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ottoirving
PostPosted: Sat Sep 19, 2009 11:33 am 
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Hello Kameraden,
Well i don`t have much time in the ship modeling, but i bought a trumpeter Buckley Class Destroyer and the White Ensign Models Conversion for the Captain Class Destroyer, but i have a question about wich colors would be better for the camouflage, because i have not found a good source of info, perhaps you have. I give some photos, so we can learn together. Greetings
HMS Mounsey (K 569)- The way i see it is all light gray
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HMS Gould (K 476) - Gray with some little light blue?
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HMS Goodall (K 479)
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HMS Balfour
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HMS Ekins
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HMS_Cosby_(K559)
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HMS Trollope
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HMS Torrington, March 1944.
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HMS Stockham
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HMS Rutherford
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HMS Riou, April 1944.
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HMS Hotham, March 1944.
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HMS Hargood.
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HMS Halsted, January 1944.
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HMS Fitzroy, February 1944.
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HMS Ekins
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ottoirving
PostPosted: Sat Sep 19, 2009 11:52 am 
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jRatz wrote:
EPinniger wrote:
This thread reminds me of a question I have about the British Captain-class frigates (Buckley-class in RN service):
What were the main differences (in armament configuration, fittings, etc.) between the standard USN Buckleys and the RN Captains?


I should have looked out here earlier -- I am doing the Trumpeter Buckley as HMS Ekins, a Captain Class Frigate, in her role as a Coastal Forces Control Frigate (with the 2-pdr on the foredeck). I have both the WEM & GMM PE sets, and WEM paints. This photo is Ekins ...

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To answer the question above; There were some 90 modifications to a Buckley DE to meet RN standards. The most obvious were the removal of the torpedo tubes and the quad 1.1, the replacement of 4 of the 8 K-guns with larger on-deck storage racks, and of course electronics. They also removed the ice cream maker and other comfort items not present in Nelson's day ...

References
The Destroyer Escort England, Al Ross, Conway Maritime Press, 1985, ISBN:0851773257.
The Captain Class Frigates in the 2nd World War, Donald Collingwood, Naval Institute Press, 1999, ISBN:1555701955.
Destroyer Escorts In Action>, Al Adcock, Squadron Warships #11, 1997, ISBN:0897473787.
The Buckley-Class Destroyer Escorts, Bruce Franklin, Naval Institute Press, 1999, ISBN:1557502803.
Allied Escort Ships of World War II, Peter Elliott, Naval Institute Press, 1977, ISBN:0356084019.
American Destroyer Escorts of World War 2, Peter Elliott, Almark Press, 1974, ISBN:0855241616.
Warship Perspective, Camouflage Vol 3, RN 1943-44, Alan Raven, WR Press, 2001.
Naval Camouflage 1914-1945, David Williams, Naval Institute Press, 2001, ISBN: 1557504962.

I have the hull cleaned up, the deck structures modified and cleaned up, and am now replacing ladders & w/t doors with PE prior to painting. I am at a halt because of other things, but expect to pick up work again shortly and will post some pix ...

From my research, Ekins came in a US version of RN camo, was repainted into a two-tone green Western Approaches scheme, then into a gray Channel scheme. However, the picture above suggests that it is more likely an Admiralty Alternate scheme, perhaps partially applied over previous schemes. Anyway, from my references, it would appear the hull up to the up to the sheer line is G20 Medium Gray-Green, and G45 Light Gray above. Note the funnel and the X & Y gun platforms appear to be in White, perhaps leftover from the Western Approaches scheme. The horizontal surfaces should be B15 Dark Blue-Grey I believe, but have no photos thereof.

Help Meanwhile, to ensure everyone knows I'm not an expert, can someone tell me what a typical RN "boot stripe" size, location, color might be ??? Baring anything specific, give me something in general - I'd like to get it at least close as this is the next step in my hull painting.

Thanks,
John

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ottoirving
PostPosted: Sat Sep 19, 2009 12:07 pm 
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WIKIPEDIA SOURCE


Camouflage and insignia

Following standard Royal Navy protocols, all of the Captains had large pennant numbers painted on the sides and stern of the hull,[28] usually in blue, red or black.[29] The escort groups to which most of the Captains were assigned had their own individual insignia, where these distinctive and colourful designs were painted on the side of the ship's funnel,[18] and if the ship was home to the escort group senior officer it would also have a coloured band painted around the top of the funnel (usually in blue or red).[18] The ship's waterline was always in black.[29]

A total of five different camouflage schemes were employed on the Captains.[18]

1. The ships came from the shipyards in light grey with a few light blue stripes.[18]
2. For those Captains assigned to the North Atlantic, a scheme consisting of light and dark blues and greens, with some soft white was adopted as it was believed that this would blend with the sea colour in bad weather.[18]
3. For those Captains assigned to the English Channel in 1944 (Coastal Forces control frigates and those assigned to Operation Neptune as headquarters ships), a bold design in black, blue, light grey and white was adopted.[18]
4. For those Captains assigned to the 16th Flotilla (Harwich) and 21st Flotilla (Sheerness) operating in the North Sea and English Channel, a scheme consisting of horizontal upper deck divisions of light and dark grey (as used by the US Navy) was adopted.[18]
5. Early in 1945, a scheme was adopted that was to be common to all Royal Navy ships, consisting of white with a sky blue stripe along the hull.

