The Ship Model Forum

With Hindenburg slowly but surely--but still veeeery slowly drying her hastily ( overthick!) water....

viewtopic.php?f=59&t=100731



a new ship has been on the bench for the past few weeks...

alas 1/1 scale real life work has also conspired to interfere with progress..

Jeanne'Arc-- six funnels and a clean profile...

a 'modern' Kombrig kit... how hard can it be...?




Ha!

I could of course not leave the clean un-adorned hull plain as the manufacture depicted it...?

Photos of the real thing always show the ship--in common with most French ships--to have the hatches and open for ventilation, moored or underway almost always!
As such-- to add interest to a black hull I started the laborious task of opening hatches....

On previous builds in 1/700--Carnot and Massena-- I cheated a little and went for 'effect'

albeit successfully in my view...!

The Mk 1 version Massena ==> http://www.modelwarships.com/reviews/sh ... eview.html


The Mk 2 version Carnot==> http://www.modelwarships.com/reviews/sh ... index.html

In 1/350 I had on the build of my Bouvet I cut rough apertures and lined them with brass squares and backfilled...

Bouvet in 1-350 ( 5 pages) => http://www.modelwarships.com/reviews/sh ... index.html

This time it seemed logical to make life much more difficult and employ the technique used in 1/350 on the 1/700 version of the Jeanne hull....

It does take some time to be sure....!!!!!!

but the end effect hopefully WILL be worth it!


Rgds

JIM B

Open hatches ? While this must have been pain-takingly slow careful work (square not round holes) I clearly notice a frame, will these ''holes'' remain open ? Do you know what the water-tight door actually looked like other then a simple cover of metal sheeting ? While many have an eye-brow over their port holes, its still very much a hole in the side where perhaps thickly covered paint would hide the detail, especially on 1-700, what is the reason other then displaying a protruding gun to open the port holes on such a small model ?

Interesting subject, the "Cigarette case" ship.
I have some pics of a model at Toulon's Marine museum if you're interested.

@ Moomoon....


PM sent-- merci!

@ Alec
Open hatches ? While this must have been pain-takingly slow careful work (square not round holes)
I clearly notice a frame, will these ''holes'' remain open ?

Do you know what the water-tight door actually looked like other then a simple cover of metal sheeting ?

While many have an eye-brow over their port holes, its still very much a hole in the side where perhaps thickly covered paint would hide the detail, especially on 1-700, what is the reason other then displaying a protruding gun to open the port holes on such a small model ?

I will be depicting the ship with her hatches open- as that is the way the real ship had most of the time in her career.-ie for authenticety and realism--as well as making the model more interesting visually

The hatches were hinged to open externally--this will break up the blankness of the hull on the model

I do have some useful high res images that show the inside of the casemate opening doors to have a cruciform reiforcing on the insides of the hatch lid --outside they were plain flat steel

some of the smaller hatches were glazed behind --again this will make it more interesting to look at

The hatches on the aft superstructure had portholes on them--which will make it more interesting still....

such as this

Oh, I love this ship. I built her about two years ago, she literally flew together. One of the most fun to build Combrig kits ever. Only the small 47mm guns were tricky with their PE spiderleg-like assembly. No doubt you'll be able to elevate her to a new level of detail.

Superb subject.
My great grandfather was an officer on this ship.
My father has preserved a beautiful photograph of this ship

Looking forward to seeing what you do on this...very interesting looking ship.

Beautiful subject Jim!

I like those square hatches.

Dino

Thank you all for your kind words.

The square hatch surrounds are all from different sources of PE ladderstock, both ship and railway.


there are 5 different sizes and shapes of hatch/ opening that I have identified off plans and photos...--and they had to be laboriously marked and matched to the indents on the hull--and I then had to find suitable square or oblong PE shapes to suit the inner opening.- some of which were cut from 1/350 depthcharge racks

I have used mainly matt enamel paint as the filler-- sands easily and works well as a guide coat

I am actually looking forward to having this somewhat tedious stage completed and getting paint on hull so that I can get her mounted....

nice to see this work. Im doing something similar with Hoshe . Though with the large gun ports Im cutting them by hand . Hard to replicate all the ports without the ladder stock. But I dont have your extensive pe stash . Ill be watching this build eagerly

Hello Jim

still an original project, and that comes out once again the beaten track
seen the number of French ships that you have made,we can say that ,you are the specialist model maker of French Navy, the most English
felcitation
Nicolas

Phew!!

at last the starboard side is now also completed...

the photos indicate what a tedious process the framing of the apertures was ...
The hull was prepared to be screwed to its base to prevent warping in the future, lots of screws along the centre-line
into pre-drilled holes.

