Calling all SMS König class fans

Anthony P · Post by **Anthony P** » Mon Nov 26, 2007 11:38 am

I forgot to mention that I solved the battery deck's fit to turret D by sanding the semi-circular recess in the back of the battery deck that is supposed to butt to the turrett base with a large, round, fine file and then progressively finer sandpaper. It worked OK and will require minimal filler. What I do not know is whether all kits have the same problem or whether some are worse than others.

Anthony

Yevgeniy · Post by **Yevgeniy** » Mon Nov 26, 2007 1:43 pm

Hi all,

First of all let me appologize :sorry:

for such a delay in replying. From Thursday November 22 when I came out from my workshop after midnight and wrote cry for help (actually it was Friday November 23 01 a.m. with something) I could not connect to ModelWarhips. What a time it was - I was trying and trying but no help.

until today. I was writing to Mr. Cadman that I felt myself like an addict without his obsession. It works from today - according to Cadman it could have been some regional problems with Internet.

Pachi,
I will try my best to deliver pictures of my treasure (in half-ready state) in 2-3 weeks when I get new PC to allow me to download pics from camera to computer (my old laptop does not allow that).

While deprived of Modelwarship I re-read (over 5 times) your article on Kronprinz which I saved to my computer long time ago and printed out. It gave me great relief. Each time I was re-reading the paragraph on "main deck and bettery deck" I was getting the meaning better and better until I started scribing the battery deck from the bow as you suggested. Yes, anchor chain holes are

pretty close to the hull as you write. Only when I memorized your paragraph by heart I dared to start "cutting off plastic" (actually not cutting of but filing) from the bow. I agree with you know that it is quite easier to trim the bow as the aft part of battery deck is complex form. I thought a lot on the subject also considering trimming the aft part but finally refused. Thank you very much for that article.

Anthony, I have a CAUSION

for alternative to trim the aft (it is only my supposition so I am sorry (and happy) if I am wrong): in case you shorten the battery deck from the aft it is possible that the Turret D will prevent superstructure at the aft ("second superstructure" containing the second funnel) from getting in place as they are quite close. You can not shift the superstructure closer to the bow as its place at the deck is marked and you have Turret C in between Superstructure 1 and Superstructure 2. It is obvious if you look at the large instruction sheet showing the model from above.

Also we had a thread called like this "What are those deadlights" on Main Forum in June this year where I asked about deadlights and received profound answers from Mr. Baumann, Mr. Ingura and Mr. Francisco P. de Nanclares. Unfortunately I could not find this thread anymore. Thus according to Mr. Ingura German WWI Battleships did not have deadlights on the hull - so that the only place is superstructure. I am sure WEM has enough deadlights for superstructure portholes (although I did not count them in my WEM PE)

As to white circles on pre-Yutland version I am interested on this myself. But I decided not to go deeper in this question as I saw these white circles on all models I believe are pre-Yutland including that one of Mr. Baumann. I judge that the model is pre-Yutland if it has anti-torpedo nets (after Yutland they were removed) and pre-Yutland forwardmast. For me that is enough research.

Wish you success with your model and thanks all for the support.

Yevgeniy

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Mon Nov 26, 2007 4:09 pm

Yevgenii,
Thank you for the advice. It answers most, if not all my questions.
It is now too late for me to change my solution to the battery deck, as it has already been filed. I will let you know the consequences when I reach that stage of the build. It is still early days for me.
Bolshoe spaciba i vsevo haroshava (sorry-no cyrillic alphabet here!).
Anthony

Anthony P · Post by **Anthony P** » Fri Nov 30, 2007 10:20 am

It's Friday afternoon and I can once more focus on modelling...

I have concluded I will attempt to do Grosser Kurfurst with the Jutland fit.

