Calling all Bismarck and Tirpitz fans

[109]

Yes, it folds flush to the hull when at sea.

[chuck]

can anyone point me to some clear photos of the deck edge railing on german capital ships folded down on deck? i am building a 1/200 scale Bismarck. I would like to know if the stanchion fold forward or to the rear, and whether the chain cables for the railing is left attached to the stanchions when the railing folds down, or if they are removed.

[FW_Allen]

Not sure this is much help Chuck, but I noticed in both the book �Prinz Eugen Im Ersten Gefecht� and the famous PK film from Rhein�bung (available on YouTube under the title �Prinz Eugen Im Ersten Gefecht�) that PG�s railing stanchions pivoted backwards from the base. Can�t really see the actual lines/chains very well though. I noticed rear pivoting rails on one of �The Twins� in �Schlachtschiff im Fahrt� as well.

[Thegreenmachine]

Are there any pictures of Bismarck during winter 40/41? I'm looking for a period when all rangefinders were installed (rear and top were installed earlier, the forward one in late 1940) and before they applied the baltic camo scheme.

[EJFoeth]

The camouflage was applied before the forward rangefinder was installed, see

https://www.kbismarck.com/photo034.html

[Thegreenmachine]

Thank you! I know this picture but was never aware of the camo scheme visible on it. Gotta think now whether to omit the rangefinder or apply the dreaded baltic stripes on the superstructure...

I'm aware of the later schemes with the stripes only on the lower hull or afterwards when it was all covered up. But I had hoped to make my kit during the earlier stages of her career.

[Jon C Ryckert]

Would anyone happen to know if there was any noticeable color difference between the aluminum bronze on Bismarck's funnel cap and silver? If there is, would you know of a good manufacturers match? Thanks, Jon

[81542]

Jon,

"Aluminiumbronze" as used by the Kriegsmarine in World War 2, was given a RAL Number, which is 9006. If you can find a model-making paint manufacturer that markets a paint to that specification (and they do exist) you won't go wrong. There is a copy of the official colour chart attached to Eric Bergerud's post of 7 Feb 2016. Open the link in Mikasa's post of 28 Nov on the "Paiint (spelling!) to use for the High Seas Fleet" and spool on down.

81542

[Jon C Ryckert]

81542, I tried searching for the pages you mentioned, but I must have been looking in the wrong areas of this message board. I did a online search for RAL9006 and I will just get as close as I can with what I came up with. Thank you very much for replying though.

[Timmy C]

81542, I tried searching for the pages you mentioned, but I must have been looking in the wrong areas of this message board. I did a online search for RAL9006 and I will just get as close as I can with what I came up with. Thank you very much for replying though.

Here's the post in question: viewtopic.php?f=60&t=161549#p681545

81542, note you can grab the URL for any reply by clicking the Subject of the reply - that'll reload the page with the URL set to point directly to the reply.

[81542]

Tim,

Many thanks: I will try that next time but unfortunately my age does not make taking on new things any easier, my apologies.

Jon,

I hope that you found the colour chart by following Tim's link.

For the interest of all, the chart is contained in the second revised edition of Jung, Abendroth and Kelling's "Anstriche und Tarnanstriche der deutschen Kriegsmarine:" ISBN is 3-7637-5946-6. The (German language) book was published by Bernard und Graefe Verlag in 1997 and also contains 3 other charts of colours, 2 of which I take to be for camouflage colours that have no RAL numbers. These may however, be covered by some model paint manufacturer but I am not sure.

81542

[Jon C Ryckert]

Jon,

I hope that you found the colour chart by following Tim's link.

81542,

Yes sir, I did find the chart that you are referencing. Thank you.

Timmy C,

Thank you for taking the time to find that link.

I found some online color matching charts that had RAL9006 on them and a good match that was common on the was Tamiya AS-12 Bare Metal Silver, witch, I just happen to have on hand.
Thanks again to you both, Jon

[Thegreenmachine]

I am somewhat confused about the different tones of dark grey used on the superstructure of Bismarck. Were the steel decks the same dark grey used for the turret tops and would this be RAL7016 or rather RAL 7024? Or were different tones used for each?

I've used all my reference books (German Naval Camouflage Vol.1 by Asmussen, Super 3D Drawings and Anatomy of the Ship, as well as the color charts in Tirpitz Vol.1 - Vol.3) but all sources differ from each other...
My best quess currently would be RAL7016 for the steel decks and RAL7024 for the turret tops and false bow.

I want to do Bismarck in her April 1941 pattern, by the way

[81542]

Thegreenmachine,

Re: Your last post concerning the greys to be used on your model of BISMARCK April 1941.

I've taken the liberty of using Google Translate to work on the purposes of RAL 7016 and 7024 as given in the extract from the German publication "Anstriche und Tarnanstriche der deutschen Kriegsmarine" (See the link in Timmy C's post of 29 Nov 2024). There is one word that does not "work," however and if either Wefalck or Maxim see this I would be grateful for their advice but this is my interpretation on your query. The parts in quotes are the translations from Google. Those in parentheses are my comments.

RAL 7016 Used for "Ship's bottom paint (WL) (I take that to mean "WasserLinie:" water-line or boot-topping, if you prefer) III grey (and) non-slip exterior deck paint."

RAL 7024 Used for "Heel" (That confuses me! Wefalck and Maxim will have a better idea) colour dark grey for outside and inside.

I would therefore interpret the request for advice in your question as follows: RAL 7024 was used for the forward and after parts of the hull and that RAL was used for the decks, tops of the main armament gunhouses and the boot-topping. I would presume of course, that the shade used for the boot-topping would be non-slip nature.

Hope this helps.

81542

[Guest]

Does anyone know how these deck hatch covers were used.
- are the frames permanent installation or removable, looking at the picture attached I presume they would restirct the turret movement.
- did they use the tarpaulin covers while sailing or just in port?

[81542]

Guest,

Yes: if the German navy (of whatever political system was in government) was like those of the British Empire, the frames for the covers were removable. They were usually only rigged in harbour. The frames were usually of galvanised tubular metal but if found on a larger ship, say a battleship or cruiser, those on the quarterdeck might have been made of brass and kept polished.

The covers were made of canvas and sometimes painted. That over the admiral's hatchway might have been made of something like "duck" (a fine, light canvas) and kept scrubbed white.

81542

[Thegreenmachine]

@81542: Thanks for your detailed answer. I did some research in the meantime and I think you are correct that RAL 7016 would be used for the steel decks. I might use a little bit lighter color to recreate the surface of a non-slippery surface, but definitely darker than RAL 7024.

[rvuorenr]

Guest,

Yes: if the German navy (of whatever political system was in government) was like those of the British Empire, the frames for the covers were removable. They were usually only rigged in harbour. The frames were usually of galvanised tubular metal but if found on a larger ship, say a battleship or cruiser, those on the quarterdeck might have been made of brass and kept polished.

The covers were made of canvas and sometimes painted. That over the admiral's hatchway might have been made of something like "duck" (a fine, light canvas) and kept scrubbed white.

81542

Thanks, for prompt reply, building my model on high seas. Noticed afterwards, that I didn't log in and appeared as guest. All the best,

rvuorenr

[Thegreenmachine]

According to "Anatomy of the Ship", Bismarck had a black main mast around april 1941. Was this really black paint or just soot from the funnel?

[rvuorenr]

I wonder why the searhclight dome appears to be very light colour compared to the rest of the ship in this one the last pictures of Bismarck. In all other pictures it doesn't strand out like this.