The Ship Model Forum

I have been toying with the idea of trying to emulate the famous John Prothero-Thomas, who ( 100% scratch) built the fabulous model of HMS Minotaur in 1/ 384 scale.

.... except I wanted to make life much harder for myself and do it half the size in 1/700...!

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JPT's model :


However--rather than follow slavishly in exactly the pioneering and well trodden foots-steps of Mr JPT...

I will be trying to build a model of the virtually identical sister ship HMS Agincourt
which has slightly taller funnels set at a rake!


I am deeply indebted to Mr John Prothero Thomas for freely sharing his knowledge and working drawings. without which this model probably would not have been started


( and hopefully by the end of this thread will be completed! )

Interestingly-- Agincourt survived -albeit it a much altered state until 1960 !!! as a floating coaling hulk


( in itself an interesting prospect to make a model of! )
( Images from websites 'world naval ship forum' and 'Battleships and cruisers' )
However I plan on building my model HMS Agincourt prior her re-armament when she received un-equal size gunports and reduced top-rig--

I like the purity and symmetry of her early incarnation!--when she still carried yards on all masts

Mine will be in her absolute heyday when she was flagship of the channel fleet

The hull is to be carved from solid wood- a fine piece of 50 year old teak ( I guess it must be seasoned well by now!!!)


-mainly because I want to have solid anchorage for the extensive and complex rig- those five(!) masts are happiest being immovably located in a solid hill--such as resin or hardwood.

- a hollow styrene carcass hull would not in my view give the required strength...
I am also happy carving hull shapes from a blank--I have previous form for this enterprise in my youth..;

==> when I was 17-18 years old I earned myself sufficient money for my first MG sportscar by carving and selling half hull models--using nothing cleverer than a Stanley knife and sandpaper.

*(some of the un-sold ship-models I still have --see below)

HMS Agincourt History round-up @ Wikipedia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Agincourt_%281865%29


I made some external cross-sectional shape templates in styrene sheet based on JPT's drawing--which in turn is based on the original NMM plans of Agincourt and having rescaled to 1/700 drawings, flipped , reversed and re-sized photos to 1/700 --

I felt a start needed to be made!
a useful small version of NMM Agincourt plan has appeared in print in a book


These days I like to get a project moving with greater alacrity than pure hand-whittling -- so resorted to mechanical aids in roughing out the shapes


From looking at photos in side elevation is easy to assume that the ship had one long deck

==> ( such as found on he 1860 HMS Warrior!! ) -however there is a distinctive fore and poop deck-- with high Bulwarks atop of which there is the hammock stowage .
Having HMS Warrior a mere 17 miles away is very handy--as Minotaur and Warrior were close contemporaries -and many aspects of fitting out are likely to be very similar

On Agincourt's hull the mid section had to be carved out--I did this with saw cut for and aft and carved the centre out with a 'Stanley' Knife and eventually pared the center deck flat.
the sharp--yet higher up , very bluff bow was quite tricky to carve
The fwd guns had cutaways either side

Thereafter the deck "planking" made of Evergreen N-sale car siding--was added and glued on with slow-set CA
This will be cut back and sanded flush with the hull.

That is the tangible progress so far .

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I intend presenting the ship on the opposite tack to JPT's model motor-sailing on Port tack ( as in this World Naval ship forum image)

More soon I hope!!


Jim Baumann

Jim,

Fantastic job on the bow. As far as I am concerned "quite tricky" is next to impossible. I carve hulls 4x as large (which is at least 4x easier) and the only way I can get a curved, pointed bow vertical throughout it's length is to cheat and use a centerline insert.

hi jim
here comes another master piece you are a true jedi of model building
as always looking forward to following this
gary

Most curious

Brilliant subject and nice to see that finally someone is taking on the 'Black Battlefleet' here. It will be interesting to compare your technique to Callen's approach to Solferino. Agincourt was built in reponse to Solferino and Magenta.
viewtopic.php?f=13&t=82601&hilit=solferino

Following with interest Mr Baumann.
Rob.

Agincourt had virtually no sheer ( deckspring) fore and aft

certainly nothing discernible in 1/700 APART from the very bow...

