Calling all Iowa-class (BB-61) fans

[Channell]

EJFoeth recently posted a pic of a drydock with the blocks ready for an Iowa class :

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=154705

Is it safe to say that's where docking keel plates would be?

[Fliger747]

The Iowa' didn't have docking keels per se as they had flat bottoms. What they did have was locations where the ships structure carried to the bottom. Outboard the structure carried the inclined internal armor and continued to the bottom, Barlow this heavy structure the outboard blocks were placed. Inboard were longitudinal girders which gave the hull much of its rigidity and the inner blocks were placed here. One of my books, I believe it is Friedman, has a crossection of the ship to illustrate the armor, but it clearly shows the supporting structures. Th blocks would be placed at the intersection of a transverse frame and longitudinal girder section so as to carry the weight of the ship through the supporting structural components. Note except forward are blocks are not placed on the centerline. The main structural members aft are the skegs and a major structural line of the ship carry forward from these for bending moment. With such a long ship some flexibility was designed in and movement joints were designed into the superstructure. Hank mentioned being forward and seeing the bow flexing Ina seaway on NJ.

Cheers. T

[BB62vet]

Re. the BB-62 Docking Plan from Fl. Dry. -

I have this plan and I'll have to say its rather a mess - it's pieced together, not a complete plan as laid out by the draftsman and NOT printed to scale - I can't even read the text to see what the scale of the original drawing was. But, it does show the plan of the blocks in their proper layout - so, I guess it does have some value. I may take it and enlarge it so I can at least TRY to read the text on the drawing. I know it was drawn up for BB-62, but presently, I'm not sure of the date or where it may have been used (Phily, Long Beach, Bremerton, who knows??).

Tom - all true - as you & I have discussed, the blocks are probably in the 4'sq.x5'H + 1'x4' on top of the block for creosoted timbers (4/block). I figure this to work out to 1/4"x1/4"x5/16" (1:200 scale) + 1/16"sq.x1/4" for each of 4 timbers above the block. Oh, and my Jim Byrnes Mini Table Saw is just the tool to use - I highly recommend it to anyone building ship models incorporating wood. It is a precise and accurate tool.

I think I will cut pine blocks to scale, finish as "concrete", and top with boxwood timbers stained dark walnut. I purchased a 72"x16" made up board at Lowe's last week which is now screwed to the portable work table since it's orig. work board was too short for this model. I can then layout the keel blocks per the drawing and fine adjust to see what it looks like. That board is a working board and NOT for use as the model's baseboard. This won't happen real soon, but down the road a bit - I'm in the middle of masts/radars, etc. I haven't counted the blocks, but the photo mentioned in an earlier post has more than I can discern from looking at it - they disappear in the distance. Ray Bean's photo could have been the drydock NEW JERSEY entered in '69 in Bremerton, I can't recall.

Back to the Fl. Dry. plan - it does have value, but not $18.00 worth, IMHO.

Hank

[Fliger747]

Will have to look at some of the close up photos of the blocks again but guessing the spacing is 8 ft longitudinally, every other frame, which gives something like 100 rows! Somewhere around 300 blocks.

That works out to maybe 160 tons per block at a typical drydock weight.

A great way to attach the hull to the base might be to get some of the rare earth magnets and screw some of them to the top of a few blocks (inset) and glue matching magnets to the inside of the hull. I attached my secondary mounts this way and it is very effective.

Cheers. Tom

[Fliger747]

Looking at the bean photo certainly not at Bremerton wa PSNS, fuel tanks and road overpass in the background. Pearl Harbor?

T

[Cliffy B]

Not sure if the docking plan(s) cover this or not but you do move the blocks while the ship is docked. You lay them out, dock the ship, clean and paint the hull. Then you move them to clean and paint the areas that were previously inaccessible. Just something to think about.

Hank, I'll echo your sentiments about the plans as well. Some of the copies just aren't good but that's due to the source copy for the most part. The important parts are there but you can't always read everything. Just the chance you take since FD can't post samples or thumbnails. Best ones to get are the TFW series or any of the others that say "re-drawn from official plans". Those are always nice and clear and legible.

