Calling all Yamato (大和) and Musashi (武蔵) fans

[baseballbrat]

New Yamato Book from Kagero..................
http://sklep.kagero.pl/en/the-japanese- ... amato.html

[Senkan]

Looks nice but it doesn't seem very accurate.

[cplchanb]

my thoughts exactly. For one thing, the gun tubs shouldnt be round but octagonal

[MalX]

Do you guys think that I should go with one row of bedrolls or two like in the movie?

very hard to say, maybe as per the movie

[Senkan]

I put on 2 rows.

[baseballbrat]

Looks nice but it doesn't seem very accurate.

Did you ever think that they are depicting a specific era in the ships history? I have 25 books. all with differences, but i don't discount them as being inaccurate. I haven't to this date thought of Kagero publications as printing something without researching it for accuracy. As we all know, Yamato has gone though multiple changes, some we don't really know about due to lack information available even to the Japanese.

[Senkan]

Usually after they do a dive on Yamato and get more info the layout of the ship changes. Compare the old tool Tamiya 1/350 Yamato to the new tool and you'll see. Also compare the Yamato 1/10 scale museum model.

In 2007 or 2009 more info was discovered on the ship and it changed the AA layout. The AA gun tub protection was discovered to be angular and not round. Unless this evidence has changed the cover art on this book is wrong. For all we know the cover art is different from the ship layout inside. But I don't want to fork out $30+ to find out.

I haven't looked inside another of the other Kagero books. What makes it special compared to the other books put out by Japanese companies?

[bucketfoot-al]

The actual layout of the AA tubs and their shape was already known in time for the 2005 movie "Men of Yamato" to get it right. Ditto the superb Takara Tomy multi-ship cut-away 1/700 model series released in conjunction with the movie. I believe that the wreck of Yamato was found in the mid-1980s, and several dives during that decade started gathering the info that has now given us a more accurate view of the ship as she looked in April 1945 ...

[MalX]

The actual layout of the AA tubs and their shape was already known in time for the 2005 movie "Men of Yamato" to get it right. Ditto the superb Takara Tomy multi-ship cut-away 1/700 model series released in conjunction with the movie. I believe that the wreck of Yamato was found in the mid-1980s, and several dives during that decade started gathering the info that has now given us a more accurate view of the ship as she looked in April 1945 ...

what bothers me is the Musashi flightdeck in the Firehawk PE, because it's nothing like the new tool Yamato or the Hasegawa 1/450.......... it's a 5mm grid square plating, it looks like a chess board, but considering the massive detail of all the rest of the PE, i'm guessing it's accurate, so maybe the Yamato's flightdeck was constructed differently who knows!!

this PE is truly scary, i'm not tackling this till next summer, this has to be built when i have no other models around or i'll get fed up with it all and return to a P51D

[bucketfoot-al]

As far as I am aware, both Yamato and Musashi has concrete flightdecks, although (I am away from my resources), I seem to remember they were gridded into squares. You can go to my website as one of the closeup photos of Yamato at her outfitting at Kure shows the flight deck. There are also a couple of shots taken looking backwards from Musashi's superstructure that show the flight deck. The link is below my signature.

[baseballbrat]

Usually after they do a dive on Yamato and get more info the layout of the ship changes. Compare the old tool Tamiya 1/350 Yamato to the new tool and you'll see. Also compare the Yamato 1/10 scale museum model.

In 2007 or 2009 more info was discovered on the ship and it changed the AA layout. The AA gun tub protection was discovered to be angular and not round. Unless this evidence has changed the cover art on this book is wrong. For all we know the cover art is different from the ship layout inside. But I don't want to fork out $30+ to find out.

I haven't looked inside another of the other Kagero books. What makes it special compared to the other books put out by Japanese companies?

The book obviously depicts one of the earlier modifications, so what's with the micro analyzing?

I originally posted this notice of a new book, so others can take a look. Maybe some will like it and buy it when it comes out.