I pared down the previously fitted deck to a mere wafer


and re-decked with a small wedge to bring the bow up to match the plans


I also drilled all the way through the hull the positions of masts and funnels so as not to lose the items once paint and fittings are added


Being a broadside Iron clad she had gunports -- much like HMS Warrior--

a continuation of the multiple levels of gunports of the big Sailing ships-of-the-line( HMS Victory et al !)

The methodology of these held little fear as I had already done similar openings on the resin hull of Jeann'eD'arc

( finished model) http://www.modelshipgallery.com/gallery ... /index.htm

(method in build thread) viewtopic.php?f=59&t=104027


I will however admit to some trepidation--as this was wood.... direction of grain etc

I first assessed and marked their longitudinal positions from plans and photos, then applied some vynil tape to give me horizontal lower edge location...
With a Microchisel ( Mission models-thanks Harry @ BFM ! ) I made a horizontal cut top and bottom and a vertical cut each side.

this then allowed me to 'flip' out the square as it slit on the grain--the advantage of working with wood!

Thereafter I deep drilled the apertures before applying the brass inserts

I deliberately made the apertures oversize--wood is not that precise a medium-( with my lack of wood-know how anyway!)-so as to allow for wiggle room for the insert.

The inserts were made of brass ladderstock.

I sieved thru my PE stash and spares box until I found some 1/200 ladder stock whose internal aperture was suitable.
I the simply edge glued the inserts and spent approx 10-15 mins on each aperture.
I may need to pull some out yet to get them 100% square--but the overall effect should be good.

More progress soon


Jim Baumann

Great build this Jim.

You have not only the knowledge but the know how and its nearly allways scratch. Very Interesting to watch a master at work.
Great ship this.

Very well executed so far! There is much to learn from your build!



Bob Pink.

Very Interesting, JB.

BTW, I did find some Micro-Chisel replacement tip sets, let me know if you need some.

"we are not worthy, we are not worthy" (cit. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-FucbvoFFy0 )


magnificient start. magnificent ship. magnificent carving skill.

again,


"we are not worthy, we are not worthy"

I'm going to follow this build with Interest as my Great Grandfather was a petty officer on this ship in the 1860's. Late around 1868-1870. [and yes it really is my great grandfather! my grandfather was born in 1886 ]
Anyway awesome work keep it up i want to see what it will be like finished.

Michael

Jim, I'm avidly following this one - hoping for enough inspiration to start my USS Kearsarge - a contemporary, if not the same weight class . This is going to be magnificent.

Hi Jim what a wonderful ship you selected. Absolutely wonderful and my prefered period.
As I am fiddling arround now for months with sails and rigging of my Koreets in 1/350 you are doing this in 1/700. Far more masts and sails and of course a lot more of rigging. Oh what a difference!

Please master, leave us the adress of your trained spiders!
Peter

You always make it look as if it's easy

Love to see your builds

Hello Jim

wonderful display of knowledge to make like this it looks so simple!!!!!!
but it really requires a good command of various technical,it is magnificent
cheers
nicolas

small scale but huge difficulties
Interested to see how you will give a smooth surface on the wood hull. I've tried with several layers of thin matt paint+many smooth sandings or with liquid CA -yet that's nasty and stinky - but it was never perfect.

[color=#SCRATCH BUILDINGFF0000][/color]
Jim, so when are we going to get a master for FWL.


I'm SURE Mr Surfacer 500 will do the trick with the wood grain Moomoon

Roy

Looking good JB. Is this the FW kit then?

Cheers,

Rob

Contrary to popular opinion I have not fallen off a cliff-- merely 1/1 scale work has been rather hectic of late


The bulwarks have been constructed of two layers of styrene strip with a small gap left on top



This is so as to be able to drop some round styrene rod into it to help simulate the canvas covered hammock stowage

when all is set I shall infill the turn from the edge of the outside of the bulwark to rod so as to give a smooth transition.

First coat of paint will be used a sealing and guide coat when sanding--thereafter a couple of coats of dark grey-black...

then the interesting part begins-- detailing the deck and outside, masts and rigging et al!


More soon

JB