The differences I have identified between the Jutland fit and the 1917/8 fit are the following:
1. Bridge has wings (kit provides parts)
2. Different foremast (WEM white metal part
3. Torpedo nets
4. Grosser Kurfurst has simpler bridge (WEM PE provides part)
5. Painting has some differences (masts in particular), as per the Imperial Navy site mentioned in a previous post. I note that turret tops were black with no circles in that time frame.

For the later fit, it should be mentioned that the WEM instructions state bridges with no wings and removal of 88mm guns from upper casemate, which are then covered with plates (etched part) and, in real life, became additional accommodation. No torpedo nets either.

Yevgenii, I don't know how far along you are in your build. If it's of any use to you, i could post you by letter the late fit parts from the WEM set that I will not be using. If interested, contact me by personal message on this board. After your last post, I dry-fitted the aft funnel superstructure, worrying that it would not fit after my sanding. It does fit, albeit more tightly than it should. Perhaps my example did not have as big a problem as yours (1-2mm)

It is needless to say that should any fellow modeller have different/additional information I will happily be corrected (and grateful)!

Anthony

DariusP · Post by **DariusP** » Fri Nov 30, 2007 12:07 pm

Any of you guys know:
1- where I can obtain an accurate (accent on "accurate") set of drawings of Moltke/Goeben battlecruisers;
2- do you know if drawings of any of those ships survived both wars and were they published anywhere?

Any help will be greatly appreciated!

Anthony P · Post by **Anthony P** » Fri Nov 30, 2007 2:52 pm

Hi Darius,
No luck for Goeben/Moltke class plans as far as I know.
FYI, I obtained my Koenig plans from the german Amazon.com (amazon.de).
They list a number of plans by Koop & Schmolke, but not of the ships you are interested in.
The available plans for anyone who is interested:
-german destroyers 1935-45
-armoured cruiser Fuerst Bismarck
-light cruisers Brummer/Bremse (1903/18)
-Nassau & Koenig class battleships
-Bayern class battleships
-battlecruiser Von Der Tann

I know it's of no help to you, but still...

Anthony

DariusP · Post by **DariusP** » Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:04 pm

Thanks for trying Anthony

Anthony P · Post by **Anthony P** » Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:04 pm

Darius,

As you piqued my interest, I did a quick Google search and found this link: http://www.wlb-stuttgart.de/bfz/marine/ ... echdok.htm
My German is limited, but they seem to be a state institution that has 1/500 plans of EVERY German warship!

The question, naturally is how to obtain a copy. Perhaps German-speaking fellow modellers can be of assistance here!

Anthony

DariusP · Post by **DariusP** » Fri Nov 30, 2007 6:03 pm

I think I might know just a right person to ask

Thanks again Anthony!

ingura · Post by **ingura** » Sun Dec 02, 2007 4:34 am

KRONMA · Post by **KRONMA** » Sun Dec 02, 2007 6:52 am

Thanks for open answer Peter!

ingura wrote:MZ-Modellbau once restored the 1/50 scale shipyardmodel of MOLTKE, which was not correct since it was built earlier than the actual ship. Main difference were the guns (12" L 45 instead of L 50 if memory serves me).

I believe, that this model has been constructed later, than in 1908/1909.
It shows the ship after modernization of 1912-1913.
1- New navigation bridge.
2 - New funnel's top.
3- 12" L50 Guns.

Thanks.

DariusP · Post by **DariusP** » Sun Dec 02, 2007 7:30 am

Thank you very much for your answer Peter! I will get in touch with NMM and IWM and see where it will get me.

It is interesting to note that, while Russians returned drawings which were in their possession, British did no such thing.... I wonder if Russians were asked for the drawings or if they volunteered and if anybody ever approached Brits about drawings of German ships they keep.

Yevgeniy · Post by **Yevgeniy** » Sun Dec 02, 2007 12:50 pm

Anthony,

Thank you for your kind offer. I would be happy to accept it but as I am working on Grosser Kurfurst in pre-Yutlland version parts for later fit are of no use for me. My stage of construction is: ready (painted hull); ready turrets (main and secondary), ready decks. Now I install everything and move to superstructures. I hope to make pictures in 2-3 weeks and will post them.

