Calling all Iowa-class (BB-61) fans

[steinerman]

Thanks Gents, I appreciate the responses. The photo Plastic Habit posted told me exactly what I needed to know. That photo shows a spare barrel tube right next to a cooling tube, and since TFD's plan book indicates that the spare barrel tubes are 4'-11" long and 3" in dia, I can easily scale the cooling tubes to be about 3" in dia and close to 4'-2" long. In 1:200 scale this would be slightly over 1/4" long.

Perfect!

Thanks again!!!!

[Harquebus]

I'm wondering how much work it would take to convert 1/200 Missouri into the 1980s version of the ship? I'm thinking that it would not be all that difficult providing Pontos can be persuaded to make a custom wooden deck and the Helo pad, and Shape Ways to make The modern weaponry , and some scratch building.

Someone on one of the Chinese forums has a 1991 or Gulf War version of the Trumpeter Missouri. I asked him if there was a build thread somewhere but he said no. Not that difficult to do, really. His was R/C and it was detailed the same level as a static model.

[Fliger747]

I actually converted my 1945 scratch built Missouri in 1:192 to the modern version. A very involved project! It's about 99.9% complete. There is a thread on it back in online scrathbuild/ 1:192 Missouri, My Build. All the stuff is scratch built though purchased components would save a lot of time. Deck is hand planked. Originally was going to RC it, but decided against, ex wife ran off with the RC stuff anyway.

[Harquebus]

Duly noted. Yours is fantastic by the way, Fliger747. Regarding RC, I figure if it's something that big or even an injected molded plastic kit with that much cavernous, empty space inside, it's almost a shame not to fill it with hardware to make it operate or just to make some things move. Your mileage may vary. Void where prohibited, batteries not included.

I have two concerns regarding the bow area on the IOWA class:

A) From the launching photos of three of the class (BB-61, 62 and 64) as far as I can tell, there appears to be a prominent knife edge seam on the bulbous area of the bow that was apparently 'smoothed over' later in their careers. Most kits have a prominent mold seam there as well (running the length of the hull) and it would be seem to be accurate to retain it for a WWII-era fit. Enhancing it with some styrene half round or maybe triangular rod might work well too.

New Jersey
PRESENT: http://navsource.org/archives/01/062/016215c.jpg (paint stripes actually highlight it well)
GONE: http://www.navsource.org/archives/01/0162021.jpg

I was wondering why it was present at launch and later removed.

B) How was the paravane chain attached to the forefoot(?) of the bow?

[bigjimslade]

I think that edge is just something put in place for launching. I have not seen it in any early but later pictures.


b) There are two tubes that run from just behind the paravane foot attachment all the way up to the main deck.

[Fliger747]

There is a small knife edge at the base front of the forefront that is for the paravane chains. One of the ships (just one) I believe NJ? (Hank would know) had it removed as the area was corroded and leaking into the forepeak. I added this to my ship as it is still present.

Cheers: Tom

[BB62vet]

The knife edge that Harq is referring to is on the very bow of the (4) IOWAs and the following picture of BB62 prior to launch shows this:

If you look at the white grid painted on the bow you will see the very front edge (knife edge) that is at an angle from the curved grid lines. This I don't think had anything to do with the paravanes or their operation.

As Flinger747 has mentioned, in later years (during her '80s commission) the paravane "eye" or bottom opening at the base of the bulbous bow was removed (in NEW JERSEY only) due to the corrosion and leakage resulting into the 7" dia. pipe that ran vertically internally up to the main deck. FYI - 7" pipe is an outdated and non std. pipe in today's world. The hole & bow was plated over, ground smooth, and that was that. In his book about the Long Beach Naval Shipyard, Richard Landgraff (Steel Foundation's Shop Manager) describes this entire episode with pictures. No sooner had this occurred than the navy brass wanted to know if the IOWAs still had Paravane capability due to the mining in the Gulf by the belligerents (Iraq/Iran) - this was in the early days of the Persian Gulf War. Perfect timing, right? NEW JERSEY never took part in the Gulf War and was decommed in 1991. The small chain that you often see in photos of the WWII/Korean War vintage IOWAs extending from the center hawse hole on the foc'sle down into the water (and into the eye) - well that chain runs from the hawse hole back to a small winch on the stbd side of the foc'sle just fwd. of the capstan windlasses. This winch was reactivated during 1967-68 by our crew for use in bringing up supplies from one of the storage lockers deep within the bow of the ship - in this case, paint lockers. Paravanes were removed in the mid-50s from all the IOWAs.

