Calling all Scharnhorst and Gneisenau fans!

[Felix C]

What time frame is the Heller Gneisenau and Scharnhorst?

I have read here and elsewhere that the kits are bit of both. Sch = Gne + Sch and Gne = Sch + Gne

What fixes need to be made to create a reasonable Scharnhorst?

What fixes need to be made to create a resonalbe Gneisenau?

Thanks

[Olaf Held]

If I'm not mistaken, both models have the GU bow and f'c'sle, very easy to see besides the fwd main turrets with the typical hatches/skylights that only GU had. Apart from this BOTH kits are not only a mish-mash of two ships but also of different time frames.

If you want to build one or the other, we need to know in which year you want to represent it.

And then, the most blatant error: There is a noticable gap between the after superstructure and the aft main turret. The overall proportion of the models is quite good but this gap spoils everything! It wasn't simply there on the actual ships.

Dragon's announcement of a 1/350 SH was the reason why I sold my 1/400 Airfix SH/GU semi kit (which comes from the Heller moulds).

Happy modelling ~ Olaf!

[Felix C]

Hello Olaf,

Thank you for replying. I was aware of the aft turret gap but not the other items. Was discussed somewhere on a forum?

If one wished to do a Channel Dash Feb 1942. What changes?

I do not wish to put you out. What are the best sources to identify the differences?

Thanks

[rtwpsom2]

Your best bet is going to be to wait a couple months until the new Dragon Scharny comes out and backdate it. The amount of work it would take to try and fix the Airfix kit is huge, while Dragon's new kit would only take some minor adjustments and is overall a better quality kit.

[Felix C]

I prefer 1/400 and so the question stands.

What is huge work?

Why do people always do this? If I wanted 1/350 I would not be asking about the Heller 1/400.

[MartinJQuinn]

I think Rob was only trying to be helpful.

There's an interesting article on building the Heller Gneisenau here

[nimitz4145]

Hello boys!

Preparing a battle profile of the Scharnhorst during the battle of North Cape, i'd like to have your advice about this preview (shadowing is to come and Fumo has to be turned):



I hope i'll surch a file :

[MartinJQuinn]

That is pretty cool.

[nimitz4145]

Hello guys!!
Could someone help me by correcting my mistakes?
I'm quite sure my back radar is wrong



Thx to all!!

[Olaf Held]

I can't say much about the aft rangefinder/radar but there are two things you might want to change: 1st, the ship's name at the stern wasn't there anymore. 2nd, the 5 or 6 skylights/hatches on either side of the two forward main turrets were only present on GU, not on SH.

If you want to have the ship without any camouflage (which wouldn't match the time frame of your illustration), then ypu should have the superstructure in a lighter grey than the hull (the latter of which was a mdeium grey with a slight hint of blue in it, a very subtle hint).

The paint job of the Arado needs to be less intense (at least the green).

Happy drawing ~ Olaf!

[nimitz4145]

1st, the ship's name at the stern wasn't there anymore.

Easy to remove

2nd, the 5 or 6 skylights/hatches on either side of the two forward main turrets were only present on GU, not on SH.

I didn't knew it so i'll remove it

If you want to have the ship without any camouflage (which wouldn't match the time frame of your illustration), then ypu should have the superstructure in a lighter grey than the hull (the latter of which was a mdeium grey with a slight hint of blue in it, a very subtle hint).

The camo wille be one of the last part of my work but it will be the last one of the ship, during the battle of North Cape

The paint job of the Arado needs to be less intense (at least the green).

I'll correct it too

Happy drawing ~ Olaf!

Thanks for help.

[Russ2146]

Steve Larson previously posted some of these shots but the entire series of shots can be found at:
http://www.history.navy.mil/photos/numeric/nu-h102.htm

Look for photo numbers NH 102525 through NH 102548 in the right hand column.

The photo data also indicates that the photos were copied from a German publication dated circa 1940.

[nimitz4145]

Hello guys!!

Before adding the shadowing, i share the finished Scharnhorst.
Enjoy!


N.B. : Each remark welcomed

At sea it appears like this :

[Mike W]

I have some questions about the Gniesnau that relate to my build of the Tamiya 1/700 kit. Before that I have figured out the kit, if you build it oob, represents the ship in late 1939 following the fitting of the 'Atlantic bow' and new funnel cap. I want to represent the ship in either 1940 or 1941 and i'm trying to work out what is required to do this. Luckily I have built both Gniesnau and Scharnhorst before so have many parts cannibalised from previous builds. The questions should help me decide what to do.

