HMS Mary Rose sailing warship Henry VIII English Navy 1545

[JIM BAUMANN]

The midships waist area had a number of sliding doors ( archers blinds ) these were painted alternately

I had previously opened some of these, and now had to cut the decals into individual pieces to get the correct alternate repeat

closer study of the few images showed the white areas fwd and aft to contain hatch doors;

I made these by cutting 1/ 700 round topped PE doors in half-- fiddly and wasteful as the cuts were not horizontal but angled

these were applied to the white decalled hull sides with matt varnish

Once painted they were pleasingly subtle

Alarm!!

study of the same painting--and drawings and plans etc led me to the conclusion that there was a flaw in the PE decks...
more accurately there was a missing level. !

I had already queried in my subconscious mind the gargantuan high bulwarks on the aft poop-

-and in truth, on the real thing they were very high... but... !

AHA !!

obviously the cure was to make and install new deck-piece--this tricky to template up, make and install ,
as the hull tapers severely inboard aft and the deck-footprint is rather wider than the aperture available to insert!

I used a scale figure to check out headroom and feasible deck heights above and below

I made an initial paper half folding template, then converted it to ( hinged by groing plasticard and after quite a few test-fittings (!!! )
was happy with the fit

I then made a final deck with mast holes positioned , and having worked out a ' wiggle-path' will insert it as a whole piece

attention future builders of this kit ==> make and install this deck BEFORE you glue up the hull !

More progress soon!

Jim Baumann

[Frank Spahr]

Wow.

Now this is not what I had expected from you, Jim - but you�re the one to pull this thing off in a grand manner! It�s great to follow your progress and to see with which solutions you come up.

Staying tuned

Frank

[dafi]

Wonderful project in true JB-Style!

Love it

XXXDAn

[scalewarship]

The midships waist area had a number of sliding doors ( archers blinds ) these were painted alternately

Img_5823.jpg

I had previously opened some of these, and now had to cut the decals into individual pieces to get the correct alternate repeat

closer study of the few images showed the white areas fwd and aft to contain hatch doors;

I made these by cutting 1/ 700 round topped PE doors in half-- fiddly and wasteful as the cuts were not horizontal but angled

Img_5828.jpg

these were applied to the white decalled hull sides with matt varnish

Img_5825.jpg

Img_5824.jpg

Once painted they were pleasingly subtle

Alarm!!

study of the same painting--and drawings and plans etc led me to the conclusion that there was a flaw in the PE decks...
more accurately there was a missing level. !

I had already queried in my subconscious mind the gargantuan high bulwarks on the aft poop-

-and in truth, on the real thing they were very high... but... !

Img_5841.jpg

Img_5839.jpg

Img_5840.jpg

AHA !!

obviously the cure was to make and install new deck-piece--this tricky to template up, make and install ,
as the hull tapers severely inboard aft and the deck-footprint is rather wider than the aperture available to insert!

I used a scale figure to check out headroom and feasible deck heights above and below

Img_5833.jpg

I made an initial paper half folding template, then converted it to ( hinged by groing plasticard and after quite a few test-fittings (!!! )
was happy with the fit

I then made a final deck with mast holes positioned , and having worked out a ' wiggle-path' will insert it as a whole piece

Img_5835.jpg

attention future builders of this kit ==> make and install this deck BEFORE you glue up the hull !

More progress soon!

Jim Baumann

Hi All
Thanks Jim for bringing this issue to light, we will of course with help from Jim produce a template for a further deck and put alterations on the instructions, we will then make an upgrade for the kit, anyone in the meantime who wants the dimensions for the new deck to make their own please contact us at Scalewarship.
The ship by the way is looking very nice Jim.
Regards Robin
Scalewarship ltd

[JIM BAUMANN]

Thank you all fro your comments

-and scale-warship for your good news!

a quick build is turning into a longer build...

partly because I am obsessing about minutia and sutff that is pretty unverifiable....( )

and partly because I am trying to second guess the conflicting scant infos available!

anyhow--the new aft deck was going just fine...

and having matched the deck colours quite satisfactorily.. .
I the undid all my good works when I accidentally spilt glue on it!!!

the attempted removal of the glue had the predictable result....

anyhow--at least the old deck made a good template and gave me the opportunity at further practice of matching deck colours...! ha!

