USS Des Moines to be scrapped in Brownsville

[Jack Ray]

Rob said:

Jack,

Your best bet is:


http://www.bsaverof.com/uk/history.htm

Cheers,

Rob

Thanks Rob!

[Avery Boyer]

ON the subject or remaining gun cruisers, there's Olympia, Des Moines, Salem, Averof and De Ruyter which is still active with the peruvian navy as Almirante Grau. She is the last gun cruiser in any configuration active anywhere in the world. If anything she should be saved. True we can't, and should not try to, save them all, but the Dey Ruyter is the last surviving World war II light cruiser still in her gun configuration, and as such should be preserved. What a sight that would be.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BAP_Almira ... 8CLM-81%29

[Avery Boyer]

I think the USN might have traded the Des Moines for the USS Ticonderoga CG-47. She is now on donation hold. Check it out:

http://www.nvr.navy.mil/nvrships/details/CG47.htm

[Devin]

I think the USN might have traded the Des Moines for the USS Ticonderoga CG-47. She is now on donation hold. Check it out:

http://www.nvr.navy.mil/nvrships/details/CG47.htm

Okay, I served on a Tico class cruiser and think they're cool ships and all, but a freakin' museum? What for?

As the USS Adams group is finding out, getting a ship on hold and finding a place for her are two totally different projects.

I think groups should start banding together and trying to save the existing ship museums that are in trouble (and there are quite a few) instead of trying to save everything that floats. Sink a few for reefs, and then recycle the rest.

-Devin

[Avery Boyer]

Okay, I served on a Tico class cruiser and think they're cool ships and all, but a freakin' museum? What for?

I wondered that myself. I thought that they might hesitate to preserve any Ticos because there are still quite a few (Most of the class) in comission.

As the USS Adams group is finding out, getting a ship on hold and finding a place for her are two totally different projects.

Saginaw valley transfered their efforts to the USS Edson. Finding a place is difficult and sometimes is quite literally the difference between sink and swim. That's part of why the efforts for the Des Moines have been unsuccesful so far. THat's also why the Saratoga, Ranger, Wisconsin, and Forrestal efforts have been succesful. Forrestal has Baltimore and Wisconsin has Norfolk.

think groups should start banding together and trying to save the existing ship museums that are in trouble (and there are quite a few) instead of trying to save everything that floats. Sink a few for reefs, and then recycle the rest.

What ships are in trouble? Alabama was for a while, but now she has her cofferdam. Edson was unsuccesful at the Intrepid museum, but she's in good hands now. I'm confident that she'll be saved. Didn't Hornet have some difficulty last year? And why should groups band together? If the groups trying to save new ships were interested in the other ships, then they'd be working with them, not working on saving Edson, Ranger,etc

[JWintjes]

What ships are in trouble?

USS Olympia. Historically a highly significant ship, she's said to be in not exactly an excellent state right now, and constantly in the need of money.

Jorit

[Avery Boyer]

That's to bad. I really should make a donation. She is probably the most historicaly significant vessel preserved. I bet she does cost alot to maintain, seeing as she's almost 125 years old.

[Werner]

Virtual tour of Olympia

[Devin]

What ships are in trouble? Alabama was for a while, but now she has her cofferdam. Edson was unsuccesful at the Intrepid museum, but she's in good hands now. I'm confident that she'll be saved. Didn't Hornet have some difficulty last year? And why should groups band together? If the groups trying to save new ships were interested in the other ships, then they'd be working with them, not working on saving Edson, Ranger,etc

I don't know of any museum that makes anything close to a decent profit, if a profit at all. The Intrepid, Yorktown, Hornet are all in need of upkeep, the Texas is going into dry dock to repair problems, all of that takes money that groups operating on the borderline of staying afloat won't have. A few years back they started replacing parts of Yorktown's flight deck with poured concrete because it's less expensive than doing actual repairs; and the Texas main problems stem from the fact that they used concrete on her in the past.

As far as groups banding together, why shouldn't they? I mean if the goal is the one of "preserving history" that everyone gives lip service to, then why not put the money behind history that has already been saved and can use the funding? Most groups are only interested in saving their history; things I saw while part of the push to save the USS Barney, infighting between different ships groups, spreading rumors with potential host cities so they'd prefer one ship over the other, etc. was sickening. Things are now looking really positive for the Adams, but one or two delays and it could all fall through

-Devin

[Avery Boyer]

I think that Saginaw Valley and Milwaukee should group together to acheive prservation of Edson. I'm not saying that banding to gether is a bad idea, all I'm saying is that the groups have no reason to, except the one that are trying to save the same ship. Maybe Daisy Mae wouldn't be this close to becoming a pile of scrap metal if the two or so groups trying to save her had just joined together to acheive their goal. Another example is the attempt to preserve USS New Jersey. Bayonne and Camden were going against each other, but despite this the New Jersey was saved.

Here's a link to the Google map depicting Brownsville. You can see ex-Sterret (I think) and a Knox.
http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&t=k&q ... 05402&om=1

Here's USS Des Moines.
http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&t=k&q ... 02701&om=1

[Seasick]

The 5 stricken Ticonderogas are being used as sources of spare parts for the remaining Ticos. They were decomissioned because it was deemed to be more affordable to replace them with Flight 2A Arleigh Burke destroyers than to modernize them.

