Quest for an elusive book...

Stefano · Post by **Stefano** » Mon Nov 06, 2006 7:08 am

does anyone knows about "The ships that never were, a collection of cancelled naval projects 1918-1922" by Peter A. Marshall? It seems to have the best IJN #13 LDs around, as well as many other goods. Any info welcomed.

linux · Post by **linux** » Mon Nov 06, 2006 8:35 am

Never heard of it, but I am intrigued. A web search drew a blank except for a reference in an old message on the All the World's Battlecruisers forum. If it was a book then presumably it was either privately published or never published. It sounds more like a journal article though, � la "Washington's Cherrytrees" in the early issues of Warship quarterly. I say that just because I don't think there's enough information on the 1918-1922 never-were projects to fill a decent sized book! That's especially true of the Japanese projects. I'll be happy to be proved wrong though.

Stefano · Post by **Stefano** » Mon Nov 06, 2006 9:49 am

Yes, when Googling (and other...) leave you still alone, you feel disappointed. Mr. Marshall seems to have been a regular on warship International, so may be someone in modelwarships' network knows him personally and may ask?

linux · Post by **linux** » Mon Nov 06, 2006 10:38 am

I also doubt whether any authoritative drawings of the Number 13 class battleships were ever published. They were very much future projects using future 18-inch guns. I have seen sketches in books, but they are not very detailed. And as always the sources of the sketches are never cited.

Perhaps it's like the B-65 class battlecruisers which were cancelled in 1942. All the sketches of those seem to derive from a drawing in a 1950s Japanese journal which was subsequently reprinted in Warship International. Over time the original source is forgotten and nobody knows how authoritative the sketches actually are. It's possible that original drawings of B-65 do exist somewhere, but if so they have yet to be published.

It's different for the Kaga class battleships and the Amagi class battlecruisers. Obviously they actually started building, and authoritative drawings of them have been published.

Stefano · Post by **Stefano** » Mon Nov 06, 2006 12:58 pm

Actually, the book was referred by Marshall himself on a WI #, as the place from were the very good #13 LD published on WI was taken. I guess a book must exist, if the author quotes it

. Anyway, the #13 seems to be not a official design, but a "private" one, from one of the IJN designer. The LD is much better than Breyer's.

linux · Post by **linux** » Mon Nov 06, 2006 3:21 pm

OK, I found something. Peter A. Marshall drew the profile and plan for the instructions to the IHP 1/700 G-3 battlecruiser design.

Image from http://www.steelnavy.com (is that allowed?)

It's not much, but it's a start.

Stefano · Post by **Stefano** » Mon Nov 06, 2006 3:48 pm

Yes it is! Have to chek my IHP #13 instructions.

This is the drawing included in WI, 1/1999 p. 90:

Laurence Batchelor · Post by **Laurence Batchelor** » Tue Nov 21, 2006 3:05 pm

This Japanese what If book I have could this be the book Marshall quote's???

http://www.amazon.co.jp/gp/product/4877 ... 27-2596713

Stefano · Post by **Stefano** » Tue Nov 21, 2006 4:13 pm

Lozza1981 wrote:This Japanese what If book I have could this be the book Marshall quote's???

http://www.amazon.co.jp/gp/product/4877 ... 27-2596713

Don't believe so (I have the book, too, but I can't see nothing similar to the drawing); a gentleman on another board noticed that there is no actual mention to a book in the picture... the mystery deepens.

Laurence Batchelor · Post by **Laurence Batchelor** » Tue Nov 21, 2006 5:07 pm

This drawing is surely from Breyer's book with line drawings, has anyone checked that?

Perhaps also try Watts book on the Japanese Navy too.

RNfanDan · Post by **RNfanDan** » Wed Nov 22, 2006 1:45 am

Lozza1981 wrote:Perhaps also try Watts book on the Japanese Navy too.

At first, I thought the same thing---that drawing (once the super-massive file size pounded my processor for five minutes) looks like a Nani work---but if it is, it's not nearly as detailed as most.

I had to crunch that behemoth down to a manageable file size just to get it up on my screen, by filtering it through photo software. After that, I enhanced it to smooth out the lines and improve contrast, and this resulted in an image that looks unlike Nani's. It has more in common with Breyer, as you indicated.

Mysterious, indeed...