Calling all Independence-class (CVL-22) fans

[Blue Devil]

I too have the Dragon kit and also have a question. Dragon is well known for being somewhat "creative" with their instructions, with called-out part numbers sometimes not matching reality; especially on new, first release kits. From reviews I've read, Independence continues this fine tradition. Has anyone out there built or inspected the kit closely enough to compile a list of these errors and their corrections that they can share with us, the less enlightened?

Thanks a ton!

Michael

[Tracy White]

1. I'm a sucker for dazzle camoflage and plan to paint her in this scheme. Can anyone tell me the official colors? I can't seem to find what combination of haze/ocean/light gray was used and whether it was navy blue of black for the dark color.

2. I know the dazzle cmaoflage was applied following her refit. One of the visible changes I know came with this was the addition of a second catapult which is easy enough to add. Is there a simple list of other key changes?

Official Colors should be 5-L, 5-O, and 5-N; since she was in Measure 33, the "Light Pattern System," 5-N would have been used and not black.

With regards to the changes after the refit, I never sat down to catalog them all as we weren't doing her in that fit, but there were some changes that were more significant than others. The additional catapult, for example, lead to the area under the forward flight deck overhang to be largely filled in for machinery; Cowpens should help show you the differences with this and this view. The 20mms from the bow that were displaced were moved to the catwalks; once again, this Cowpens photo should provide some details.

The mast was revised for new radars and an additional Yardarm; compare this view to the instructions. The lower level saw one of the reproducers from the side moved to the back, the two levels above have the forward portion cut back, and a SM radar has replaced the SG that was on the saw-horse type of structure. This view of the rear of CVL-24's Island should also show the extra Yardarm.

There was also a radar added to a new pole mast on the #4 stack, but I forget which type. There was a Mk 51 director tub added to the structure below the crane, circled here and here for positioning at least. These I don't have photos of that I can share otherwise....

Has anyone out there built or inspected the kit closely enough to compile a list of these errors and their corrections that they can share with us, the less enlightened?

When I put mine together there were no instructions and it was missing some parts, so you're more enlightened than me!

That said, I've been watching and helping some builds, and there are a couple of items that have been brought up. I haven't started on my "real" one yet to verify, but for now:
* On the 20mm guns, two barrel/gun assemblies are given, L1 & L7. The instructions ("B" on step 1) show to use L7, but if using the PE shoulder rests, L1 is more appropriate.
* The F & G stacks apparently were swapped in the instructions - test fit, test fit, test fit.
* The upper elevator pieces I2 & I3 are marked wrong in the instructions; instead of L2 on the forward elevator and L3 for the aft elevator, one number is port and the other is starboard.
* One builder said that the bits on Tree H (H15) looked better than the J10 bits called for the instructions, but I haven't looked at this myself or checked to see if H15 pieces are extra and won't be missed elsewhere if this is done.

Not instructions related, but one builder reported that the alignment grooves and ridges for the stack lattice supports (Part F27) don't line up correctly. However, it was brought up later that he may have aligned them wrong, so once again, test fit!

Also, the clipping rooms under the flight deck were done last, in a rush, and I never got test pieces. They don't make allowances for the stiffeners between the hull and the catwalk bulkheads, so either chop off the stiffeners on the underside of the deck or make notches so they fit over them.

[Blue Devil]

Tracy,

Thanks for those! If anyone else has any corrections to the instructions, they would be much appreciated!

I wonder if Dragon will offer the capstans and aft hanger bulkhead to those of us who have the first release Independence kit? Hmm...

Michael

[Guest]

I must say thanks to all who have helped with information in this thread. I've finally gotten just about all the seems of the major ship structures cleaned up and am getting ready to add all the small parts on my Dragon 1/350 CVL-22 Independence. I'll be building her following her July 1944 refit. Thanks to Tracy White, I at least have some idea what is necessary to change on this kit.

So now, can anyone confirm what your aircraft complement would have been around this time? I've found one reference for October 1944 stating she was carrying "25 fighters and 9 torpedo planes". I can surmise these would be the F6F and TBF/TBM, but I worry about the credibility since they are so generic in the aircraft type. Can anyone either confirm this or give more reliable information?

[Tracy White]

http://www.researcheratlarge.com/Ships/ ... VL-22.html

[Rick T]

I'm building the Dragon 1/350 CV-22 USS Independence and have nearly reached the point of applying the deck stripes and the striping around the elevators. I am building her as she appeared in November of 1943. The instructions show to use either the white or the yellow stripes, both of which are provided. Which color is correct? The period photos are b&w and judging by the contrast, the striping seems to be white, but I am still not sure. During this time period, the striping also changed from three parallel rows of striping (two wide exterior stripes and one narrow center stripe) down the length of the flight deck, to a single row of narrow stripes down the port side of the flight deck. When did that change occur? Between the Navsource photos and the CVL-22 home site, there are a lot of photos, but many of the dates don't quite mesh up. Any help on the correct stripe colors would greatly be appreciated.