1) When was the enclosed Admiral's bridge fitted?
2) When was the hangar shortened?
3) When was the catapult removed from C turret?
4) When was the flakvierling mount fitted inbetween the funnel and hangar?
5) When was the taller rangefinder fitted on the top of the turnmast?
6) Was the above mentioned rangefinder the same as the one Scharnhorst was fitted with in the same place? Or was it more like the aft rangefinder on Scharnhorst? (I have both these rangefinders off an old Scharnhorst kit).


thanks
Mike

[rtwpsom2]

A. Bonomi put together a pretty detailed list of mods and their timeline here: http://www.kbismarck.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=450. It should help you quite a bit.

[Olaf Held]

5) When was the taller rangefinder fitted on the top of the turnmast?
6) Was the above mentioned rangefinder the same as the one Scharnhorst was fitted with in the same place? Or was it more like the aft rangefinder on Scharnhorst? (I have both these rangefinders off an old Scharnhorst kit).

Both ships had the same rangefinder in the foretop plus the same FuMO 22, the latter of which was added in November 1939. The "radar housing" for this was located on top of the rangefinder housing. Both of them were round. Then, on top of this, both ships received the open battle observer's post, the one on Scharnhorst was square, the one on Gneisenau round in shape (I'm not sure if this difference is valid for the 1940/41 time window).

The after rangefinder received a FuMo 27 after Op. Berlin during their stay in Brest. The rangefinder itself should be the same as the one in the foretop.

Happy modelling ~ Olaf!

[rtwpsom2]

I recently obtained a copy of a Nazi propaganda fill entitled "Schlachtshiff in Farht" or "Ride in a Battleship" from user Yevgeniy. I am sorry I do not know his last name, but I thank him for the movie. It concerns life aboard a Kriegsmarine battleship and was filmed entirely on board the Scharnhorst and Gneisenau. I had to break it into three parts to upload it to youtube but the results are below. Thanks again, Yevgeniy! This is an awesome movie.





You can download it from Yegeniy's source as long as he leaves it up:
http://rapidshare.com/files/392277055/L ... e.avi.html

[Mike W]

Thanks guys - I've decided to model Gniesnau during Op Berlin. The only thing I'm not sure on now is the ship's 20mm fit. Looking at other people's models and various pics, I have worked out so far she had her original 8 single 20mm guns plus a vierling on a platform inbetween the funnal and catapult, 2 extra singles on the funnel platform, an extra single 20mm on top of A turret (strange but I have a pic to prove it) and a single on the small platform near the base of the turnmast (used to have a small rangefinder there). So I count a total of 16 20 mm AA.
Can anyone else advise anything further? Any extra mounts and locations?

thanks
Mike

[bill tarn]

can you help please
i have been asked to build a model of the Scharnhorst as she appeared in early 41 from the old Heller kit, a couple of questions.
1) I take it i need to remove all the raised hatches is that correct
2) what shade of grey is closest i use tamiya paints and what yellow to use on the turret tops

the old gent does not have money to throw away on kits or i would have said to him wait and get the new Dragon Kit.
But i do know where i can get the WEM p/etch cheap to add much needed detail


Thank you

Bill

[Olaf Held]

1) I take it i need to remove all the raised hatches is that correct

If you're talking about the ones either side of the two fwd main turrets, then... yup, only Gneisenau had them.

2) what shade of grey is closest i use tamiya paints and what yellow to use on the turret tops

I'm not familiar with the Tamiya grey paints. For the superstructure take the lightest grey you find on the shelf. The hull needs to be a bit darker with a VERY subtle hint of blue in it. The dark grey steel decks are dark grey. This is the same hue that was used for the boot topping (which should be about 6 mm in width on a 1/400 model, many modellers just paint it too narrow, on the actual ship it was 2 to 2.50 m in width...). The yellow on the turret tops should be quite a "dark" yellow. Not lemon yellow. Maybe more towards ocre, but still yellow. Difficult to explain. Are you familiar with Humbrol paints? Their #154, Insignia Yellow, would fit nice on a 1/400 model. This was also the colour of the life rafts.

the old gent does not have money to throw away on kits or i would have said to him wait and get the new Dragon Kit.
But i do know where i can get the WEM p/etch cheap to add much needed detail

Then go for them.

Happy painting ~ Olaf!