Calling all MN Richelieu & Jean Bart fans

[russclark]

that is unreal is there more of this build

[bonmaquettiste]

Hello there!

I was fortunate to find the Polish Okrety Wojwnne numer specjalny 26 book Pancerniki typu "Richelieu" by Maciej S. Sobanski which has beautiful 1/400 scale fold out plans for Richelieu's 1940 rig as well as Jean Bart in 1942, Richelieu in 1943 after her rebuild, and Jean Bart as in 1955.

These drawings are far superior to any drawing that has ever been shown in any of the French publications on the Richelieu or the Jean Bart.

Best regards,

Alain

[Felix C]

Source for Richelieu light AA fit post-WWII?

Lost all of the 20mms? 40mms?

Layout drawings anywhere?

[rtwpsom2]

Have you checked the French Archive website? The link is in here somewhere.

[Felix C]

Yes, Only 1940 is shown.

[Atma]

Well the first two pictures is Richelieu in 1947. I can see that only the forward row of Oerlikons have been removed -in the bow-, while in the next two pictures (dated 1952 and 1954) I see no Oerlikons (even so the tubs on the number 1# turret remains) and only 40mm boffors, the number is unknow.
1947 links:
http://img62.imageshack.us/i/skan054.jpg/
http://img291.imageshack.us/i/skan055.jpg/
1952 and 1954 links:
http://img101.imageshack.us/i/skan056.jpg/
http://img848.imageshack.us/i/skan057.jpg/

[Felix C]

Did the Richelieu retain the 40mms throughout the remaining years after the photo?

[Atma]

After the 1954 Photo ? All I can understand from this picture (see link) is that the 40 mm remained till the end even so the barrels sems to be removed ? Im not sure , sorry.
The pictute (the first in the scan) is from 1965 when she was used as an accommodation ship in Brest-renamed Q432-. The second one is Richelieu during December 1970(30 years after her commissiong), sadly almost gone, too bad Fracne didnt keep none of the Richelieu class battleships as a museum.
Link:http://img850.imageshack.us/i/skan059.jpg/

Awesome ships

[Toje]

I don't no of the drawings are from 1940 of later but on th following German site there are very detial drawings of the Richellieu and the Jean-Bart.

http://3dhistory.de/wordpress/?page_id=986

[EJFoeth]

These come directly from the online and freely accessible French archives, you can find many more there.

[Atma]

Here is some diagrams for possible alternatives for MN Jean Beart during her reconstruction in the USA:

[Toje]

@Atma,

The Jean-Bart has never been reconstructed in the USA. It was suggested that the Jean Bart be sent to the USA and completed there (her sister ship, Richelieu, had already undergone a refitting there), but that proved to be impossible. The notion of converting the Jean Bart into an aircraft carrier was studied, but was found to be impractical. For the next two years, the unfinished battleship remained stranded in Casablanca harbour.

In 1945 the Jean Bart has been lifted and returned to France, where she was completed in 1949, under an updated design influenced by lessons from experience with battleships in the previous war.

[Atma]

Yes sorry, I messed up things. I meant proposed rebuild of MN Jean Bart.

[Atma]

Anyone knows if the IHP Jean Bart's hull in 1/700 is still available ?
Thanks in advance.

[Atma]

Hello everyone, can anyone help me and name me the radars/antennas in ciricle from this close up of Richelieu, plus the possible date?
Red circle: ?
Orange circle: ?
Pink circle: ?
Blue circle: ?
Navy blue circle: ?




Thanks in advance.

[Cliffy B]

The red circle or top foremast radar looks a lot like a USN SG surface search set. Since she's in her post US refit I think its safe to assume its an SG but I'm not sure. No real clue about the rest. Could the blue circled one be an SU in a dome?

[Atma]

The red circle or top foremast radar looks a lot like a USN SG surface search set. Since she's in her post US refit I think its safe to assume its an SG but I'm not sure. No real clue about the rest. Could the blue circled one be an SU in a dome?

Yes I thought the same about the red circle antenna, its propably an USN SG.
About the blue, it looks a lot like the one in the picture of USS Alabama during Junary 1946, the pink cirlce:


What are those by the way ?
Thanks in advance.

[Cliffy B]

I want to say they are SU or SL surface search sets. They were enclosed in a little radome and to the best of my knowledge used on DEs and below. Postwar they were experimenting with radars like crazy with many sets trialed on all ships it seems. On BB-60 I'd say its a surface search set due to how high its mounted (for better range). On Richelieu though I would tend to think not simply since its mounted so low. Since its on the conning tower roof, could it be some sort of fire control set?

Now that I look at it, the orange circle looks like a Royal Navy fire control set that was usually on the HACS (spelling?) or "High Angle" directors. The pink circle looks a lot like the fire control sets found n RN main battery directors on Cruisers and Battleships. I don't know the specific names/marks though. I'm still learning about RN radars.

As for the mainmast radar, since I don't see one anywhere else, would it be safe to assume that it was an air search set of some sort? It looks rather small, so maybe an SC or an SA if its USN? I'm just guessing on that one.

[Atma]

On the USS Alabama there is one also just under the number 3 DP gun. I just made the pink circle a bit too small by accident.
Thats low enough isent it ?
So.. i really dont know what it is, just some kind of radar ;p
Anyway, thanks again for your input

[Cliffy B]

I think you're looking at a hose reel under the 5"/38. I have a book on BB-59 and in every photo of that area, regardless of the year, the only there is a hose reel on the O-1 deck. Not saying BB-60 could of have something unique but I kind of doubt it. Do you have a higher resolution version of the photo?

After looking through the book, could the mainmast radar on Richelieu be a USN SR-a air search set? It's on a bad angle in the photo but it looks like that could be the one.