( note ; the caulking lines have not yet been pencilled in)

as the deck would cover everything invisibly on the previously installed lower deck I made some ' rough and ready ' support carriages
for the gun barrels (cut from Albion alloys tubing) that were installed into the previously opened apertures

apropos second guessing... ( making it up! )-- no o-nboard photos--!!

I added some "hanging knees" at the outboard edges of the gun deck ( made of paper - infused in situ wth CA )
as well as some midships support --the stairwell will be be moved outboard slightly

[JIM BAUMANN]

Ha ! again..

Just when I thought it all was going to easily...
It had been bothering me that the upper 'castle' did look immensely deep...
with my little crew member looking up out of a deep chasm...

with a bit of rational thought and study ... it seems my misgivings were not misplaced...

note the crew-members heads protruding just above the parapet!

Aha--so we need another deck....

now it was my good fortune that I already had a scrap aft deck that at least matched in colour...

all that was needed was a template..--not as easy as it may appear--as the hull sides undercut in every direction!

hence I made a template in ' foldable ' paper first

fiddled into place numerous times (!! )

thereafter it was simple matter of copying the template onto my scrap, but-ready-painted, aft deck...

installing it was different matter

but all is well that ends ( fairly) well...

[GewoonWouter]

What an impressive and utterly insain build...that scale

I could use all kinds of words to describe what I feel when looking at this thread, but I would fill a whole page I guess . Astonishing stuff mate, really!

[marijn van gils]

Just wonderful!
I'm following this with great interest!

Cheers,

Marijn

[K494]

Very nice!

Scott

[zs180]

Besides being interesting and educational, this thread also helps anyone tackling the build of the Mary Rose achieve a better result with minimum effort by contributing to the improvement of the aftermarket detail set.
And what a nice looking ship she is already!

[JIM BAUMANN]

Thank you all for your interest; building a model where so little of the actual ship was documented first time round, and yet so much is known about the crew and the weaponry is a novel modelling experience for me -I usually pore endlessly over photos and plans etc...

yet here I am dealing with my own and other- better placed than I-- peoples best-guesses! supposition, and make it up as you go,,!

The inside faces of my ship -model looked rather plain to my eyes--alas none of the real ship above the ' weather-deck- is preserved-

- so it is a case of extrapolating from what is there...

I reasoned that the gunports would be placed between substantial timbers-- partially to fasten the recoil rope cables to;

above the aft poop deck ( known as the summer deck ) I also added.... errr... --some texture...

I reasoned that the fwd f'clse structure would also have some support midships

The drawings in the book Anatomy of the Mary Rose

show no means of accessing this aft summer deck-
-I chose to cut a hatch into this deck-- in a... - to me- ...feasible position and installed a ladder in situ

as a side-step from the ' wood'...

I assembled the PE anchors--and promptly modified them !

to be more akin to the photos of the
real anchor recovered from the seabed--with the flukes being closer to the stock

I hope to mount the vessel into its waterbase tomorrow, --this will make the handling of the model easier and less prone to inadvertent damage

Next step is to add the wheels to the gun carriages in situ--having established that the
wheels on the visible guns are actually midship on the wooden carriage--not at the fwd end as I guessed...!


More fun soon

JB

[Jabberwock]

I am surprised that there are no existing photos of the actual ship, given it's importance in the navy at that point in time.

Cheers, Jabb.

[JIM BAUMANN]

at last!!

The ship has now been mounted in her water base-- much easier and safer to handle.

before concentrating on the walkway across the waist of the ship, I fabricated a capstan for the anchor cables

not exactly as drawn in the AOTS book, I simplified - alas no suggested location for it either..!
I placed it at the fwd end of the just covered focsle--where it is all but invisible!

With the central walkway installed, and the supports thereto placed and painted...
I turned my attention to fabricating the anti-boarding netting supporting frame.
The Scalewarship PE set does include a support frame-- but guided by .... ( guesswork!) ...paintings...
I elected to make my own -- with rather more spans and also the longitudinal spreader( made of styrene strip

I plan to sandwich the netting- once installed- by laying over my support framework some small brass strip( imitating square section timber)
hence the use of round section for the ' underside'--to render the top strips finer--
as the round section should be all but invisible in the undercut area.

This was trickier than anticipated , with many butt joins and much careful measuring ( and wasting!) of brass wire!

apropos netting....

using my 1/400 scale figure, ensuring ' he' did not fit though the gaps, only maybe just about his head...

