What-If Montana-class BB-67

[Sauragnmon]

The trick of it is, Nikos, the Bofors were completely replaced by the 3" twin mounts. They didn't double up the service, they just used the 3" instead of the Bofors.

As to the positions on the broadside, keep two 3" sets but double it up, so they straddle the elevated 5" turret.

What I meant regarding the elevated positions was that any of the mounts more solidly placed (as in with structure solidly under them) would also be suitable mounting positions for the 3" mounting.

It should certainly look different, that's for sure. Makes me want to do a similar thought, though I would think having a slightly heavier layer of AA protection to benefit the fact that the Montana would, unlike most, have been built ground up to accommodate the 3" guns, would have meant it would have better magazine storage for additional rounds, and could have sustained quite a sizable battery of the guns. I'd hate to be the MiG pilot attacking one of those off the coast of Korea...

Of course it leads to the thought of doing a second Montana, as if modernized in the 80's. Considering the performance of a Montana vs an Iowa as a citadel of defense in a fleet, as well as offense, one might think it would have been upgraded and modernized for operational support, potentially with VLS mountings in place of the boat deck as well, in a fully ground-up built installation for supporting them.

But them I'm just rambling.

[GTDEATH13]

Well, the purpose of not replacing all the 40mm bofors with 3" guns is that I wanted to have many a gun for close encounters heavier than the 20mm oerlikon.
It would be very interestng to compare the minimum range of a 3" and a 40mm mount... That is why I added 40mm guns, to act as a ciws system...

[EJM]

To GTDEATH13:

If you need a bit of help, here's some pics of the Montana I built for my best friend. Perhaps looking at my various gun arrangements might offer you some insight as to where you might want to place yours?

TOP VIEWS






SIDE VIEWS

[GTDEATH13]

Thanks EJM... really inspiring work...

My mind is made up and I will follow the plan I posted earlier... But your midship section is really great help...

[EJM]

Hello, everyone. Long time, no see. Pardon me for raising this thread, but I have a few updates.

1. For several weeks and months in the past, several of my posts have had dead links to websites and pictures. I wish to sincerely apologise for this. I've had to completely re-organise my photo image account and add/remove pics. I have also had to remove links to dead websites and/or find new links to information that got moved to a new site on the Net. I have gone through all my posts in this thread and corrected to the best of my ability all my posts. If there are links that are missing, then I am sorry.

2. I just recently in early May took my USS Montana model to a contest at the Zablocki VA Medical Center in Milwaukee, WI on May 9th and I won the following:
a) Third Place (Bronze) certificate in the Nautical section for the Intermediate Build Catagory.
b) Veteran's Best of Show award.



3. I'm currently in the process of adding more rigging and detailing for a future November contest in Chicago - the IPMS Butch O' Hare contest.


4. It's sad to see that a member by the name of Randy has all his pics of his Montana build removed from his posts in this thread. I was really looking forward to seeing more progress of his build. Luckily, I seem to have found the following:
http://buildingmontana.blogspot.com/
I hope the people that are building/posting to that blog will come back to here and share their pics and construction stories. I miss hearing what anyone else is doing with their Montana kits/projects.

Where is everyone?

[EJM]

Short question if anyone can help:

Even though the MONTANA Class of battleships was never built, I wonder if there ever was a preliminary ship emblem or seal for the class? I've searched around the Net, but can't find anything?

[EJM]

The rigging for my Montana is almost done. Tell me what you think. This is my first time doing rigging for a model in my life.
I've been using .010 dia. fishing line.

[Anonymous]

Because a rolling stone gothers no moss... I have not even started building the :Mad_5: thing and already thinking what to do next,I am looking for plans for this class as well as the Iowa class.

Does anyone know were I can order some from??? Regardless the scale, something bigger than 1/350 would be fine.


I would also appreciate your suggestions. Scratcbuilding a Montana in what scale? 1/96 1/100 1/144 or 1/200.. For what scale do you think I will find aftermarket parts that can save me the trouble of scratcbuilding everything?? Take also into consideration that i will propably build two ships. A WW2 version and a modernised one.

http://www.floatingdrydock.com/G.htm

[Anonymous]

Eric,

Here ya go. Missouri Booklet of General Plans.

http://cache.ussmissouri.org/missouri.pdf

hey, the link doesn't work!

[Sauragnmon]

That rigging is nuts, EJM, well done.

[Timmy C]

Eric,

Here ya go. Missouri Booklet of General Plans.

http://cache.ussmissouri.org/missouri.pdf

hey, the link doesn't work!

It moved: http://www.ussmissouri.org/documents/blueprints.pdf

[EJM]

That rigging is nuts, EJM, well done.

Thanks for the compliment, Sauragnmon. I've been taking a break the last few days, but still have at least 6 more lines to add which I'll be doing probably this weekend. It's been a real slow process adding them on. I'm trying to be as careful as I can. Thankfully, those "helping hands" with the alligator clips and small magnifying glass really comes in handy! I still have to add some more photoetch and also some paravanes near the bow.

And hopefully soon, I'll be buying an extra North Carolina kit (To rob some parts from) from another modeler and starting another Montana in the future. Only this time, it'll be as the Montana was originally designed with the boat cranes, boats, etc., etc.

