Calling all Yamato (大和) and Musashi (武蔵) fans

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navydavesof
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Re: Calling all IJN Yamato & Musashi fans

Post by navydavesof »

Cliffy B wrote:
It'd be interesting to know how well their 18" and our own 18" fared during the testing phase. Anyone know?
I do! Our 18" guns were successfully tested and were 47calibers in length. They could have been fielded in the Iowa-class by modifying the 16" three-gun turret into a two-gun turret to maintain weight equivalency. However, there would have been lots of trade-offs that would have likely not been a good idea. It is stated that the teak would have to be removed, because it would not survive the overpressure at the muzzles if the barrels were firing over the deck. The 20psi the 16" guns produce near the guns would be almost doubled. The unarmored (non-decapping plated areas) skin of the ship would begin to suffer battering effects, and of course, the ship would still be protected only against 16" fire. The interior of the turrets and projectile flats would have to be removed and rebuilt, and rate of fire would be decreased.

I do not remember seeing it in Friendman's Battleship book, but I read the Montanas were considered to carry 8 such guns. Since it wasn't in Friendman's book (or I did not read it at least) I don't know if it's true, nor if it would be worth it. They did the whole 16"/56 caliber thing, too by lining one of the 18" test guns with a 16" liner, boosting the range of the projectiles. However, beyond 26miles the projectiles begin to deflect (right to left error) to much, and the gun barrel was still heavy as hell! The 18" barrel was not chosen because its weight, slower rate of fire, and a 9 gun salvo by 16" guns was greater than 6 18" and the same with the Montana variant: 12 16" guns versus 8 18".

So, would it be worth it? In 1940s, no. The big idea then was broadsides producing large groupings of shells to increase the chance of hitting another ship, reloading and shooting again. In the 1980s, we got really, really good at firing one round at a time at shore targets and doing on-shot-one kill with ballistic, unguided 16� rounds. If we were to use guided rounds, an 18� round provides a whole, whole lot more payload than a 16� round, and you don�t theoretically need a super high rate of fire. In the 21st century would the 18� gun be worth it? Hmm, maybe new construction, yeah.

So, then the kick @$$ question is: if we built new major caliber systems, do we build new major caliber weaponry as cheaply as possible, which is simply repeat how the Iowas do it or do we try to utilize new technology for either auto loaders with semi-fixed or fixed ammunition?

So, yes, we fully developed an 18�/47caliber naval gun. We just never had anything to put it on, nor was it worth the effort with fewer than 9 guns.
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bucketfoot-al
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FYI - Simplified Address for Yamato Photo Archive

Post by bucketfoot-al »

Just an FYI guys and gals -

I just got a domain name for my Yamato/Musashi Photo Archive that is easier to remember:

http://www.battleshipyamato.com/

The old link is still good and will continue to work.
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sgtryan13
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Color for Yamato???

Post by sgtryan13 »

I am finally diving head-first into my 1/200 Yamato build, but I am looking for suggestions for the main color for the ship. I used the Model Masters Marine Acryl line on my 1/350 build, but these are discontinued. Does anyone have suggestions for a good ACRYLIC paint to use that is still readily available? I really do not like using enamels, and have always preferred Model Master / Polly Scale acrylics.

Thanks, Ryan
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Senkan
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Re: Color for Yamato???

Post by Senkan »

Tamiya puts out a IJN Grey (Kure Arsenal). They also put out a hull red but the dull red looks closer to the actual color. Both of these come in spray paints as well.
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ottoirving
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Re: Color for Yamato???

Post by ottoirving »

dark gray, you can call it the way you want, kure or saebo arsenal, at the end even a german grayworks, if you think to add lighter and darker grays there will be no diference.
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stevegallacci
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Re: Calling all IJN Yamato & Musashi fans

Post by stevegallacci »

Brand new to the site (way cool) and tackling my first ship model in 30+ years.
Doing the Tamiya 1/350 Yamato in it's 1941 configuration and using the AotS book for reference. Anything I need to know regarding more up-to-date data or errors/omissions in the book? And any tips on the build? I've got a lot of experiance in scratch building and am already well into reshaping the basic superstructure.
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bucketfoot-al
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Re: Calling all IJN Yamato & Musashi fans

Post by bucketfoot-al »

stevegallacci wrote:Brand new to the site (way cool) and tackling my first ship model in 30+ years.
Doing the Tamiya 1/350 Yamato in it's 1941 configuration and using the AotS book for reference. Anything I need to know regarding more up-to-date data or errors/omissions in the book? And any tips on the build? I've got a lot of experiance in scratch building and am already well into reshaping the basic superstructure.
Welcome! I went through what you're going through (also building my first ship in 30 years - the Nichimo 1/200 Ten-ichi-go custom Yamato) three years ago.

In doing so I became a Yamato fanatic - even created a website containing over 100 archive photos of Yam & her sister Musashi - but I digress - the link is below my sig if you're interested.

To the point - The Japanese did a thorough research of Yamato's Ten-ichi-go April 1945 configuration and came up with deck AA arrangements a bit different from those taken as gospel before. For example, there were more of them than usually thought, and they weren't in circular tubs on deck but protected by 3/4 octagonal shields bolted directly to the decks. The 2005 film "Yamato" illustrates the new discoveries in detail.