I am glad that the anticipated problems with aft superstructure did not take place with you.

Good luck with your build.

Yevgeniy

ingura · Post by **ingura** » Sun Dec 02, 2007 6:37 pm

waynec · Post by **waynec** » Sun Dec 02, 2007 6:46 pm

Anthony P wrote:It's Friday afternoon and I can once more focus on modelling...

I have concluded I will attempt to do Grosser Kurfurst with the Jutland fit.

The differences I have identified between the Jutland fit and the 1917/8 fit are the following:
1. Bridge has wings (kit provides parts)
2. Different foremast (WEM white metal part
3. Torpedo nets
4. Grosser Kurfurst has simpler bridge (WEM PE provides part)
5. Painting has some differences (masts in particular), as per the Imperial Navy site mentioned in a previous post. I note that turret tops were black with no circles in that time frame.

For the later fit, it should be mentioned that the WEM instructions state bridges with no wings and removal of 88mm guns from upper casemate, which are then covered with plates (etched part) and, in real life, became additional accommodation. No torpedo nets either.

Anthony

glad i found this topic. i am starting a MARKGRAF post-jutland early next year, after additional practice building 1/35 armour. i also need to learn airbrushing before i start this. according to GoldMedalModels PE set, some time in 1917 KONIG's large long bridge wings were removed. the kit has parts for J21 and J41 (bridge wings) and J12 and J1 (no bridge wings). from this i infer the upper smaller bridge wings were retained on KONIG. they also say the six 8.8 cm casemate guns below the bridge were removed and the gunports plated over (parts K11 and K12). it seems some of the solid splinter shields on the bridge are were post Jutland so pre-jutland these would be railings. my impression is that these modifications took place on all 4 at various times after jutland.

i will paint my MARKGRAF in 2 color scheme per http://german-navy.tripod.com/sms_paint.htm and probably paint waterline and bottoms on the boats. i can scan in my GMM instructions and email them to anyone interested. i am interested in seeing what the WEM instructions look like. i also have another list of german naval colors ww1 and ww2.[/url]

KRONMA · Post by **KRONMA** » Mon Dec 03, 2007 4:24 am

ingura wrote: And btw, didn't you miss the torpedonets too?

BEFORE he started, the model was'nt correct as I pointed out earlier... ok?

ОК, I have understood.

Thanks for answer.

Drazen · Post by **Drazen** » Sat Dec 08, 2007 2:03 pm

Hi guys!

Here's something I've been working on for the last few months: ICM�s 1/350 scale K�nig in her 1916 Jutland fit. I've tried to improve it as best I can with an assortment of scratchbuilt and both WEM & GMM photo-etch parts. All brass barrels are from Burkhardt (BMK), awesome stuff!
Here are some pics from the very beginning till now.

Comments are most welcome!

Yevgeniy · Post by **Yevgeniy** » Sat Dec 08, 2007 4:08 pm

Drazen,

First of all - your work is also awesome stuff.

Questions: are those railings around funnel GMM PE or your own scratchbuild ones?

Hope to see more pictures. Good luck with your build.

Yevgeniy

Drazen · Post by **Drazen** » Sat Dec 08, 2007 4:38 pm

Hi Yevgeniy,

Funnel rings were made from 1/700 railings. I found some spare Tom�s 1/700 Bismarck 3-bar safety rails in my stash and decided to use them. First I cut them to get one bar (with its stanchions), then drill holes in funnel for each stanchion and finally bend & glue them. Surplus pieces of horizontal bars I used for "eyebrows"

DariusP · Post by **DariusP** » Sat Dec 08, 2007 9:50 pm

Not my favourite period but I can't help admiring the way you are turning so-so kit into a great model Drazen! Please keep posting those photos!

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