Calling all USS Lexington CV-2 fans

[Tracy White]

To go a little off-topic a bit, I've been researching paint and camouflage at the national archives for more than a couple of years now, and have posted most of the documents I've found here. The actual initial formula the paints were based off of can be found on this document. Pretty much all of the (non-green) paints used up to 1945 were based on this white base + tinting paste formula with different ratios of the tinting paste mixed in. So even though it was titled "Ocean Gray," It had a definite amount of blue, as stated above. You can see that in the formula listed here at the bottom of the first page.

[lvsquarerigger]

Sorry to hear that you never knew your dad... you might be able to find out more by getting his service records at the National Archives
http://www.archives.gov/veterans/

In regards to the paints... yes, those are the Navy paint designations. Many people are familiar with the FS (Federal Standard) system but FS is a post-war system and there is no exact corresponding value, so we use the names and numbers to keep it straight. Elvis, for example, said "light gray" and then used the designation 5-O... well, there was a light gray, designated 5-L, so when he used the term he could have sown some confusion into the mix.

Depending on how much you want to get into it you might check out the ShipCamouflage.Com site; there are Navy topics at http://www.shipcamouflage.com/warship_camouflage.htm and a full listing of Navy paint colors in the paint chips section.

You can mix paints based off of those paint chip sets, find an equivilent that looks close to you, or buy paint already formulated to match, which is my preference. The easiest to get is White Ensign Colourcoats, which ShipCamouflage.Com carries. Testors had a Model Master's marine colors line, since discontinued, that had most of the colors in acrylic paints. You may still find them here and there.

Square - Just to add a bit to Tracy's comments:
When I first started to build the Tamiya MISSOURI, I chose the dazzle scheme 33-22D the ship wore for a short period during and after commissioning. I used the Tamiya paint recommendations (which employed Tamiya paint, natch.) and painted the hull. Somewhere soon after I suspended the project while I moved. I became aware of premixed colors for the USN WW II colors and bought some from Floquil (OOP now). Because the Floquil paints were matched to USN specs and not customer mixed from available paints, the colors were definitely VERY different. The key to the difference is that the colors I needed from early in the war to mid-war were compounded by the USN originally from a tinting base that was a so-called Purple Blue tinting base mixed in certain proportions with White to get the final color. So these model colors, now made by several manufacturers, including White Ensign, will have a distinct Purplish Bluish cast to them which is unmistakable. Even the so-called Grays such as 5-O, Ocean Gray, used the PB tinting base and have the distinctive PB cast to the Gray. When I look at the Tamiya MISSOURI hull with the Tamiya paint applied, the colors are all Grayish - not a hint of Purple Blue - because the Tamiya paint was formulated for other uses such as armor models.
Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but in my view the correct Purple Blue based colors are the only ones I'll use. To me, the difference is very noticeable, even if you are simulating faded paint. Fortunately, with several manufacturers producing the paints in several types (lacquer, enamel, acrylic) you have many choices. I won't debate which is 'better' since I'm not a paint expert. I have a similar opinion about the premixed colors for aircraft as well - you can definitely see the Bluish cast in the USN early War light Blue Gray used on aircraft as well. I think getting the colors right makes a big difference in the final model.

I agree. I noticed a big variation in the different builds by different modelers. i saw Floquil mentioned on some others and they are available here locally.

Funny you mention the Big Mo. My stepdad was stationed on her in the late forties and I got to roam on family days. Even got to sit astride the big 16 inchers, quite q stretch for a 6 year old.

Jim

[John W.]

Square Jim -
If you can find Floquil Marine colors available locally in the colors you need, you might consider grabbing them if you prefer lacquers. Floquil Marine colors have been OOP for many years, though other Floquil products are still available (i.e. railroad colors).

[lvsquarerigger]

Square Jim -
If you can find Floquil Marine colors available locally in the colors you need, you might consider grabbing them if you prefer lacquers. Floquil Marine colors have been OOP for many years, though other Floquil products are still available (i.e. railroad colors).

That might be what they are cause they have a lot of train stuff in that shop. WIll have to investigate.

Jim

[lvsquarerigger]

As I get more info I think I would like to use W E M paints. When I look at their list of suppliers none in the U S come up. Does anyone know a supplier in the U S or do I have to go direct to them?

[Tracy White]

Try http://www.shipcamouflage.com/ Randy's good people.

[Gilbert]

As I get more info I think I would like to use W E M paints. When I look at their list of suppliers none in the U S come up. Does anyone know a supplier in the U S or do I have to go direct to them?

In the US you can get them here : http://www.shipcamouflage.com/

cheers

Gilbert

[lvsquarerigger]

Thanks guys,

Jim

[lvsquarerigger]

I took some time to explore Camoflage. Wow! What a great resource! Again thanks so much.

Just to be a little lazy and not go back through all the previous posts, I know it came up several times, was Lex in MS 11 or 12 at the time of her sinking?

[Dick J]

Lex was in MS-11 (sub 5-N for 5-S). Overall Navy blue on the vertical surfaces.