Here is a shot of BB63 in drydock (I have this picture named as being in LBSYD, but it very well may be Pearl Harbor) - it shows the paravane "eye" and the removal of that knife edge that the ship originally had at launch:

Hope this answers your question, maybe?

Hank

[Fliger747]

That knife edge!

Thanks hank, wonder what it was for?

[Fliger747]

I think that is at Pearl after the ship received it's last dry-docking as the underwater is painted in gray and the boot topping is at the museum ship low draft forward.

[James M]

Looks like the Iowa and New Jersey got the knife edge thing on the bow:
Iowa:
http://navsource.org/archives/01/061/016105i.jpg

New Jersey:
http://navsource.org/archives/01/062/016215b.jpg

Missouri:
http://navsource.org/archives/01/063/016302l.jpg

Wisconsin:
http://www.navsource.org/archives/01/016405w.jpg

[Harquebus]

Hank's got it! The knife-edge on the bow that extends from waterline or boot topping all the way down to the paravane "eye" basically. The knife-edge on the bow might also be called the cutwater; older nautical term there. Maybe I should have addressed my inquiry towards Hank from the get-go?

They knew the bulbous bow was good for speed but perhaps the designers still felt a need to have a sharp bow to "cut the water". Maybe it was a design compromise at the time? I couldn't see it prominently on Missouri so I didn't say she had that feature. Thanks, James M.

As to the paravane chain, I was wondering how best to attach it to the NJ I'm building, circa late, late postwar 1940's. So, Hank are you saying that the chain enters the "eye" and is attached inside there somehow? Or are you saying that the chain was run in a continuous loop--across the deck, through the center hawse hole, down the bow, into the paravane "eye" and up through the "7" dia. pipe that ran vertically internally up to the main deck" and back up to the little winch there?

[BB62vet]

Harq wrote:

As to the paravane chain, I was wondering how best to attach it to the NJ I'm building, circa late, late postwar 1940's. So, Hank are you saying that the chain enters the "eye" and is attached inside there somehow? Or are you saying that the chain was run in a continuous loop--across the deck, through the center hawse hole, down the bow, into the paravane "eye" and up through the "7" dia. pipe that ran vertically internally up to the main deck" and back up to the little winch there?

Um....this is a bit foggy to me also (the entire paravane deployment schematic, if you will). I have Googled Paravanes (you should also!) and get a "sense" of how there were deployed (one on either side of the ship) with the chain attachments to maintain their distance out from the ship as well as their relative location, but the actual routing of the chain from the main deck winch, thru the hawse hole, DOWN into the water in front of the bulb. bow and back up thru the 7" pipe inside the bow of the ship - is that the correct path or something we've missed? If you have a copy of the 1956 WISCONSIN Booklet of General Plans (.pdf) - the sheet showing the main deck - it shows the paravanes, their associated davits and cable reels and breakwaters located on the foc'sle of the ship. It does NOT show the small winch on the stbd. side of the foc'sle as on NEW JERSEY. But, how this was all set up and deployed, I'm not quite sure.

For your purposes, I would suggest simply a small chain running from the winch, thru the hawse hole, down the front of the ship, terminating inside the "eye" at the bulb, perhaps THRU the eye terminating below it, if that makes sense.

I think this was discussed last year or so on one of the threads regarding IOWAs but which one and when, etc. I can't recall. If I have time to do some research on this question, I will - no guarantees as to outcome, however

Hope this helps...

Hank

[Scott56]

Hi everyone,

Haven't built models since I was a kid but jumped back in the fray. Did the old Tamiya Missouri with the Eduard upgrade. First time with PE, not what I hoped for but learned a lot and it's presentable but not for here.

I did buy the Iowa and the pontos set with deck. I will say, I'm pleased with the quality and hardness of the pontos PE.

This go around I will not be correcting hull as I need way more practice. This thread has been very informative to say the least and I'm very impressed with the level of expertise.

Maybe in time I will have something worthy of posting. I have completed one of the Pontos bofars and I was pleasantly surprised of how it turned out. In regard to the grab rungs inside tubs played with that to no avail. Outside has not been a problem, except their magical way of disappearing.

Anyway, hope to be around here for a while.

[Scott56]

I do have a question and I think it has been answered earlier, but darned if I remember what page. Is it possible to tell me the height of the draft and the top of the black (beltline?) area of the hull?

Edited to add. Found info regarding boot dimensions on Hanks build thread. Finished reading this thread and I have bookmarked several pages. It has answered many questions I had so for now I only have one. The pontos parts 131 and 2 go as shown on front page of instructions? I have seen a picture in Sumrall's book pg 83. Are they on all tubs and if so any ideas how many per tub?