Of interest, there are a few good photos of the elevators lowered. The photos don't show the black band being applied at the top of the elevator bulkheads on the Independence.

Thanks,
Rick T

[Guest]

Does anybody have any information regarding the color of the flight deck striping of USS Independence during the November 18-20, 1943 strikes on Tarawa? The Dragon kit supplies white and yellow stripes but offers no information on when the colors were applied. Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks,
Rick T

[Tracy White]

I'd found nothing definite. Color photos of Cowpens at the same time *appear* to be white, but photos in January of 1944 are yellow. So, we punted and provided both.

[Guest]

Thanks very much. It was all pretty muddy to me too. I appreciate the info. I'll go with the white. I also found it interesting about the lack of the numbers on the flight deck during that period.
Rick T.

[JohnD]

Tracy,
Just purchased the Dragon 1/350 USS Princeton, the model looks great, but I have some issues with the instructions. They show the Measure 33/7A scheme as using 5-O, 5-P, 5-N and white, surely this can't be correct? I can''t find my copy of Ships2 to check.
Also the mixing instructions are a little odd, for 5-P they say to mix 90% white, 5% orange and 5% red, for 5-O they say to mix 45% sky, 10% red and 45% orange!! I'm pretty sure you don't get a purple-blue from using these colours.
Should the colours be 5-N, 5-O, 5-H and 5-P?
Also Step 3 in the instructions show the part nos. for the stern 40mm mount printed in light blue, I can't find the reason for this. There is nothing to suggest it is an optional part.
Thanks for any help, John

[Timmy C]

I can't speak for the camo, but regarding the stern 40mm platform parts, the light blue callouts are to distinguish the two very different L sprues - if you look at the parts index (first page of the instructions), you'll see there are two L sprues. One of them has the the 40mm platforms and its alphabet call-out is also blue. The other one in standard black call-out is for the 20mm guns.

No idea why they didn't just go with doubling the alphabets, like "AA" or "BB".

[JohnD]

Thanks Timmy,
John

[Timmy C]

No problem. Good to be on your toes, though - despite our best efforts, I'm sure some mistakes in the call-outs managed to get through the proofreading.

[Tracy White]

I can't comment on the mixing instructions.... I have the Snyder & Short Paint chips and WEM Paints so I haven't paid attention to them.

With regards to the light blue lettering, they included multiple trees with the same letter... so the work-around on the instructions was to show them in different colors. I wasn't really that keen on the idea...

The design sheet shows the white (5-U, which is untinted white base). Measure 33 is the "light" pattern (31 being "dark" and 32 being "medium"), which means 5-N instead of black, and calls for 5-P and 5-L.

80-G 270368

[Keith T. Bender]

Has this been brought up before, ? On the Dragon 1:350 kit , the port side flightdeck extention part the mates with the flightdeck is solid on the top as it should be in a kit. The PE part in the WEM set is a graded part and the base WEM provides is solid. So should we cut away the solid top from the Dragon kit and just use the bulkhead from it and place the WEM graded part on it or should we leave the solid top on and place the WEM graded part right over the solid area.
I been looking over some photos and it looks as no light is coming through from above which tells me the graded part should go right over the solid kit part if I'm correct.

I also looked over some plans and it shows a pump station inside that small area and a few un-used areas in there as well.

Any help here please,
Thanks,

Keith

[Tracy White]

It's up to you. Technically, it should be flush, but I don't know that many people will notice. For most, gluing the PE right to the plastic will be fine, others may wish to cut off the plastic and rebuild the extension and structure underneath the deck.

[Keith T. Bender]

Thank you, I'm gonna leave it solid and glue the PE grading over it since the one photo of CVL 23 during the fire and looking up from a ships deck clearly shows no light coming down from above which indicates the deck was solid with a grading over it.
I also have noticed in photos of most of the class that some have solid plates over that area and some have a grading so now we much pick carefully.

Thank you,

Keith

[Tracy White]

I think they're all pretty much pierced, it's just hard to tell from most of the photos. Also, keep in mind that there was a stiffening structure underneath and there were areas that were more solid around that for welding, etc.

I'll try and do a survey this weekend to see if there are any that were 100% solid and will report what I find if I can get the time.

[aptivaboy]

Is it possible to build any other ships from the Princeton model? I was thinking of an early to mid career Bell. Wood or Cowpens, say '43-mid '44.

Thanks!

Bob

[Tracy White]

Yes, the Princeton kit is much more universal than the Independence.