[Devin]

The 5 stricken Ticonderogas are being used as sources of spare parts for the remaining Ticos. They were decomissioned because it was deemed to be more affordable to replace them with Flight 2A Arleigh Burke destroyers than to modernize them.

Mostly machinery parts, right? The weapons systems changed so much through the run of that class that it'd be hard to use them as a source for the later ships (say CG-60 and later).

Replacing them with Burke's is a wise decision, the destroyers are built to take more punishment than the cruisers.

-Devin

[Avery Boyer]

The 5 stricken Ticonderogas are being used as sources of spare parts for the remaining Ticos. They were decomissioned because it was deemed to be more affordable to replace them with Flight 2A Arleigh Burke destroyers than to modernize them.

Just like the Iowa as originally retained as a parts source for the the remaining BBs.

That's what made me wonder why the USN put Tico on Donation Hold.

[lmo1960]

While it would have been nice to save Des Moines, all the various groups (and there have been way more than 2) have had 14 years to get their act together and raise enough money to preserve her. No one came close, and the Navy put an April 30, 2006 deadline for receiving any applications.
She is the last of her class, but her sister ship Salem has been open as a museum since 1995 and will be the only WWII designed/configured cruiser left as a museum. As was mentioned before, the Little Rock was heavlily modified when converted to a missile cruiser and none of the Baltimore class survive today.

If you want really want to help preserve the memory and technology of the Des Moines class, make a donation to the USS Salem. We are alive and well, but like all non-profits, could always use more money.

The Des Moines will be scrapped. It is way too late to do anything about that.

Someone also wrote

That's also why the Saratoga, Ranger, Wisconsin, and Forrestal efforts have been succesful. Forrestal has Baltimore and Wisconsin has Norfolk.

The only one of the above that is a given is the Wisconsin. None of the other efforts has raised enough money yet to submit a successful application. Money is 99.99999% of the reason museum efforts fail, not politics. And money is the way to keep the existing museums going.

[Werner]

Larry, keep up the good work! We appreciate it.

I would love to see Salem sometime, and especially see the 8-inch automatic arrangements in the turrets and magazine!

Someone once told me the magazine reminded him of an old fashioned Coca-Cola bottle vending machine. Any truth to that?

[Guest]

Very sad. I'm sure everybody knows my affection for this ship..

Hehehehehe.

-Chuck

[abramsteve]

So sad...

I have an unhealthy love for the Iowa's and would absolutley hate to see any of them scrapped, hell I could have cryed when I heard they had finnaly all been stricken! Intrepid, Hornet, Yorktown and Lexington all have to be saved as well in my opinion. Same with Enterprise when her times up... to me it seems to dishonour their names to scrap them.

I cant understand keeping a Tico, theyre not that pretty and arent history, well at least not yet!

[Werner]

I think the four Ticos would make a wonderful addition to the Australian Navy. They still have at least 15 years of life left... and they could provide an ABM defense for the homeland.

[lmo1960]

Larry, keep up the good work! We appreciate it.

I would love to see Salem sometime, and especially see the 8-inch automatic arrangements in the turrets and magazine!

Someone once told me the magazine reminded him of an old fashioned Coca-Cola bottle vending machine. Any truth to that?

I have been a volunteer on the Salem for the past 11 years to help preserve Quincy's shipbuilding history, so thank you for that comment.

The magazines on Salem, are just like the ones on most gunships, big empty rooms. There is nothing extraordinary about them. All of the cartridge (no powder bags here) and shell handling equipment is incorporated into the center of the barbette and will probably never be open to the public due to severe space limitations and the huge cost to build custom access to those spaces. It took the USS Massachusetts about 20 years to open up one of their barbettes, and they are significantly larger, and roomier that ours.

If you meant the loading mechanisms, which are probably unique in the museum ship fleet, then yes, you can see the upper portions from withing the gunhouse itself. A volunteer in the past disconnect a few of the loading mechanism rods so we could show the trays in 3 different loading positions.

[MartinJQuinn]

Larry, keep up the good work! We appreciate it.

I would love to see Salem sometime, and especially see the 8-inch automatic arrangements in the turrets and magazine!

Someone once told me the magazine reminded him of an old fashioned Coca-Cola bottle vending machine. Any truth to that?

I have been a volunteer on the Salem for the past 11 years to help preserve Quincy's shipbuilding history, so thank you for that comment.

The magazines on Salem, are just like the ones on most gunships, big empty rooms. There is nothing extraordinary about them. All of the cartridge (no powder bags here) and shell handling equipment is incorporated into the center of the barbette and will probably never be open to the public due to severe space limitations and the huge cost to build custom access to those spaces. It took the USS Massachusetts about 20 years to open up one of their barbettes, and they are significantly larger, and roomier that ours.

If you meant the loading mechanisms, which are probably unique in the museum ship fleet, then yes, you can see the upper portions from withing the gunhouse itself. A volunteer in the past disconnect a few of the loading mechanism rods so we could show the trays in 3 different loading positions.

I've heard good things about the Salem - gotta get up there to see you guys soon.