Thanks in advance

[Sutho]

I have constructed the Tamiya 1/350 USS Iowa with Pontos upgrade kit and WEM Colour Coat Paints. I toured the ship on 1st April 2014 in San Pedro as a museum ship and have worked on upgrading this kit since then.

I hand painted the American flag on the turret and manged to find 50 decal stars from various decal sheets to add.

[navydavesof]

What a beautiful job! Awesome build. I hope you have submitted to the gallery. We would love to see some higher resolution pictures, mate!

[Sutho]

What a beautiful job! Awesome build. I hope you have submitted to the gallery. We would love to see some higher resolution pictures, mate!

Thanks. I have submitted it for the site after my submission for the new Ark Royal kit. I notice today my Ark Royal kit is featured so it may be a few more days until Iowa gets up.

I wish the site could handle a higher resolution than what they have already as the photos are all resized to around 1000 pixels wide.

[navydavesof]

Thanks. I have submitted it for the site after my submission for the new Ark Royal kit. I notice today my Ark Royal kit is featured so it may be a few more days until Iowa gets up.

Awesome! I am really anxious to hear how you built her and what your challenges were adapting the Pontos kit to the original kit. For instance, how was the wood deck?

I will be facing a lot of the same challenges as I finish my 2015 version of Iowa later this year. As is described in one of my threads, I have a bunch of modern changes to her, but I have those changes covered. The hard part will be adapting the Pontos kit to the New Jersey I am using for the project.

I wish the site could handle a higher resolution than what they have already as the photos are all resized to around 1000 pixels wide.

I really look forward to the gallery post, man!

Later this year I will be making a USS Wisconsin fitted after she had received the follow-on BB61 Modernization Program. The next modernization was called the Warship Improvement Program and was scheduled, and Wisconsin's modernization was funded for 1996. That change would have added 96 VLS tubes to her super structure, replaced Mts 51 and 52 with NATO Sea Sparrow launchers, replaced Mts 53-56 with 5"/54caliber twin mounts of the Montana design, an aft mast with a counter battery radar, the TAS-32 radar, Mk95 Sea Sparrow illuminators, and SPG-53 radars in place of the Mk37s forward and aft, and Mk38 Mod1s. That will be one heck of a project!

[Sutho]

I might have to take more photos. I actually had to cut away sections below the bridge to make that open passageway across the width of the ship. I also cut open the bridge and used excess WEM photo etch to build the armoured wheelhouse.

I don't have much time now but I will reply in detail later.

Pontos is great but there are some mistakes in their instructions. If you are clever you will find the miss-numbered parts and work out the correct places. Some of the support braces are not uniform to all ships either.

I actually liked the wooden deck. You do not need glue and it is very fine and makes minimal difference with the fit.

Aft of the fore funnel I cut off the rounded structure and used a cardboard back from a notepad that matched the thickness of the deck and made a straight edge behind the fore funnel as Iowa had.

The phalanx platforms on Iowa are more boxy and need extending.

Close up some of my fixes are not perfect and have cosmetic scratches but it is not that bad a deal.

[RaceFuel]

Thanks. I have submitted it for the site after my submission for the new Ark Royal kit. I notice today my Ark Royal kit is featured so it may be a few more days until Iowa gets up.

Awesome! I am really anxious to hear how you built her and what your challenges were adapting the Pontos kit to the original kit. For instance, how was the wood deck?

I will be facing a lot of the same challenges as I finish my 2015 version of Iowa later this year. As is described in one of my threads, I have a bunch of modern changes to her, but I have those changes covered. The hard part will be adapting the Pontos kit to the New Jersey I am using for the project.

I wish the site could handle a higher resolution than what they have already as the photos are all resized to around 1000 pixels wide.

I really look forward to the gallery post, man!

Later this year I will be making a USS Wisconsin fitted after she had received the follow-on BB61 Modernization Program. The next modernization was called the Warship Improvement Program and was scheduled, and Wisconsin's modernization was funded for 1996. That change would have added 96 VLS tubes to her super structure, replaced Mts 51 and 52 with NATO Sea Sparrow launchers, replaced Mts 53-56 with 5"/54caliber twin mounts of the Montana design, an aft mast with a counter battery radar, the TAS-32 radar, Mk95 Sea Sparrow illuminators, and SPG-53 radars in place of the Mk37s forward and aft, and Mk38 Mod1s. That will be one heck of a project!

I've heard of these planned refits...weren't the refitted Iowas originally scheduled and programmed to be in service until 2010 originally?