RN Steam Picket boat (1900) 1/48th Scale

Neptune · **Posted:** Tue Mar 25, 2014 5:39 am

Awesome work as before of course.

The navigation light is one option, but I'm not sure of it. I'm more leaning towards a part used for hoisting those funnels, perhaps with a wooden block attached somewhere forward or aft, depending on which direction they folded.
The picture you show with the Arrow is a pretty large scale picture, a navigation light at that bracket would most certainly be seen. So either it's just missing because they remove it during lowering or uprighting of the funnels, or to put it "on" if it's a real lantern, or it's just not meant to be there.
On the other side, in favor of the light bracket, would be that those funnels are probably not that heavy to lift (considering they hinge and aren't that tall), so a block was probably not necessary to lift them. Perhaps one guy on each funnel would do (considering the bracket in between, they should be erected together). Just a couple of thoughts though.
Also, I'm not sure when the actual colregs were implemented. For small boats, an all-round visible light can suffice (depending on size of the boat) and the position on that bracket, pretty much the highest point, would be perfect for an all-round visible light.

Glen the Rotorhead · **Joined:** Wed Nov 19, 2008 9:14 am **Posts:** 107

Folgore wrote:

Some sort of "custom repair" I guess :big_grin:

Maybe for hoisting the boat on davits without having to remove the rudder and tiller?

PICKETBOAT · **Posted:** Tue Mar 25, 2014 2:16 pm

Neptune and all

Here is a picture of a single funnel picket boat about the same date, 1900. You can see that there is a mounting bracket for a single nav light on the funnel. It's interesting what Neptune said. Maybe only one light was deemed sufficient on smaller vessels until some time later. I have seen pictures of twin funnelled boats with a single light bracket on the starboard funnel. And we can now see that sometimes the single nav light may have been mounted on the "multi functional" bracket joining the two funnels.

I think we can conclude from various pictures that these vessels, around 1900 (both single and twin funnel versions) seem to have been fitted to carry a single light on or between the funnels.

A little later (1912 ish) they seem to be fitted with (removable) frames and brackets either side of the boiler room roof, which carried coloured nav lights with reflector boards. See my previously posted picture of a contemporary ship model with two picket boats stowed on deck. Both have these twin coloured lights on stands.

I guess it all goes to show that little was standardised and as different companies had a go at producing these little boats, over a period of 30 or 40 years, there was often quite a variation and not just in the nav lights.

Neptune · **Posted:** Tue Mar 25, 2014 2:38 pm

I've been checking now and it appears that the first colregs, where these regulations are placed, were only made in 1960 (sort of surprising since they are already completely outdated by now), and updated in 1972. I thought they were much older, but then again, the Titanic disaster happened only in 1912, and that's kind of the start of safety and regulations at sea. So your boat sort of predates all these regulations.
There might have been a seperate set of regulations (RN specific or otherwise) that regulated such things, but I can't seem to find much on that. I guess it truly was dependent on the yard or customer (RN in this case) what was mounted.

Here are the requirements from current Colregs:

Quote:

(i). A power-driven vessel of less than 12 metres in length may in lieu of the lights prescribed in paragraph (a) of this
Rule exhibit an all-round white light and sidelights;
(ii). a power-driven vessel of less than 7 metres in length whose maximum speed does not exceed 7 knots may in lieu
of the lights prescribed in paragraph (a) of this Rule exhibit an all-round white light and shall, if practicable, also exhibit
sidelights;
(iii). the masthead light or all-round white light on a power-driven vessel of less than 12 metres in length may be
displaced from the fore and aft centreline of the vessel if centreline fitting is not practicable, provided that the sidelights
are combined in one lantern which shall be carried on the fore and aft centreline of the vessel or located as nearly as
practicable in the same fore and aft line as the masthead light or the all-round white light.

I'm assuming that these regulations, although much less old than your boat, are still based on something that existed before, and I'm rather sure the RN practices had a lot of influence (since the regulations that are specific for carriers and submarines etc. are based on specific RN subs etc.). As you can see in those rules, there's a lot space for interpretation by the words "if practicable".

PICKETBOAT · **Posted:** Tue Mar 25, 2014 4:53 pm

Neptune

I just love it when these threads turn into an informative and very interesting historic "fact swap". I knew nothing much about nav lights on smaller vessels, but now I feel I have a bit of an idea.

Thanks Neptune.

PICKETBOAT · **Posted:** Wed Mar 26, 2014 3:15 am

Hi all

These two pictures show clearly how I managed to make a “dog’s dinner” of what should have been a simple task. The two stay bars for the ensign flag staff should have been attached through two holes drilled in the aft lip of the cockpit (arrowed) not into the deck.

