Laser Print your own decks?

[smorariu]

I would like to improve on the after-market wood decks out there by creating accurate waterways. I think I can print my own using a drafting program. I'm stuck on the printable wood veneer. I received several samples from Mr. Tom Lenderink: http://www.lenderink.com/wood-veneer/micro-thin/ Maple seems to be pretty close.

Does anyone know what kind of wood or where to get the veneer that Pontos Models uses?

BTW - Mr. Kim has not responded to my request to buy from him.

[Jaggy]

On free time they sell

StoreShip Accessories1/350 ScaleWood DecksArtWox1/350 ArtWox Uncut Deck Sheet Wood Deck

For $20, but I think you'd need a laser engraver/cutter, not a printer. That's a $8000 machine.

[wefalck]

When thinking of printing, I wouldn't use wood. Whatever species of wood you use, the grain will be too pronounced for scales smaller than say even 1/100.

I would print on a good quality, but thin, paper. You can create the plank pattern and colour/shade each individual plank. At very small scales I would not print the caulking, as on the prototype it would not be visible.

The pattern then can be cut out with a scalpel. Before that I would varnish the paper with a lacquer that is compatible with the printing ink, i.e. that doesn't dissolve it.

wefalck

[MareNostrum]

wefalck- Very interesting point and technique you bring up here. Could I ask you to be more specific about good quality paper, e.g., do you mean something better than standard 92 or 96 whiteness, 20 lb. printer paper?

[wefalck]

There are several factors that would guide my choice of paper: how thick (or thin) should it be so as not to interfere with the moulded parts of the kit (something 0,1 mm thick would be 35 mm, when scaled up from 1/350, or even 70 mm, when scaled up from 1/700, for instance); how smooth is the surface, while still giving enough saturation of the laser ink; what kind of paper can I use in the laser-printer. There are high-quality glossy and satin photo-papers available for laser-printers, which may be a good choice, provided that they are not too thick. Otherwise, a well-balasted and glued paper (such as is used for high-quality art- or photographic books) would be good. One could also think of tinted papers, that provide a beige background colour. It seems however, that most of them have a rather coarse and open surface texture (such as Canson- and similar papers that are used for pastels etc.).

Once the deck has been printed, I would cover the paper with a layer of wood-filler or matte varnish. Water-based acrylic products could be problematic, as they swell the paper, but on the other hand you need to test, whether solvent based wood-fillers or varnishes do dissolve the laser-printer ink. This procedure stabilises the paper for more precise cutting and any raised fibres can be removed by a very light and cautious sanding.

I haven't made a deck like this myself yet, but I did undertake experiments in this direction for a particular project, albeit using an ink-jet printer.

One concern could be the UV-stability of the inks used. If you have the choice, it may pay to browse the Web on this subject. There was one particular Web-site that dealt with this issue in detail, but I don't have the URL at hand.

wefalck

[MareNostrum]

Thanks for your reply, looks as though there are some interesting paths to follow here, with a little experimentation here, a little experimentation there. I gather a web search under "simulating decks with paper" or some such will turn up something as well.

[wefalck]

Just remembered that Bob Wilson, who is also on this forum, uses laser-printed decks. If I am not mistaken, he uses a scan of some printed old 'plank-paper' that he scales to the appropriate size. He has a modelling blog, but I don't have the URL ready. You can 'google' him. He also produced two nice CDs on his modelling techniques.

Apropos scan, I have also experimented with 'patterns' generated via PhotoShop from photographs I took of real planked decks.

wefalck

[MareNostrum]

Thanks again, this adds to the approaches to simulate decking, especially in the smaller scales.

[Timmy C]

The company ScaleDecks actually did produce a printed pattern on high-quality photographic paper. They looked good, better than the laser-etched wood, but came at an astronomical cost for what it is.

[blacman]

It came to me today..
How about to do it that way:
print just wood colors with tone differentiations on paper
Etch the embosed planking scheme on hard material like stainless steel. Very thin lines....
Lay printed paper on some semi soft surface like rubber ones.
By pressing etched part down on paper we could create nice planking structure..
Then preserve it somehow
And apply on ship.

What you think?

[wefalck]

There is a persistent misconception about decks, fostered by these laser-engraved decks: decks are more or less flush, without such deep furrows for plank-seams as the engraving might suggest. Depending on the humidity and temperature, the caulking might protrude a few milimetres or have sunk in a few milimetres, but that's all. Therefore, a simple printed pattern would be a more realistic portrayel of a deck.

I would tone each plank just a bit (but really only a little bit), to give the deck a more lively appearance.

wefalck

[johnd13]

Hey, all... Great discussion!

Two things:

First, I am discontinuing my Laser-Cut Photographic Paper decks - they don't seem to sell as much as the wood. And, as a result, I have a lot of photographic paper left in stock. I would be glad to print up a bunch of stock, and make it available in 10x16 sheets. Here's a question for you... What would be a fair price for that? I'm open to whatever you guys think, as long as it's worth my time to print it up and package it. Timmy - what do you think is fair? If I can make it work, I'll offer the blank sheets at that price!

Also I totally agree that "tinting individual planks" is the way to go. I'm now starting to move into the plastic models of sailing ships (1/96 USS Constitution, 1/96 Cutty Sark, 1/100 HMS Victory, etc.) I think our printing pattern works very well there, and we are ONLY offering those decks in tinted wood (not teak or maple, at least not at present.) We are able to simulate the oakum in grey (as it should be!) and not have it burned in and be chocolaty-brown. We are also able to do the proper nibbing on this kit, AND we are doing accurate 3-in-1 planking (and accurate 5-in-1 for the Cutty Sark!) This is much more important on the larger scale sailing ships - where there was oakum between the butt cuts, too.

Here's a photo from a build log where the builder is using my deck for the USS Constitution. I think it looks pretty darned good myself - You can read the build log (and see high-resolution photos) here if you are interested... http://cs.finescale.com/fsm/modeling_su ... 55174.aspx

Close-up photo of the nibbing and tinting on a printed deck

Close-up of the bow, showing butt cuts and 3-in-1 pattern (but not between the cutouts, where full planks would have been used!)

[wefalck]

The decks look good ! However this puzzled me:

We are able to simulate the oakum in grey

You shouldn't see any oakum, as it is covered by pitch. If the oakum comes out, this would be bad news for the bo'sun. The pitch, however, after some time and weathering at sea, may look rather dark grey than pitch-black though.

wefalck