Why are you going in a completely different direction and citing inaccuracies in a book that you haven't even looked at yet? Your analogy is useless in this case, as you could see from the cover photo, it's a different modification then the last voyage. Somehow you must think all new books should be up to date which to me is a bunch of crap. This ship has a history!

Look at this Hiroba Photo!

You're not a book critic!!! Don't assume anything!

All I wanted was a "Thank You" for informing others on a new reference.

PS: Rivet counting is bad for your health!

[Senkan]

Usually after they do a dive on Yamato and get more info the layout of the ship changes. Compare the old tool Tamiya 1/350 Yamato to the new tool and you'll see. Also compare the Yamato 1/10 scale museum model.

In 2007 or 2009 more info was discovered on the ship and it changed the AA layout. The AA gun tub protection was discovered to be angular and not round. Unless this evidence has changed the cover art on this book is wrong. For all we know the cover art is different from the ship layout inside. But I don't want to fork out $30+ to find out.

I haven't looked inside another of the other Kagero books. What makes it special compared to the other books put out by Japanese companies?

The book obviously depicts one of the earlier modifications, so what's with the micro analyzing?

I originally posted this notice of a new book, so others can take a look. Maybe some will like it and buy it when it comes out.

Why are you going in a completely different direction and citing inaccuracies in a book that you haven't even looked at yet? Your analogy is useless in this case, as you could see from the cover photo, it's a different era then the last voyage. Somehow you must think all new books should be up to date.

Look at this Hiroba Photo!

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Glad you're not a book critic!!!

All I wanted was a "Thank You" for informing others on a new reference.

PS: Rivet counting is bad for your health!

Thank you for alerting us of this book coming out. I was wondering why they never released a book about Yamato.

Now if you want to buy a book for the pretty pictures go ahead. But for those who are using the book as a reference to build their models this is not your book.

Regarding "it's a different era then the last voyage" are you positive of this? Yamato in October 1944 had a different AA director than the one depicted in both the cover and the interior of the book. The AA layout is incorrect. Yamato never had round AA shields on the deck and turret tops as the book depicts. I'm not going to remain silent as model builders are misinformed.

So buy this book for your library but not for ship building. I'm not a book critic. I'm a Yamato critic.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eLfVNaBMjvM

[baseballbrat]

So you're assuming that both Skulski's book and the Yamato Museum are incorrect?

Are you also assuming the deck configuration Yamato had when she sank was the only one?

How can you assume this book is depicting October 1944?

Where are you getting your reference from?

I have I would say 85% of the books published including Anatomy of the Ship Yamato and Model Art #735 Super Illustration which are considered the most accurate books available, along with multiple Japanese issues. Other books with eyewitness accounts give a sense of what Yamato was like, but these old guys only give a general account of what they saw and Japanese Naval records are written in a very ancient form of Japanese that only a few can understand. Even my japanese friend can't read this because they are hand written in Kanji no longer used.

Most of the books are Photo/CG books, so your comment about pretty picture books is kind of insulting to modelers, since most reference books are photos and illustrated drawings. It's kind of hard to read paragraphs of babble and put it on a model.

The whole point is you seem to be assuming about something you don't have in your hands, so your comments don't make sense.

Being a Yamato critic is great, but remember your playing with a half of deck of cards with all the face cards still missing. The ship is still at the bottom of the ocean and the experts are still scratching their heads. The original plans have been destroyed and all thats left are a handful of drawings that look more like notes and sketches. Way too much missing from the puzzle to come up with a definitive and accurate book. It will be interesting to see Skulski's new Anatomy of The Ship Yamato and Musashi book coming out this May. I've already pre-ordered it from Amazon at 40% discount. This will be the most accurate to date due to the newer dives using digital technology, but only depicts what was discovered through the dives and not through previous research material.

The reference books should show the complete picture from laying the keel through the last day. Using the last configuration as the only way she looked would be a great dis-service to the ones who lost their lives sailing on her. That 1/10 Hiroba display was built to show how Yamato looked in her heyday and not how she looked just before turning over into the abyss. Using the ten-go configuration in MHO would be insulting and would bring back bad memories from their loss during the war. Displaying Hiroba with a clean deck shows her as a symbol of pride and strength which makes going to the museum a source of nationalism. The full story of Yamato is not about the ship, but about the ones who served her.