But you're doing her 1941 config with the extra 6" turret side mounts, so .... here is a link to a site that shows you the changing superstructures of Yamato and Musashi through the war - along with overhead full length deck views showing all of the guns.

Anyhow, if you're gonna do it, do it right. I would recommend you start here (you might want to use Google to translate, at least it will remove any confusion about which ship is pictured in which drawing):

http://www.watakan.net/yamato/data/yamato_aa.html
bucketfoot-al
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chuck
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Re: Calling all IJN Yamato & Musashi fans

Post by chuck »

stevegallacci wrote:Brand new to the site (way cool) and tackling my first ship model in 30+ years.
Doing the Tamiya 1/350 Yamato in it's 1941 configuration and using the AotS book for reference. Anything I need to know regarding more up-to-date data or errors/omissions in the book? And any tips on the build? I've got a lot of experiance in scratch building and am already well into reshaping the basic superstructure.
I am doing exactly the same thing you are doing. I compiled quite a list of deviations between ATOS's line drawings and photos printed in the same book, as wells as details shown in the recent 1/10 scale Kure museum and some newer Japanese printed references on the ship. email me for a list.

Image
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cplchanb
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Re: Calling all IJN Yamato & Musashi fans

Post by cplchanb »

NICE..... btw...wat dd you use for to replace the dotted black decals that were once used for the 6in trips?
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chuck
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Re: Calling all IJN Yamato & Musashi fans

Post by chuck »

Those black dashed lines are vent holes for heat protection matal cladding around the turret. I used white ensign photo etched vent holes that came with their Yamato set.
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MRJ
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Re: Calling all IJN Yamato & Musashi fans

Post by MRJ »

Chuck wrote:I am doing exactly the same thing you are doing. I compiled quite a list of deviations between ATOS's line drawings and photos printed in the same book, as wells as details shown in the recent 1/10 scale Kure museum and some newer Japanese printed references on the ship. email me for a list.
I am just beginning my Yamato as well, I sent you a email as I am interested in your list you have compiled. This should be a very interest project.
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Jon C Ryckert
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Re: Calling all IJN Yamato & Musashi fans

Post by Jon C Ryckert »

Hello. I am currently working on the Tamiya 1/350 Yamato in the April '45' timeframe. One question I have is if the linoleum strips on the aircraft deck extend into the wood deck? I have seen seen pics (bucketfoot's webpage) of the time at Leyte that apear to show the linoleum that way but I can't see it in the pics of Okinawa due to smoke or other. one favor to ask, Chuck would you mind if I e-mail you also about the differences that you have came across? Thanks for you time fellas, Jon
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bucketfoot-al
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Re: Calling all IJN Yamato & Musashi fans

Post by bucketfoot-al »

Hi Jon.

Tough call there. I've seen Japanese reconstructions of the ten-ichi-go configuration go either way. The newest books I have don't have it extending onto the wood deck - BUT - if you closely examine the photo of Yamato dodging a bomb in March 1945, as well as the aerial recon photo taken at 1200 Noon on April 6 1945 (4 hours before she got underway to Okinawa), it appears that they still did.

Faint, but they appear to be there - and note that, as they angled inward just slightly once they crossed onto the wood deck, the light shadows in those photos appear to do the same thing.

The other question is rhetorical - why would they have removed them?

So, although it makes my model just slightly off, I'd have to say that yes, those strips still appear to have extended onto the wood deck in April 1945. With 51% certainty. :cool_2:

Take another look at those two photos and let me know what you think.

Al
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Dan K
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Re: Calling all IJN Yamato & Musashi fans

Post by Dan K »

Chuck, she looks GREAT!. Have you posted a pic before? - don't recall.
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chuck
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Re: Calling all IJN Yamato & Musashi fans

Post by chuck »

Yes. Here are some more pictures. No work has been done on her since last August.
Image

Image

Image

Image
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Re: Calling all IJN Yamato & Musashi fans

Post by Dan K »

Looks like a very clean build, Chuck.
Thomas E. Johnson
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Re: Calling all IJN Yamato & Musashi fans

Post by Thomas E. Johnson »

How accurate is this $5,000+ model of the Yamato?

http://www.modelshipmaster.com/products ... Yamato.htm
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Cliffy B
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Re: Calling all IJN Yamato & Musashi fans

Post by Cliffy B »

Thomas E. Johnson wrote:How accurate is this $5,000+ model of the Yamato?

http://www.modelshipmaster.com/products ... Yamato.htm
I love this part of the description:
Light "rust" appearance that only master modelers can create.
:rolf_3: :rolf_3: :rolf_3:

The Float planes look rather "plump" to me....among other things...
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chuck
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Re: Calling all IJN Yamato & Musashi fans

Post by chuck »

Thomas E. Johnson wrote:How accurate is this $5,000+ model of the Yamato?

http://www.modelshipmaster.com/products ... Yamato.htm
Not particularly accurate.
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cplchanb
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Re: Calling all IJN Yamato & Musashi fans

Post by cplchanb »

lionroar just announced an updated update set for the 1/350 yammy...(see supplier forum) I am soo pissed off rite now cuz im in the meat of construction so many of the updates cant be worked in without cannibalization... D: owell... at least the resin trip 25mm are worth it!
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