Once the hull had been fully faired and painted...

thereafter I applied the boot-top and stripe

===> the thin white line was done by applying white decal strips first.

Once dried and sealed with varnish--I applied another layer of red decal striping over the top-adjusting to give an even thin stripe.

another layer of varnish was sprayed on to seal.


I then gave the deck a first coating of Revell 83, with a wash of of Humbrol 133...



Once the hull has been mounted the model should progress more speedily!

( Hindeburg is still drying veeeery slowly! )

Most convincing, and a most dedicated approach that absolutely needs to be done just right in all respects to look credible. Jim, you seem to love slim margins for error and some thrills in your modeling - as countless times before, I�m very much humbled indeed.

Best of luck for both projects from

Frank

@Jim Looks interesting so far.

Here you find a museum model of the Jeanne d'Arc.

http://www.modellmarine.de/index.php?op ... &catid=178

Have you used in the Hindenburg acrylic gel for the water base?


J�rg

Thank you for your word of encouragement and useful link!

The ship is now afloat at 16-18 knots or so ....

Using my usual method of artists water colour paper over cocktail sticks , and infused with thin CA to render hard and impermeable to moisture as illustrated and described here:



viewtopic.php?f=4&t=37223




Numerous thin coats of Humbrol 28 to a multitude of smaller parts as well as the funnels concluded today's progress!

JB

JIM BAUMANN wrote:The ship is now afloat at 16-18 knots or so ....

Let's see, you have a rather large wave with a crest near the forward and aft shoulder of the hull and one between them. According to Wiki the ship is about 145m long so the wave is about 40.5m, measuring from my screen. The speed of a wave is V=sqrt(g*wavelength / (2*pi) ) = 8.4 m/s so the ship is now doing 16.3 kts. Let's not assume that the wave length is 90.5m because that would means the ship speed exceeds the maximum speed of the ship. To avoid direct disqualification, you may need to emphasize the wave crest at the centre of the ship more or your diorama could be considered physically impossible.

Fair Point EJ !

Guilty as charged !


!--though I think you have too much knowledeg on this very particular subject....

and perhaps too much time on your hands...

will pm you later for greater detail in explanation... and of suggested cure!

JB

EJFoeth, would be right, if the ship was in calm water. However, in your case it seems to be running against a swell. So you would have some sort of inteference patterns between the waves created by the moving ship and the natural waves. I think some sort of bow-wave would run over the large wave at the first quarter of the hull.

Such interference pattern are in practice very difficult to predict. One would have to hunt for photographs of a similar situation.

wefalck

It depends a bit on what tools you have, but for us it's quite easy to calculate the wave pattern of a ship hull



This example nicely shows the wave created at the bow running along the hull.

If you have an incoming wave, the 'easiest' approach is to calculate the wave of the ship, add the incoming wave and the interaction of the hull (diffraction) and then add the waves radiated by the ship due its resulting motions in waves. Naturally, if you do not have the proper software to do this, it will cost you a few PhDs.

Perhaps I should write a no-math post on how waves behave and interact with the hull for modelers to have a better understanding how to model the wave pattern. It would help if somebody could email me a 3D file of the hull of HMS Hood

I fully agree that using a photograph is an excellent solution; in some heavy seas, the wave pattern is a dynamic mess...

We are getting a bit off-topic now ... anyway it would be very instructive to see some model calculations that superimpose a ship-generated wave-field with natural ones coming from different angles and of different height. In real life things would be more complicated, particular when you fancy some dramatic views with breaking waves - which, I believe, still would be difficult to calculate (I did learn a bit about this at university some 35 years ago, long before such computer simulations and visualisations became possible).

wefalck