I started looking for sources of fine netting that could work for the anti-boarding netting...

harder than one might think!

the best-- so far--subject to further experiments-- is some rather pretty lace cloth

BUT... for Mary Rose I do not require the pretty bits...

the fabric cuts well and does not fall apart--it takes a crease well and is malleable...

at 1/1 ( eyesight ) viewing distance it looks attractive and feasible...

really close up... maybe still too large?

opinions sought!

more soon

Jim B

[Martocticvs]

Looks fantastic so far! I'm very familiar with the construction of wooden ships from the 17th to mid 19th centuries, so was going to try and offer up something about the capstan placement... only I didn't quite appreciate how little of the the internal structure of this ship remains! Not much to go on, is there? Sounds as good as anything to me. On later ships, you would expect to find a capstan about halfway between the fore and main masts, and another about halfway between the main and mizzen. But this is too far out of my time frame to say anything useful

The netting does look a tad large close-up... but I know how hard it can be to find appropriate things like this at such small sizes! The trouble with making it scale-size is you won't appreciate that it actually is netting unless you peer very closely at it indeed!

[Timmy C]

Amazing work as always, Jim.

Is the fabric net smaller than even the PE flight deck netting stuff?

[marijn van gils]

Great job Jim!

My honest opinion on the lace:
- It looks too big. Maybe it is not, but on the model a smaller mesh would visually be more pleasing.
- The hexagonal shape looks a bit weird, more like chicken wire than nets. Is there any info on the shape of the real netting? Square holes would seem the most logical to me, but logic is often a bad advisor when doing historical research�
- Close-up, it is visible how the lace is woven from several threads (with several threads lying parallel) instead of ropes knotted together, which will probably be only emphasized during painting.

Personally, I would look for a suitable PE mesh. It will look like single wires, and since there are many generic sheets available, the right shape and diameter should be easy enough to find. It can also be bent to sag realistically between the supports. The only challenge will be to find one with 'ropes' that are fine enough, so it doesn't look like a flat piece of PE after painting�

Just my 2cents of course.

Cheers!

Marijn

[Martocticvs]

The real-world netting would almost certainly have been identical to fishing nets, so square holes and knots at the overlaps. These things would have been made by people serving on board who have spent time at sea in such capacities as fishermen, etc

[JIM BAUMANN]

Thank you for opinions =both here on forum and also e-mail and PM

The flight deck netting PE I have seen is too narrow for my needs

and often is a bit 'clogged' around the edges and coarse for my tastes

In the past on 1/700 sail rigged armoured cruisers I have used
small floral warp--coloured with indelible marker fro the netting under the bow-sprit





now in 1/400 it is a different netting and different materials sought...

I have ordered some PE 0.75 twixt strands fine ( we shall see how fine) not cheap alas

http://www.scalelink.co.uk/acatalog/Mes ... illes.html

whilst I await its arrival,

I have selected some materials as below

I coloured them all with indelible marker to gain a constant

flower mesh ( as used in 1/700 )

the nylon filter material-- looks nice enough-size is ok ... kind of ' ropey' ... but?

The Mosquito net I use in my work looked ok ( uncoloured) at 1/1 scale viewing

but close up ... nay!

swimming pool leaf net...

mesh too big ( and rectangular - not square--and whilst strands are 'clean' the weave is too coarse

[Joe Simon]

This is a masterpiece!!!!!!!

[JIM BAUMANN]

I do like a bit of paint....

Having ( fiiinnnaaally) completed the anti-boarding netting frame( very fiddly ) and installed the central bow supports with paint it all started to homogenise somewhat.

and the overall picture also improved, albeit with the tapered brass bowsprit fitted ....

the ship does look a bit like a Unicorn !!

I have turned my attentions to the setting up of the lower masts---working out correct heights---allowing the masts to go all the way down to and through the keel;
to forestall any mast creep or distortion during the rigging process- replacing the rather over-thick and ungainly plastic with the,
-to my eye--appropriate brass, copper and stainless steel tubing as size available tubing

the 'crowsnests/ platforms/fighting tops '... I used the plastic versions as the outline was not all bad , however re-worked them a little

A ==> as it came off the sprue
B ==> has been ground out
C ==> has had the edges thinned
D ==> after mounting to mast has the the grinding 'step' pared away with a blade
E ==> using the lower mount off the plastic mast, sanded down and drilled out to correct size

a closer view of the inside of the platforms as attached to the mast-stubs

Christmas break abroad will inhibit modelmaking progress...

more soon!

Jim Baumann