately, the resin was a too old and it clouded over. So the lights haven't turned out as good as I had planned.

In an apparent "Bruno like" moment. I took my Prinz Eugen out of the case to double check some Scharnhorst size questions I had, and dropped it, top down on the carpet. It even bounced once. Most rigging is broken and the main mast has been broken into three parts. I think the all metal foremast, rear range finder mast, tower yard arms, and prop guards I made for it, helped to protect most of the ship. The mast is back together now, and all that's needed is to rig it again.

As for Scharnhorst, based on the new information provided by Rob, I've reworked the front range finder area. Ladder moved back to the front side and a door added on the platform. Area was too short so the door had to be trimmed. It's now a small hatch.



Here is my progress on the rear superstructure. It's become too busy to hold, so I had to go ahead and glue it down. I've chosen a light yellow for the rafts on the idea that while the ship has been painted often, the rafts have probably faded. I've also added a rear staircase near C turret from spare parts. I'm not sure on the exact location or angle but it should be somewhere back there. By the look of it, you'd think that the rear superstructure is close to being done. Nope. I count about 50-60 more pieces left to add. It's insane.


Rigging is still being done. I plan to do the rear rigging and the front rigging separately and then the rigging between the two ends last. I've added some flags to liven it up, and to give it some personal meaning. Hopefully I found the correct ones on the net. After taking this picture, I noticed that one flag was upside down. I've corrected that since then.


Instruction wise, not a whole lot this week. Cabinet(N18) locations on the rear deck with the white anti-aircraft gun are vague, but not really important. Cable reels at the front of the hanger should be put in place before the surrounding rack(N23,N56,N57) and the walkways(K65,K66). They make for a tight fit. And I wouldn't bother using the ladders(MC22) at the front of those same walkways. They come down directly in front of the doorways on (K28) and they are blocked at the top by the railings(MD3).

That's it for this week. Thanks for looking.

Dan.

Hi Dan ~ Good to see some progress on yours. Too bad about the Prinz. Did at least the drop answer your size questions? I have that funny feeling that the 105mm mounts are somehow too flat on the Trumpy kit.

With regard to the pipes, we will have to look at photos taken on the actual ship. I'm not quite sure if the orientation of the pipes has something to do with wind directions. I would have guessed that they were 'bent' away from incoming water masses. I think these were pipes to lead air out of the ammunition magazines when there is the need to flood them. The least thing you want to have is watering entering through the pipes (possibly they had one-way valves built in).

Your hangar area looks good, I'm still having problems with the angled walkway just aft/beneath of the catapult. There is so much clutter that I just can't find it on photos. What I see is a small stairway or ladder on port side, leading up to the catapult platform. With this in mind, the angled platform maybe lead to this ladder, across the aft part of the hangar. What I'm missing is the other, aft end of the angled walkway. How was access to this granted? A ladder on the stb side of the hangar maybe? I fail to see a reason for the walkway. On photos sailors are walking on the sliding hangar roof(s), so why this walkway on the aft part?

Then, the reels beneath the AA platforms on either side of the hangar. I found it quite difficult attaching them with the small PE parts provided. I left the PE off, then it worked. Again, so much clutter there, nobody will notice. The railing around the platforms, with the outboard slant, were difficult too. I covered them with canvas dodgers (whiteglue) and they look better now.

Your life rafts ~ Is it too late to make them dark? Some of them (the squared ones) were even incorporated into the camouflage pattern ...

Happy modelling ~ Olaf!

Hi Olaf,

The 105's do look too flat on top.

I'll post something on that walkway next weekend. Mine is angled wrong, too late now. The only useful purpose I can think of for that walkway is as a level platform for when working on the underside of the rear of the catapault.
I left the same pe off the cable reels. And I lowered them to be used instead of railing.

It's not too late for the rafts. I can still repaint them. What do you recommend?

Dan.

Exactly. It's your model, you build it how you want, and screw anyone who doesn't like it.


Ouch!

Been following along with great interest, while simultaneously fighting the urge to pull Scharny out of the stash and start on it!

_________________
Martin

"Tomorrow is the most important thing in life. Comes into us at midnight very clean. It's perfect when it arrives and it puts itself in our hands. It hopes we've learned something from yesterday." John Wayne

Ship Model Gallery

Thanks Martin.
I wish I had a second one. I could have been more bold with this one and could use it as a guide to build a better one. But the cost is just too high for me to justify a second one. And of course, no place to put it anyways.
Dan.

I would paint them to match the background, even if this means to have a raft in two colours. The KM paint regulation calls for certain paints/colours/shades to be used, but I think this is one of the occasion where they did not follow them as they had their own ideas how to paint the rafts.

Happy painting ~ Olaf

Olaf,
Thanks for the advice. Would that include the oval rafts as well? Or just the square ones? I didn't know that they ever painted the rafts.
Dan.

The problem is that I see dark ovals. The area behind is not really visible from the angles of particular photos. I can't share them, but I see the structure the catapult is sitting on, in a dark colour - on the other hand, it could be just shadow - the catapult itself is light in colour. The next problem is, that you could look through some of the ovals. It is very difficult to distinguish between the bottom of an oval raft or the background behind it. On your model the hangar is light, and so far, I'm not quite sure where the transitions from dark to light should be. I see it on the squared rafts and across the boats (they match the pattern of background, dark and light), everything else is just walking through a dark forest with just a tiny torch as a light source ... but to me it seems as if the light patch was much, much smaller on the actual ship.
One other common misconception is, to put those oval rafts on the outboard facing sides of the railings on either side of the hangar walkways. I may be wrong but I think they positioned them on the insides ...

On the photos showing the overall dark camouflage, the one prior to yours, all rafts seem to be dark as well. Maybe they did not all of them incorporate into the final camouflage?

Sorry, that I can't be of better help ...

Happy painting ~ Olaf!

I never thought about the rafts being on the inside of the railing. I'll look into that just to try and find out, but I think it's too late for the model. The super glue would probably ruin the railing if I remove the rafts.
Dan.

Dan, I'm sorry, but I had a look at the photos again, and I have to admit that I was wrong. What I thought were railings, were in fact the crane wires, just in front of the ovals, and in the 'perfect' angle to pass as railing wires ...

I'm very sorry for the confusion and I hope you did not change it - and maybe ruined your railing by trying to remove the ovals. For years I really thought they put the rafts behind the railings ... call me a moron ...

Happy modelling ~ Olaf!