I'm not trying to bust your balls. Just trying to get things right.

[Senkan]

"So you're assuming that both Skulski's book and the Yamato Museum are incorrect?" Not sure what you're saying here. Look a t the current picture of the Yamato 1/10 model and compare to pictures in book. Are they the same?

"Are you also assuming the deck configuration Yamato had when she sank was the only one?" Yamato's AA was upgraded in early 1945 to include the five AA guns of each side of the ship. Are you saying that this might be inaccurate and she had something else in April 1945?

"How can you assume this book is depicting October 1944?" The book is trying to depict Yamato in 1945. Did I say it was Yamato in 1944?

"Where are you getting your reference from?" Model Art #735 Super Illustration and about 15 other books. The Skulski book is old and inaccurate. Was printed in 1988. I think I heard they're going to update that book in 2017. I'll be looking forward to that!

"Using the ten-go configuration in MHO would be insulting and would bring back bad memories from their loss during the war years." I'm scratching my head at this one. What does this have to do with the actual configuration? Just because they don't weather and age the ship doesn't mean they shouldn't make it accurate.

I'm thinking you misread my post. My only reference to 1944 was to say Yamato had an upgraded AA director and the one shown in the book is incorrect. The 1/10 Kure Yamato shows how she looked when she sank. When Yamato sank she didn't have those directors. She never had round AA shields.

The 1/10 Hiroba display shows Yamato as she looked in 1945. They have been updating the ship to show new findings.

I've been a Yamato fan since I was 12 years old. 37 years ago. I can say I love Yamato. You're right. "The full story of Yamato is not about the ship, but about the ones who served her". And we have to honor them with being accurate. As accurate as possible. So being half ass doesn't work with me.

I'm not against making models that aren't 100 accurate. Some want to depict the models as the company made them. For me who is trying to turn a 1/200 Nichimo Yamato '44 into a Yamato '45 I have issues with the pictures in that book. I look at all the recent findings and look at that book and get upset at what I see.

[baseballbrat]

Where in this synopsis is the date 1945?

Super Drawings in 3D 50
The Japanese Battleship Yamato

Carlo Cestra

ISBN 978-83-65437-31-0
Yamato battleship was the lead ship of the Yamato class of Imperial Japanese Navy during the Second World War.
Named after the ancient Japanese Yamato Province, on the Kii peninsula, she was the first of four designed ships and was the heaviest, largest and most powerful battleship ever built, displacing about 72000 tons at full load and armed with nine 46 cm Type 94 main guns.
Yamato exceeded other country battleships not only by the displacement and the calibre of her guns, but also by the construction of her hull, armour protection, gunnery and optics. The superiority of her optic equipment gave her tremendous precision to her main gunfire.
She was an incredible achievement for the Japanese naval engineering and ship-building industry by any international standard�

� 100 pages
� 164 renders
� 10 anaglyphs
� Double sheet B2 with scale drawings
� Matte coated paper
� Format (sizes): A4 (210x297 mm)
� Booklet binding

This is the reason for this entire discussion!!! You assume this book is on the 1945 Yamato.
Do you understand Yamato wasn't built in 1945? The ship was launched in 1940, so where did the five years go to?

You're the expert here, so where on the cover do you see a 1945 version of this ship or the date 1945 printed on the book somewhere? I'll send you some glasses if you want.


"Are you also assuming the deck configuration Yamato had when she sank was the only one?" Yamato's AA was upgraded in early 1945 to include the five AA guns of each side of the ship. Are you saying that this might be inaccurate and she had something else in April 1945? "
We're NOT talking about 1945!!!, just discussing configurations from 1940-45.


"So you're assuming that both Skulski's book and the Yamato Museum are incorrect?" Not sure what you're saying here. Look a t the current picture of the Yamato 1/10 model and compare to pictures in book. Are they the same?"
Skulski's book and the photo I provided both had round AA Tubs!!! Does that make it wrong?