[Sauragnmon]

Nice, I'd like to do a Montana eventually, but I'm also looking into a North Carolina with a nice deal, I wanna do her on a whole stem of if she'd been built As Planned, with the 14/50 quad turrets, but still WW2 expanded fitting and stuff, and an Iowa scheduled for some Very big changes.

[EJM]

Montana 2.0

After I finish my Project Habbakuk model this summer, I think I'm going to start on a second Montana this Fall, only it'll be as it was originally designed with the boat cranes, boats, etc. amidships in 1943.
I have an extra 1/350 Missouri hull to use and will be making that longer and hopefully wider to be truer to the Montana's dimensions. I also just bought from a modeling friend today a 1/350 North Carolina to rob extra parts from as some of the parts in that kit look better for a Montana. Making the Missouri hull longer is easy. But widening it is what I'm not sure about and do not know how to do? Using instructions that a friend gave me long ago which are found in one of my posts on Page 1 of this thread:

"To confirm, the Montana is 921' long and 121' wide, thus at 1/350 scale it will be 31.577" long and 4.149" wide. The Iowa is 887' long and 108' wide, thus at 1/350 scale it will be 30.411" long and 3.703" wide. The difference is 1.166" in length and 0.446" in width. To simplify, 1.125 is exactly 1 1/8", thus 1.166 is close enough to use 1 1/8. 0.500 is exactly 1/2", so 0.446 is close enough. Simply lengthen the TAMIYA hull by 1 1/8" and widen the hull by 1/2" (1/4" on each side.)

.........and also using instructions/references from a May 1992 FSM article:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v216/ ... mmont2.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v216/ ... mmont1.jpg

.........I'll be making a lateral cut across the Missouri hull about 21" back from the bow as shown by the red line in this pic:



.........which after careful consideration seems to be the best spot/choice for making a cut to lengthen the hull.

Widening the Missouri hull is what I don't know how to do. In the FSM article, Phil Raver says that after he made the lateral cut, he then cut the two hull sections down the center line as shown in this example pic:


.........and then spread the four pieces to fit the dimensions of the Montana.
After very carefully looking at the FSM article and the aft sections of the Iowa and Montana side by side, the space/distance between the 40mm tubs at the aft end by the aircraft crane on both ships appears to be the same. If Phil Raver had completely cut the hull sections down the center line like he said he did and spread the pieces to fit Montana dimensions, then wouldn't the space between the 40mm tubs on the Montana be slightly wider than that on the Iowa? Somehow, I don't think Phil cut all the way from bow to stern.
Anybody got any better/new ideas how I can widen a Missouri hull to fit the dimensions of the Montana?

[Timmy C]

Possibly you can just make a cut in the middle of the hull, and push that out a little and add a stiffener to keep the hull spread out wide.

I've attached a photo of what I'm thinking:

Basically, instead of cutting all the way through from stem to stern, start somewhere behind the stem and end somewhere before the stern, so that you can widen the hull at whichever point most accurately portray's Montana's girth.

[EJM]

Wow. Thanks for the fast reply, Timmy. The pic you showed is what I strongly suspect Phil Raver must have done in order to widen a Missouri hull. I suspected it for a long, long time, but was never really sure. Now the only trick left is to plan and figure where exactly to cut. How far back from the bow, and how far forward from the stern. Hmmmm. *lost in thought*
So like, what would be good? Dremel with cutting disc, perhaps?

[Sauragnmon]

Looking forward to seeing Montana 2.0, EJM. When I do the Rhode Island she'll be taller, but not wider, as she's planned to be Panamax - and let's face it, the Iowas were a tight fit through Panama to begin with. But first, I have some builds to finish up, and some heresy to commit.

[caramonraistlin]

EJM:

I followed that same article several years ago to build my Montana. What I did was 1st cut the hull entirely in half using a fine razor saw from stem to stern. Then I took a piece of balsa sheet stock 4" tall and super glued the two hull halves to it (I remember I had to slighty reduce the thickness of it towards the bow to get them to join correctly. Any stock sticking up above the hull I cut off. Next I cut the hull in half at the location cited in the article so that I only had two pieces to work with. I then added a section of built up balsa stock to make the addtional length and glued the two halves to it. I then sanded all of this to shape and covered the exposed balsa with Squadron putty. Then it was sand, putty, sand, putty and sand some more. Finally I primed the whole hull and applied the final color. It turned out fine. I too couldn't figure out the article and knew there was no way I could cut the hull into four pieces, add length or width to each section and then get everything to align right. My way I only had to align the hull when I lengthened it. I hope this helps. I later bought the Toms resin Montana which is an as built configuration but have never tackled it yet.

Michael Lacey

[EJM]

Interesting technique you have there. Did you have any pics of the construction process that you did? If so, I'd love to see them.

[Sauragnmon]

Well, one would surmise the use of balsa would be helpful with regards to adding strength to the hull - if you use a modest width of stock, you can use it to hold the spaced pieces apart. Leaving part of the bow and stern intact would let you wedge it. If you go ahead with the widening pieces first, you could put the strengthening slats in first on the vertical, which you could use from that part, to cut a single piece balsa bottom plate which could cover not only the extended length, but the adjusted width. From there, you can build the vertical slats in place to accommodate and support the hull sides when you install those next. Sand, putty, paint, she's all gravy.

Just my thoughts.