As the flag staff on the real vessel could be dismantled one assumes these stay bars threaded through the metal edge of the cockpit and were locked on the inside some how.

If I had got it right in the first place I would not have had to shorten the tiller slightly to get it to clear!

The pictures also show the seat cushions. One assumes on these vessels they were covered with either leather or “oil cloth”. I painted them a very dark grey/green but I am sure colours such as black or brown would also be suitable. The buttoning was reproduced with a fine DVD marker pen.

Dummy rudder control rods/cables were added along the deck edge (arrowed in blue) joining the two sets of deck mounted pulleys. These were made from fine wire and ran along side the cockpit edge.

PICKETBOAT · **Posted:** Thu Mar 27, 2014 2:59 am

Hi all

I have already out lined how the boiler room roof was made removable so as to gain access to the internals.

The roof of the cabin was also removable to gain access to the main on/off switch. I wanted to make sure the roof of the cabin did not get lost while sailing. I also wanted to make sure that the power switch was kept away from water which would certainly not do it any good.

To achieve these aims I cut a small panel of 4mm thick “Foamex” board to fit neatly into the hole in the cabin top. This was CA glued under the cabin roof. After a small amount of trimming it became a tight push fit. Cutting the “Foamex” with a slight taper helped and its in built flexibility helped keep the cabin roof fixed in place.

In these pictures you can also clearly see the dummy rudder control cables along the deck edge (arrowed).

PICKETBOAT · **Posted:** Fri Mar 28, 2014 7:21 am

Hi all

This forum based “on line build” is rapidly catching up with the real build. The final bits of detail, and the finished “on the water“photos will be posted, but they will take a little longer, so keep watching.

The one major item still missing from the model at this stage is the 3 pound QF gun mounted forward on the “fustrum”.

As I have previously said, in practise these weapons were not fitted unless they were absolutely necessary so I could have easily left it off the model. They were intended as anti torpedo boat weapons, but when mounted, their weight dragged the bows down in the water and must have affected the vessels performance considerably. How easy these guns were to use, and how accurately they could be, aimed from a small boat bouncing up and down, is questionable.

In modelling the gun I referred to line drawings/plans and photos I had of a 3 pound Hotchkiss weapon of this period. In fact I had already made a master and mould as I had previously resin cast five of these weapons at 1/48th scale for a model of HMTBD Velox. The picture shows one installed on Velox and arrowed so as not to be muddled with the 12 pounder on the conning tower roof.

Folgore · **Joined:** Sat Jan 25, 2014 4:04 am **Posts:** 67

Hello Picketboat

Facing the same challenge in the near future I am very curious about the 3 pounder.
By the way, your Velox looks fantastic! I love the card table. I'm sure it must have been
the fastest pram in town.

Regards

Chrischan

PICKETBOAT · **Posted:** Sat Mar 29, 2014 2:41 am

Chrischan

Thanks for the comments.

Folgore wrote:

I love the card table. I'm sure it must have been
the fastest pram in town.

She certainly was the fastest "pram in town" when she was first commissioned. I'm sure the crew would have found it quite exhilarating playing "cards" on the card table at 27 knots!

PICKETBOAT · **Posted:** Mon Mar 31, 2014 4:09 pm

Hi all

Here are just a few notes on casting the 3 pound QF gun in resin. These notes apply to any weapon/searchlight or free standing technically complicated unit or deck fixture.

Having obtained plans/drawings for the weapon I thought carefully how it could be dismantled into individual components.

These were not necessarily the individual components that were bolted together to create the original weapon.

I was important to think from the point of casting the components. If all the parts are cast on one casting base then you have to think carefully where each component’s flat surfaces will be. These are potentially the flat surfaces which will be in contact with the casting base and will therefore have to be sawn off. Generally (but by no means a hard and fast rule) these are assembly surfaces or faces. So when a component is saw off the base, the sawn surface, after sanding, will be the surface which is glued to its neighbour or possibly the deck or other part of the completed model.

That’s a complicated paragraph. Basically I’m saying “forget how the original gun was assembled and explode it into “castable” components” with their main flat surface in contact with the base. :eyebrows:

I hope you understood this.

I have included a drawn sketch of how the 3 pound gun was divided up into its component parts.

PICKETBOAT · **Posted:** Tue Apr 01, 2014 5:27 am

Hi all

Here are a couple of pictures showing the one piece casting for the main components of the 3 pound QF gun. As with all these resin castings I found that a fine fret saw blade removes the fittings from the base easily.

The casting included a cone shaped gun mount and a deck mounted “ready use” ammo locker, both of which were not needed in this instance.

Lined up in the picture are the bits and piece to be assembled. From left to right:-

1mm soft steel wire.