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Building:
1/700 IJN Ise. (Hasegawa)
1/700 Crucero Baleares. (HP Models)
1/700 IJN Shinano. (Tamiya)

Next
1/700 DKM Graf Spee.
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ar
PostPosted: Sun Sep 20, 2009 8:37 am 
The usual wikipedia rubbish.
Alan Raven


Irving Gonzalez wrote:
WIKIPEDIA SOURCE (SNIP)


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awetherhorn
PostPosted: Mon Sep 21, 2009 4:32 am 
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To provide more precise information regarding the camouflage colors:
The Captain class ships were completed in US shipyards. At completion they were painted in an American version that was similar to the RN Western Approaches scheme. The US pattern was not identical on both port and starboard and is well illustrated above and at Navsource.com. The colors used were American and usually identified as 5-P (pale grey) and 5-S(Sea blue, although the latter is more likely to have been 5-N (Navy blue) since 5-S had been discontinued much earlier. This pattern was carried through the working up period, usually off Bermuda, until the ships reached British ports.
A new pattern using RN colors was then applied.
Some ships were repainted in an overall light grey (507C). AYLMER (K463) and Bentley (K465) were among the ships repainted this way.
Others were given a standard western approaches pattern, identical on both sides, using white and B55. B55 was originally a light blue, but by late in the war the blue tint had been dropped and the color was closer to a neutral grey. This pattern was actually carried by Bickerton (K466) and Kempthorne (K483), as well as others.
DEs operating in the English Channel usually carried an admiralty disruptive design. The Admiralty Light Disruptive scheme, which called for G10, B30, G45 and B55, was used on Holmes (K581).
Other DEs operating in these waters used a simpler pattern similar to US measure 22 but possibly using G45 and B55. Dakins (K550) and Ekins (K552) are 2 examples of DEs with this scheme.
Another variation was the Admiralty standard scheme in use at the end of the war. The ship was given an overall coat of one color, with a central hull panel in another. The photo of Balfour (K464) earlier in this thread shows its appearance. Western approaches ships used this scheme using white and B55 (Admiralty standard C) But other color combinations were possible, such as B20 and G45 or B30 and B55, depending upon duty stations.
I think this provides a clearer explanation of colors to use than the "rubbish" on Wikipedia.
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Moline
PostPosted: Thu Apr 01, 2010 12:15 am 
Hi there:

I just received the HMCS Snowberry Flower Class corvette by Revelle. I feel extremely lucky since this not manufactured any more. Although the is not the exact match to his ship, it is as close as I can get.

This ship project is a memorial to my father, Frank, who served on such a corvette which was on loan to the US Navy.
The project, hopefully, will bring new information about my father who passed away 20 years ago.

I have a few photos of him on board ship, but the photos are mostly of the topside while he was at battle stations (he was a radioman - you can tell it's him by the oversized helmet he wore to accomodate his earphones.

I want to the best job possible regarding painting this and hope someone out there might have a photo or two of a flower class corvette painted in camouflage.

Any help would be greatly appreciated....

Thanks

Regards

John
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Tracy White
PostPosted: Thu Apr 01, 2010 11:12 am 
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Hi John... it would help if we knew which ship he was on; some were kept in RN paint and some were repainted in US colors. USS Tenacity PG-71, for example, was painted in Measure 12 Modified:
http://www.steelnavy.com/USCGcorvettes.htm

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Sean
PostPosted: Thu Jan 06, 2011 6:50 pm 
My father served on HMS Hargood, and he still tells me about having to paint a dark blue and white chequer board pattern around the top of the funnel. Having finished the job, which took him all day under the watchful eye of the CPO, he was just collecting his rags,turps, etc. off the top of the stack, when he slipped and knocked over a tin of bitumen which then poured all over the new markings, which seconds earlier the Chief had been happily admiring. As the youngest sailor on board my dad then learnt many new and original expletives lovingly screamed in his lughole!
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phil newson
PostPosted: Tue Mar 12, 2019 3:44 pm 
Hi Sean
My Dad was on the Hargood as well.
I have put some of his photos on a website
https://hargood.weebly.com/

regards
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