ASFC wrote: Why? As soon as Japan builds any Fixed wing Carrier, the Chinese will start a Carrier Arms race, so if Japan was going to start this arms race, it will build a proper Carrier (the JMSDF and Japans shipyards are well known for building quality ships to do the tasks they are given), not try and squeeze half a squadron of F-35 on to these Helicopter Carriers.
If the Japanese build a fixed wing carrier first, then it would be the Japanese who starts a carrier race. No?
But Janes reports the Chinese appear to have decided to make the ex-Russian Varyag an operational warship. The evidence was Varyag has received a PLAN pennant number, and may be nearing sea trial. If that is the case, then the Chinese would have been the ones to start the carrier race. The Chinese also built an aircraft carrier shaped runway at a certain naval base complete with arresting wires and areas marked out for elevators, and made deck handling equipment purchases from Russia suitable for outfitting 2 fairly large (40K tons +) fixed wing carriers plus spares or training sets. So one might suspect there will be perhaps 2 fairly large Chinese fixed winged carriers plus the Varyag in Chinese service which would trouble Japanese sleep in the not too distant future. Maybe the Chinese will change their minds, or maybe they have not set their hearts on actually building the ships, but instead are stockpiling resources and expertise so as to be able to do so should certain international conditions arise, such as an American withdraw from the middle east. But whether they have or have not decided to do so, it appears now much more likely that they will do so.
Last edited by chuck on Fri Sep 26, 2008 11:19 am, edited 1 time in total.
Assessing the impact of new area rug under modeling table.
Jack Ray wrote:At the very least this ship could operate a half-dozen VSTOL jets--be they F-35Bs, or new build Harriers. This would put the ships squarely in the category of the Invincibles, Principe de Asturias and other Italian and Thai vessels.
Jack
One might question why relatively insignificant and unthreatened Thailand can possess a carrier without disapprobation, while Japan with the world's 2nd largest economy, vulnerable sea approaches and no nearby power with similar geopolitical interest as Italy and Spain has, can not.
Assessing the impact of new area rug under modeling table.
I cannot say whether the Japanese are actually forbidden from having carriers. Their armed forces are all some form of Self Defense Force, but I do not know how the laws, or treaties are actually written. Perhaps "Gone Asiatic", who seems to be in the USN stationed in Yokosuka, may have some insight.
One thing is certain, Thailand does not have a history of once trying to conquer a third of the planet with their carriers.
My opinion is that Japan should participate in Allied coalition operations and be well equipped for it.
Correct-they are not allowed 'offensive weapons' i.e Cruise missiles strategic bombers, Attack Carriers etc so on so forth.
There is nothing wrong with having these ASW 'Carriers' (or Destroyers..whatever).
Frankly I think Japan is better off developing her Air Force and ASW/ASuW capabilities and make the Seas around Japan too 'hot' for any invading Battlegroup, and let the USN with its far superior Carrier Capabilities 'play' (sic) Carriers with the Chinese.
O fcourse Japan will eventually need Carriers, but it should be developed properly, rather than trying to stick Aircraft on to every ship available that has a through deck.
chuck wrote:If the Japanese build a fixed wing carrier first, then it would be the Japanese who starts a carrier race. No?
ooops.........
Ships on the Slipway
HMS Victorious R38
USS Pinckney DDG-91
SAS Drakensberg A-301 On the drawing board
HMS Dumbarton Castle P265
HMS Albion L14
VT Sergey Osipov
ASFC wrote:Frankly I think Japan is better off developing her Air Force and ASW/ASuW capabilities and make the Seas around Japan too 'hot' for any invading Battlegroup, and let the USN with its far superior Carrier Capabilities 'play' (sic) Carriers with the Chinese.
ASFC,
JASDF is one of the most capable air forces in the world and JMSDF has more than 50 ships that can be used for AAW/ASW and ASuW. In fact in case of war with China the JMSDF ships will probably supplement USN surface ships in carrier strike groups.
The JMSDF trains very frequently with USN CSGs and ESGs and once every year they have an annual exercise (ANNUALEX). Usually in these exercise one of the four JMSDF Escort Flotillas trains with the forward deployed Yokosuka based CSG.
On the workbench:
Various 1/700 aircraft.
Juan Carlos I LHD 1/700.
HMAS Canbera LHD 1/700.
FGS Type 122 class FFG 1/700.
LSD-41 class LPD 1/700.
I know . Nothing wrong with making them larger though!
Anyway, i'm sure Article 9 will need to be repeled before they build anything aproaching a CVF.
Ships on the Slipway
HMS Victorious R38
USS Pinckney DDG-91
SAS Drakensberg A-301 On the drawing board
HMS Dumbarton Castle P265
HMS Albion L14
VT Sergey Osipov
What a lovely looking ship, ski jump why ? vertical take off jets, harrier, raptor, jet helicopter, what a shame the U.K can't poduce ships like this, we still have the old tin cans from the 60's and while on the subject, has anyone seen the USS Freedom ? Now that's a next gen ship.
Hello Jack, I am still having problems finding my way about this web-site, so if you're not Jack (sorry). You can't call that ship or any other simular looking ship a destroyer unless you use it in the term it can destroy things, with vast ships like Enterprise and the Big E a prime super large target, the ship in question is clearly a down size scale of an attack craft capable of carrying an aray of winged craft. And I love it, it simply takes us into the 21st centery (spelt that wrong), this is why I also believe the U.S took on the USS Freedom.
. Nothing wrong with making them larger though!