"How can you assume this book is depicting October 1944?" The book is trying to depict Yamato in 1945. Did I say it was Yamato in 1944?"......
Where do you see the date 1945 on this book or in the summary?


"Using the ten-go configuration in MHO would be insulting and would bring back bad memories from their loss during the war years." I'm scratching my head at this one. What does this have to do with the actual configuration? Just because they don't weather and age the ship doesn't mean they shouldn't make it accurate."
You obviously don't understand what I said. The Yamato Museum in Kure is "NOT" for the purpose of experts like you to walk around a nitpick details from the dive photos. It's for the citizens of Japan to go there and see the greatness of their country during WWII. Yamato was a symbol of pride during the war, thus she did not see a great amount of action. I would say Musashi saw more war then Yamato, and Shokaku was sunk the first day of trials. It would be an insult to the Japanese to configure the Hiroba for the 1945 voyage because it was a Kamikaze mission and was to be beached and used as a gun battery to defend Okinawa. You're not understanding what the museum stands for and only thinking of how accurate it is. Just don't tell us it's for us modelers to use as reference on our model projects. It's because the Japanese know more then us about their own ship, so we rely on them for reference. That's why they print all the books in Japanese and not in English.


"The 1/10 Hiroba display shows Yamato as she looked in 1945. They have been updating the ship to show new findings."
They are changing things like the details to reflect the dive images, but you'll never see it with a battle colored deck, a removed crane tower and missing antenna lines.


"So being half ass doesn't work with me"
What's half ass about not being able to be 100% correct due to lack of accurate information?


"I look at all the recent findings and look at that book and get upset at what I see"
Now's your chance to be a real expert and offer your knowledge.

Open up your mind up to something other then the year 1945. That was a very bad year!!!

[Senkan]

See on top of this page where it says ModelWarships.com? Why are you bringing up reasons, meaning, and understanding of the Yamato model in Kure and what it stands for? You say we shouldn't worry about the accuracy. I say we should.

Look at my original post "Looks nice but it doesn't seem very accurate." I was making an observation. Pretty simple. I'm focusing on my modeling preferences. You're defending this book like you're getting commision for it's sales.

So I'm going to go back to building my 1/200 Nichimo Yamato "45 and wait to see what others say about that book. And I'll be waiting for this book https://www.amazon.com/Battleship-Yamat ... 1844863174 Coming out May 2017

And I won't be buying the Kagero book.

[baseballbrat]

See on top of this page where it says ModelWarships.com? Why are you bringing up reasons, meaning, and understanding of the Yamato model in Kure and what it stands for? You say we shouldn't worry about the accuracy. I say we should.

Look at my original post "Looks nice but it doesn't seem very accurate." I was making an observation. Pretty simple. I'm focusing on my modeling preferences. You're defending this book like you're getting commision for it's sales.

So I'm going to go back to building my 1/200 Nichimo Yamato "45 and wait to see what others say about that book. And I'll be waiting for this book https://www.amazon.com/Battleship-Yamat ... 1844863174 Coming out May 2017

And I won't be buying the Kagero book.

Already pre-ordered Skulski's book.

Will also look for the Kagero book, because you can never have enough cross reference material.

You're not the only one here that knows about Skulski's new book. I sure hope you don't cut this one down as being inaccurate too!!!

[Senkan]

Someone likes being a Troll in this forum. Attacking people who voice their opinion. Shows character.

[bucketfoot-al]

Gentlemen, gentlemen, let's chalk all of this down to a misunderstanding and wish everybody a Happy Thanksgiving!

(And thanks for the reminder about the new Skulski book, BTW. I had forgotten about it. Now I'll pre-order one for myself for Christmas)

[baseballbrat]

Gentlemen, gentlemen, let's chalk all of this down to a misunderstanding and wish everybody a Happy Thanksgiving!

(And thanks for the reminder about the new Skulski book, BTW. I had forgotten about it. Now I'll pre-order one for myself for Christmas)

Vlad,
Order it from Amazon. They are giving a special 40% discount for pre-ordering!