[lvsquarerigger]

Thanks Dick

[smithec]

What people have mininterpreted as stripes, tracks or slots are actually drains. Water run-off drains or collecting slots. Quite narrow, three of them, one runs around the forward elevator. They stop short of the aft elevator.

i am trying to built a dio with lex as on fire or just before that with crew abandoning etc and i want to know the flight deck markings.I mean according with the foto in the link below from what i can make out appears as if she had the classic yellow? or black lines runnin along the lenght of the deck
Having said that am not sure the colour or their size/shape at all so any help would be welcomed.

http://www.navsource.org/archives/02/020236.jpg

You have to be careful in interpreting the stripes from these photos. What you are looking at in the photo listed above are not painted stripes. Lex and Sara had slots or tracks in their decks (the purpose of which is not covered by any of the various books on the ships), and that is what is visible here. If you have both the Lex and Sara kits, the tracks are depicted on the Sara deck but not on the Lex (at least, they are that way on the 1/700 kits). The tracks should be on both.

[smithec]

I can confirm that these longitudinal 'strips' were actually surface water drains. These are marked up as such on the builders' flight deck plan I got from Floating Drydock before starting my build. I've published a step-by-step build guide at: http://www.modelshipwrights.com/modules ... artid=2191

Anyone wishing to build this ship should seriously consider buying these plans. There are variations from photos, but, hey, working that all out is all part of the fun!

Also I'm posting a couple of photos of my build showing the flight deck drains. I drew these on with a pencil. With hindsight I might have used copper strip. Even the thinnest poly strip is too thick. Paper would just curl sideways after being sliced into a strip. Tape would stretch/contract. Still don't know best answer to this without grooving out the deck.

Another repost from the same thread.

longitudinal (?) expansion joints are often mistaken for deck markings.

Hi Jerry,

I am not sure I would characterize the tracks as "expansion joints" for several reasons.

First, any hull girder acts somewhat like an "I" beam. The top flange and bottom flange provide both longitudinal strength and resist twisting and torque. The strength deck and keel perform much the same function on a ship. Nothing outside the girder is strong enough to resist the stress. (If it was strong enough, it would act as a strength deck and throw all the hull girder calcualtions out the window.) Decks above the strength deck would either "wrinkle" (compression) or crack (tension) without expansion joints, as the hull flexed. On the Lexington's, the flightdeck was the strength deck, therefore no need for expansion joints. From Ranger through the Midway's, the hanger deck was the strength deck, so the flightdeck needed the joints. Also, expansion joints would weaken the strength deck, and would therefore be dangerous.

Second, the major stresses on a non-strength deck would be longitudinal, so the expansion joints would be transverse to allow longitudinal compression and tension without damage.

Third, these tracks continue across the elevators, in some locations. The elevators, being separate from the hull and deck proper, would not need expansion joints.

My theory is that they were intended to move seaplanes around the deck, but were hardly used, if ever. One problem with this idea is that, while the tracks cross the elevators, they are not continuous through the metal edges of the elevators, and elevator wells. Aside from that possibility, I can't explain them.

[smithec]

Hey guys

My build of the USS Lexington http://www.modelshipgallery.com/gallery ... index.html won GOLD in its category at the UK national model championships in November 2008. Also got a trophy for 'most detailed model ship' . Maybe Jim Baumann should have collected the latter for his Roma.

I've just spent the afternoon going through this CV-2 forum from page 1-20. When I was building my model I didn't know this forum existed. It has been fascinating reading all the questions that have arisen, and reading the answering suggestions. And also fascinating to see the questions people have pondered on and which I, in my isolation, also pondered on. But I'm pleased to say it seems we've all just about come to the same conclusions regarding flag bridge, AA disposition and disposition, colours, etc etc. Reassuring that I don't seem to have done anything wildly off pist.

Full build article at: http://www.modelshipwrights.com/modules ... artid=2191

Good luck everyone! I won't be building another Lexi. Or another plastic kit after this for a long time. Scratchbuilding is easier and quicker !

Hope I can help anyone with any queries not covered elsewhere in this forum.

Best egards, Chris

[lvsquarerigger]

Hi Chris,

I saw your build when you posted it and was impressed. I also used your sources to see what I will need to proceed. Plans from floating drydock first.Could you mention which set you purchased? Then Stern's book, pricey where available but probably necessary. Then the PE sets and other guns from L'arsenal. How did you come up with the degauseing cables? I don't see them really emphasized in the other builds.

Jim

[smithec]

� Fitted degaussing cables port and starboard from 0.5mm styrene rod.

� Fitted degaussing cable guards below boat pockets using 0.25 x 0.75mm styrene strip.

[smithec]

Bought the complete set from Floating Drydock Company. About 4 sheets: outside profile, inboard profile (optional), flight deck, superstructure profile and plans. Total US$40. They are huge - 1/16th inch:1 foot. But you can roll yourself up in them and have a warm night sleeping on the streets if you want.

[smithec]

Guys

Please excuse all the posts I have made today. Just had a spare afternoon and catching up on this stuff which I meant to do for a long time.

When I took my Lexi to the UK National Championships it was the first time I'd ever been there or entered the contest. I knew it was a good model, and I was hoping for a gold. But when I got there and saw the level of the standard I was up against I was absolutely gob smacked. So when our club chairman who was a judge there for 1:48 aircraft told me I'd won a gold I politely informed him he must be pulling my pecker. And if he was telling the truth I'd buy him a pint (of beer) in the hotel bar that evening. Ended up buying a round for the whole blimming club!!!

Excuse my immodesty pld ase.

[Cadman]

Congrats, looks like you earned it.

When can I get my beer!

[lvsquarerigger]

If nothing else you deserve a medal for hanging in there for two years. I'll take that beer now thanks.

Jim