0.5mm brass wire.

2mm brass tube.

Resin gun mounting ring.

Resin main body of the gun (the red arrow indicates the flat where the stock is mounted).

Resin stock.

Resin breach block.

Assembly was with CA glue and as many holes as possible were drilled with a pin vice before the component was removed from the base.

All pretty basic stuff really.

As this is 1/48th scale (technically large scale), I used the different bits of wire to create the detail on the gun. If this gun was being modelled at a smaller scale, PE fittings would have been better.

I have no immediate plans for learning the “dark art” of PE as mastering all the other, casting and moulding techniques is already giving me a bit of a “brain burster”. :lol_3:

PICKETBOAT · **Posted:** Wed Apr 02, 2014 11:13 am

Hi all

The cast resin components of the gun went together very quickly. The thin and slender shoulder stock looks pretty fragile but it is surprisingly flexible and strong enough for the job. Lets face it this is a small scale model, so its not going to get knocked about (hopefully), even if it is a working model.

The wire components were glued in place and the gun was mounted on a short length of 1mm wire. This is useful for holding it during the painting stage and will also be used to mount in on the “fustrum”.

PICKETBOAT · **Posted:** Tue Apr 08, 2014 2:47 am

Hi all

The three pound gun was painted in a smart "Edwardian" polished gun metal colour with a slightly different bronze colour for the breach block, operating handles and barrel tip. The shoulder stock had a padded roll along the part that fitted into the gun layers shoulder. These were sometimes covered in a rope binding or sometimes a padded canvas roll. They would often be "blanco white" to make them smart. I painted it off white on this model.
A small hole was drilled into the "fustrum" so that the wire threaded into it. I did not glue mine in place, but I left the wire quite long to reduce the chance of the gun falling overboard. I could therefore sail (or display) the model with or without the weapon. I could also remove the gun if I was carrying out any internal maintenance to give me a bit more room.

PICKETBOAT · **Posted:** Thu Apr 10, 2014 4:21 pm

Hi all

A small but interesting "aside" to this build. I just came across this image of a civilian version of one of these picket boats. This seems to have been taken just before the first war and shows that the companies making these little vessels for the Royal Navy soon realized they could sell them to wealthy yacht owners as tenders.
I quite fancy building a second version like this based on my vac formed hull.
The text accompanying the picture identifies the vessel as "Rosemary" R.Y.S.

Folgore · **Joined:** Sat Jan 25, 2014 4:04 am **Posts:** 67

Hello Picketboat!

I have been under way for a couple of days, so I'm a little late.

The QF Gun is really good looking! I love this gun metal finish.

That civil version is very appealing indeed. Imagine a scale Ship
Parade with dozens of them, colorful flags, blowing horns, steam,
rowboats, marvellous cruisers and... well, anyway... :thumbs_up_1:

Sincerely

Chrischan

PICKETBOAT · **Posted:** Fri Apr 18, 2014 2:26 am

Chrischan

There is an increasing (all be it slowly) interest in the late Victorian and Edwardian Navy from modelers and I have a long term plan to organize some modelers and try and get a reasonable selection of vessels onto the water at the same time. A sort of miniature low key Spit head Revue! It would be amazing if the models were a similar scale but I think that's too much to hope for.
At the moment there seems to be great interest (in the UK) in models of WW1 vessels (this being the centenary of the start of the war to end all wars) and many previously stored in lofts and basements are seeing the light of day after being dusted off and over hauled.

wefalck · **Posted:** Fri Apr 18, 2014 3:01 am

Actually, in Germany we have an 'Interest Group Imperial Navy' who meet regularly to put their RC models onto the water and a Web-forum, focusing on the German steam navies pre-1918: http://www.u-boot-net.de/phpBB/index.php?sid=00c9f8110b59a24fcddbb6073fe26175. Most people though seem to focus on the period 1890-1918, with not so much interest in the more evolutionary time before the massive post-1890 building programmes.

wefalck

PICKETBOAT · **Posted:** Tue Apr 22, 2014 11:31 am

Wefalk

Thanks for this link. I some how knew about this interest group but did not have a link.

With the aid of Google translate I can probably navigate my way around it and glean information.

It would be wonderful to take my models over and join in on a sailing day. May be one day.

Thanks again.

PICKETBOAT · **Posted:** Tue Apr 22, 2014 11:34 am

Hi all

Well after the brief look at the civilian version of a steam picket boat, here are a couple of pictures of the nearly completed RN version I am building.

It only remains for me to add some minor small fittings and these will be covered in my next few posts.

Hope you like it so far.

The Ship Model Forum

RN Steam Picket boat (1900) 1/48th Scale

Who is online