The Ship Model Forum

The Ship Modelers Source
It is currently Tue Jul 01, 2025 2:34 am

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 925 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 43, 44, 45, 46, 47
Author Message
PostPosted: Fri Jan 03, 2025 8:25 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Dec 01, 2012 7:11 am
Posts: 44
Location: chelmsford essex
thanks Mark


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Wed Jan 22, 2025 7:12 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Dec 01, 2012 7:11 am
Posts: 44
Location: chelmsford essex
I've really enjoyed this build, the 1/200 kit is amazing out of the box and it's enabled me to learn a lot, both with regards to the build and to the actual ship. I've still got so many unanswered questions three of which I was hoping someone would know the answer for certain, both relating to equipment colour, neither being specific to Hornet I guess.

The first one concerns the colour of the tractors on the ship - I assumed yellow but the black and white photos I've found don't help as they show different shades in different pictures. Or would these be camouflaged like the aircraft ?

I'm also adding some interior stuff to the large hanger deck and thought the would be firefighting equipment scattered throughout the ship but I can't find any info on what was used and colour of said equipment (I know WW2 aircraft fire extinguishers were bronze not red, is this the same for USN ships). Adding a few small items of colour on a largely white and grey background would be nice.

Finally, the pictures I've seen of the Hornet prior to sinking shows what appears to be a very weathered painted white wave at the front of the hull. However I've also read that this was just heavy weathering of the hull blue paint so I'm uncertain what this is and therefore how to approach replicating it (I would take a different approach if it's just weathered hull blue paint).

Any expert views on this three would be really helpful

thanks
neil


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Wed Jan 22, 2025 9:04 am 
Offline
Model Monkey
Model Monkey

Joined: Sat Aug 20, 2005 9:27 pm
Posts: 4046
Location: USA
The color of deck tractors, moto-tugs, deck jeeps, cranes, and other vehicles is difficult to answer from photos. Comparatively few photos of the Yorktown-class (and other wartime classes) are known to be in original color. Fewer still show any deck tractors at all. There may be documentary evidence and Tracy White, who frequents this site, may be able to answer that question. Absence that, we can turn to photos of other contemporary ships for an answer, such as Essex-class and Independence-class ships.

Photos taken during the war of Essex-class ships indicate that deck tractors and jeeps on board probably varied in color, either gray or olive drab. This may be due to who procured the vehicle under which contract. Different services (Army, Navy) had different equipment procurement responsibility at that time. In other words, one service would be responsible for procuring all of one type of equipment for all services. For example, the Army would be responsible to procure M1 helmets for all services. If the equipment was sourced under an Army contract, it would come painted olive drab and normally be put into service in that color. Likewise, if the equipment was sourced under a Navy procurement contract, it was likely to arrive gray and serve in gray. This means that it is possible to have a gray Navy-procured tractor or moto-tug next to an olive drab Army-procured jeep on the same deck at the same time.

In the first photo shown below, notice that the jeeps appear distinctly darker than the tugs. The jeeps may be olive drab and the tugs may be gray but it is very difficult to know with any certainty from the photo.

Complicating the issue, crews could repaint the equipment to any color if locally directed to do so.

Unfortunately, surviving color photos aren't very helpful; typically, no deck equipment is visible in the photos. And for those few photos where deck equipment is visible, the photo is in black and white, so no joy (see examples below).

Hopefully, Tracy can provide some help in answering your question. Ultimately, it's your model. Paint the equipment to your liking.
Attachment:
CV-17 1945.jpg
CV-17 1945.jpg [ 143.77 KiB | Viewed 1929 times ]

Attachment:
CV-17 Bunker Hill 1945_4 318341084_5973722815980745_8973806155788792694_n.jpg
CV-17 Bunker Hill 1945_4 318341084_5973722815980745_8973806155788792694_n.jpg [ 46.03 KiB | Viewed 1929 times ]

Regarding Hornet's colors, the Trumpeter painting guides are a bit off. The sides of the real ship itself were painted in 3 colors: a dark blue, a medium gray (called "ocean gray") and a light gray (called "haze gray") with blue and ocean gray on the hull and ocean gray and haze gray on the island. Trumpeter drawings show only 2 colors, not 3, and the pattern shown in Trumpeter drawings does not match photos of the actual ship. Photos below show the three colors well and the actual pattern.

And yes, evidence suggests that what appears to be a white bow wave is merely worn away paint exposing the primer below (see bottom 2 photos). The actual, official painting scheme used by Hornet, called a "measure", did not include a false bow wave.

Hope this helps!


Attachments:
CV-8 Hornet 1942 HornetCamoCompare2.jpg
CV-8 Hornet 1942 HornetCamoCompare2.jpg [ 89.97 KiB | Viewed 1929 times ]
CV-8 Hornet 1942 HornetCamoCompare.jpg
CV-8 Hornet 1942 HornetCamoCompare.jpg [ 51.2 KiB | Viewed 1929 times ]
CV-8 Hornet 1942.jpg
CV-8 Hornet 1942.jpg [ 126.38 KiB | Viewed 1929 times ]
CV-8 Hornet 1942_02_28 020831e.jpg
CV-8 Hornet 1942_02_28 020831e.jpg [ 175.91 KiB | Viewed 1929 times ]
CV-8 Hornet 1942_05 img082.jpg
CV-8 Hornet 1942_05 img082.jpg [ 1.86 MiB | Viewed 1929 times ]
CV-8 Hornet 1942_02 island aft2.jpg
CV-8 Hornet 1942_02 island aft2.jpg [ 228.93 KiB | Viewed 1924 times ]
CV-8 hornet_scan.jpg
CV-8 hornet_scan.jpg [ 60.55 KiB | Viewed 1924 times ]
CV-8 Hornet 1942_05 a.jpg
CV-8 Hornet 1942_05 a.jpg [ 3.88 MiB | Viewed 1924 times ]
CV-8 Hornet 1942_05 img084.jpg
CV-8 Hornet 1942_05 img084.jpg [ 502.26 KiB | Viewed 1924 times ]

_________________
Have fun, Monkey around.™

-Steve L.

Complete catalog: - https://www.model-monkey.com/
Follow Model Monkey® on Facebook: - https://www.facebook.com/modelmonkeybookandhobby
Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Wed Jan 22, 2025 10:30 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Dec 01, 2012 7:11 am
Posts: 44
Location: chelmsford essex
Steve, thanks - that does help massively.

I will paint the tugs is OD and Grey so there's some variation. And the bow wave thing is also a great help - it does look more like weathered paint (in fact in one of the photos it looks like the plimsoll line has weathered as well). I now know how I will treat this area when it comes to painting.

As an aircraft modeller, I'm staggered at the amount of reference material available for that side of the hobby compared to ship building (well at least this ship) - I will never again moan about rubbish black & white German WW2 photos as I now know they are perfect as reference in comparison.

thanks again
neil


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Fri Jan 24, 2025 8:40 am 
Offline

Joined: Tue May 10, 2005 7:50 pm
Posts: 38
Photo of tractor of CV-8 taken by the research vessel R/V Petrel


Attachments:
uss-hornet.jpg
uss-hornet.jpg [ 69.73 KiB | Viewed 1865 times ]
Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 925 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 43, 44, 45, 46, 47

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 7 guests


You can post new topics in this forum
You can reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group