Making Masts from brass rod

[Islander]

I read that many of you replace the plastic kit masts with brass. I am trying to do this and am wondering what glue you use to glue the cross pieces to the main mast. I've been using superglue, but it does not seem to work - i.e. no strength and the pieces fall apart. Should I perhaps use plastic rod for the cross pieces?
Thanks in advance,
John

[arnobiz]

Hi John,

I use plastic rod for everything, but I am only starting my first mast! I'll tell you if it does not work. For brass masts it seems to me that some people weld the brass parts together and then add the cross members in plastic rod. The welding part is why I decided to stick to plastic.

[Devin]

Mark where your mast pieces will cross, where the glue will be applied. Take a small metal file and file those two areas flat. That will give you more surface area for the bond and you should not have any problems. I use super glue (CA) for all of my masts and they have stood up well to rigging, painting, even dropping, without coming apart.

[MartinJQuinn]

Mark where your mast pieces will cross, where the glue will be applied. Take a small metal file and file those two areas flat. That will give you more surface area for the bond and you should not have any problems. I use super glue (CA) for all of my masts and they have stood up well to rigging, painting, even dropping, without coming apart.

Also, brush a little accelerator (aka zip kicker) on one of the parts, then put the CA/Super Glue on the other part. When you join them, the accelerator will harden the CA/Super Glue almost immediately, and make a stronger bond.

[les]

To stiffen a mast you can also use plastic tube with a brass rod inserted inside it. That way you're gluing plastic to plastic. I have used brass and plastic with C/A and like above I filed the cross point flat to give it more surface. Haven't had a problem yet.

[arnobiz]

Thanks guys. Do you have pictures of your masts under construction?

[Devin]

I've got a few shots in-progress in my diorama build write-up on this site.

Something else for metal-to-metal joints is this Wave black CA glue. It has a lot of advantages over regular CA, but the best one I've found is that it's more flexible when cured. I've glued metal to metal and metal to plastic with it on the USS Weehawken build and I find it MUCH more forgiving of the errant smack of the finger or drop to the floor. It holds and flexes when regular CA snaps. Unfortunately Starship Modeler is the only place I know that stocks it in the US, and as you can see they're out right now. The good news is that if you get some, it lasts forever, I've had my bottle in-use and open for over a year now and it's just as good as the first day I opened it.

[Ron Smith]

One word for brass to brass structural joints: Solder!

[Karsten]

One word for brass to brass structural joints: Solder!

Okay, give up the secrets to soldering brass rod. I have tried and tried without any luck. Then again way back when we were suppose to make a wireless radio in shop my soldering skills were far from even close.

Karsten

[Islander]

Hi,
Thanks for all the tips. Soldering ... well, a bit beyond me I'm afraid, as I've never soldered a thing in my life. Would you also solder for 1/700 scale?
Cheers,
John

[Ron Smith]

One word for brass to brass structural joints: Solder!

Okay, give up the secrets to soldering brass rod. I have tried and tried without any luck. Then again way back when we were suppose to make a wireless radio in shop my soldering skills were far from even close.

Karsten

Um, sure.......clean metal of joint, jig in place on non-melting/burning surface, flux joint with liquid rosin flux, clean iron tip, tin the tip, wipe it on a damp sponge, apply tip to joint, apply solder to other side,remove solder when it flows into joint, remove iron, tin iron tip, place in holder, clean flux from joint with acetone. Take longer to type than do. I use an adjustable iron and 63/37 Sn/Pb solder for most work; sometimes I use TIX solder sith a tip just for it.

[tenacioustanaka]

One word for brass to brass structural joints: Solder!

Ron is spot on here. For brass replacement masts there just is NO substitution for soldering... EVEN in 1/700 scale. Yes it can be tedious but the key to it all is that jig Ron mentioned. You can replicate even complex masts with multiple soldier points. Just remember to use a small clip or heat sink in the eventuality you have to solder another point to a previously constructed joint or else you risk de-soldering the whole mess.

[Charlestonguy]

I sometimes used a Hot devil for some of my projects. The trick is getting the two rods at or close to the same temperature when soldering. I find the flame works best for this, unless working on 1/700 scale. For anything small a standard soldering iron works just fine.
I scratch built the CSS David (1/120 scale) smoke stack and torpedo mast using the Hot Devil tool.

http://www.hotdevil.com.au/products.htm

[bocME262]

Okay, give up the secrets to soldering brass rod. I have tried and tried without any luck. Then again way back when we were suppose to make a wireless radio in shop my soldering skills were far from even close.

Karsten

Um, sure.......clean metal of joint, jig in place on non-melting/burning surface, flux joint with liquid rosin flux, clean iron tip, tin the tip, wipe it on a damp sponge, apply tip to joint, apply solder to other side,remove solder when it flows into joint, remove iron, tin iron tip, place in holder, clean flux from joint with acetone. Take longer to type than do. I use an adjustable iron and 63/37 Sn/Pb solder for most work; sometimes I use TIX solder sith a tip just for it.

I follow just about everything here that Ron talks about (having soldered copper water lines in my home) except "tin iron tip". Not sure what tin means. Anyone know?

[Charlestonguy]

Tin the tip means you put a small amount of solder on the hot iron. I will apply solder to the tip then wipe away the excess leaving only a light coating.

try this site
http://www.whimsie.com/solderingcraftinformation.html

[Richard Durham]

Here is my method. I use superglue for all joints and have never had a failure.

-For small diameter masts, I use either bronze rod or stainless steel tubing. I really like the bronze rod (stiffer than brass, but bendable) and it is available online from Walthers. The stainless steel tubing is available on line from Small Parts (huge variety) or from Great Models.

-Cut the pieces of mast to the correct lenths and file the ends.

-Measure the cross member to find the center, and then mark the center with a fine Sharpie. Now sand that area and remark the center with the Sharpie. The sanding will ensure a better connection with the vertical section (this is really the secret to success).

-Draw a cross on a flat surface with a fine tip Sharpie; I use a flat piece of tempered glass. Put a strip of removable double sided tape over the cross. Put the cross member piece of the mast, aligned to one of the lines that make up the cross and centered on the other line, on the strip of double sided tape.

Take the vertical section of the mast and lay it over the cross member, perpendicular to it and on center. Make sure that you sand the vertical section in the area where the cross member will attach. Hold it in place with a strip of removable tape.

Once both pieces are aligned and held in place by tape, apply a small drop of medium viscosity superglue to the joint. Let it dry for an hour or so. Carefully remove the mast from the double sided tape and apply small drops of superglue to the other two sides of the joint that previously faced down. Let dry and you have a simple, but strong mast. You can use this variation on this method for other types of masts.

All the best, Rich

[bocME262]

One thing that concerns me is that when you attach a cross member to a mast, the cross member, whether square or round, sits directly on the mast like so:

image1.JPG (4.41 KiB) Viewed 2770 times

But my inclination is that is should be like this:

image2.JPG (4.15 KiB) Viewed 2769 times

If this is the case then a knotch would need to be made on one of the pieces. Am I right or wrong here?

[ingura]

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[bocME262]

Ah, yes. I keep forgetting about real life. I need to quit thinking of how I'd do it and how it was actually done and then replicate. I'm still learning, in my forties but still learning. Thanks Peter.

Edit: What about 1/350? Could the same technique apply?

[ingura]

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