[Fliger747]

Moving the blocks must be interesting, have to re float the ship?. Move the ship and not the blocks?

T

[Cliffy B]

Not sure how they do that exactly but I would tend to think that if the blocks are located under structural supports, that you would only move some of them at a time then put them back and move some more.

[Fliger747]

The drydock photo might have been at Terminal Island Naval Shipyard, the drydock no longer being there. Looking at a google earth of PSNS with blocks laid out for a carrier in drydock#1 they measure 4 ft square on the sides and were spaced on a 6 ft spacing.

T

[BB62vet]

It's also possible that the Bean photo was from Philadelphia NSYD. If I have time this week, I'll try to count blocks from the Docking Plan. I've got several pine sticks 1/4"x1/4" sawn. I'll spray with light grey and then begin cutting to length. Boxwood "timbers" will come later. Of course, this is secondary to working on the conning tower modifications.

Tom - I'm not sure that any IOWAs went into the drydock in Pearl - but, my opinion is certainly not fact.

Hank

[Timmy C]

Missouri did in 2009, though certainly not in active service!

[Fliger747]

Indeed BB63was drydocked at Pearl as part of the prep for museum display. The hull was cleaned and painted, though amazingly not with hull red. Some gray paint was used below the waterline. I forgot about Philly when I went looking about at sat data. Philly does have a elevated road in the distance across the basin, but no fuel tanks in the area behind the drydock that is long enough.

Cheers. Tom

[DBlack]

I'm not 100% positive, but I believe that the last Iowa drydocked at Philly was BB-62 in 1967/68. I'm guessing that that RDB photo is LBNSY, or possibly Pearl or Portsmouth...

[BB62vet]

DBlack,

You are correct - NEW JERSEY was the last IOWA drydocked at Phily for her '67 modernization.

Hank

[Haijun watcher]

Gents,

If you had a choice between buying the 1/700 Fujimi Missouri or Tamiya's 1/700 Missouri, which would be the superior model to build in your opinion? (with regard to realism, level of detail for an OOB model without PEs added yet, I mean)

[Timmy C]

Tamiya's, hands down. The Fujimi kit is much older, and inferior in every way.

[Fliger747]

Cliffy

Can you find out what the designation of the boats the Iowa's carried in the Davits were? Might help me find enough info to build them. I have a few photos but no real specs let alone drawings.

Cheers. Tom

[Cliffy B]

Boat plans you say? Have you looked here? Just watch the designations as there are boats from the 1930's through modern times in there.
http://www.hnsa.org/doc/boatcat/index.htm

In the davits, I believe we had 1 40' Utility Boat (motor launch), 1 Captain's Gig, and 26' MWBs stowed above them. Currently we have the the "U-boat" (port) and Gig (starboard) in the deck chocks. The Gig I believe is the larger 33' "Personnel Boat" and not the smaller 26' Personnel Boat (Captain's Gig) that all of the DDs and CGs carried. I'll have to check but I'd bet its the larger as our two stowed boats are ours and not 2nd hand.

We have one original MWB that we keep in the water and use it to take tours around the harbor and the ship. We recently picked up FFG-7's MWB from some storage warehouse in Norfolk and are going to restore it and place it aboard or use it for more tours; not sure yet.

I know the BBs carried more boats in cradles on deck that were moved around the fantail for flight ops and shooting. BB-62's plans from 1984 call for the following boats:

3 40' Utility Boats Mk 3 (75 men each)
2 33' Personnel Boats Mk 2 (24 men each)
2 26' MWBs Mk 10 (20 men each)
81 Inflatable Lifeboats Mk 6 (25 men each)

Plans here: http://www.hnsa.org/doc/plans/bb62.pdf

Hope that helps. If you want shots of our boats let me know.

[Fliger747]

Cliffy!

Thanks as always, you are a great resource and fount of information.

Regards. Tom

[HelpaNoob]

Hi guys, I am recently interested in building model kits of battleships, so my knowledge is somewhat limited.
Can anyone tell me if the Iowas still carry the M2 Browning machine guns? I saw them being used in that Battleship movie and they are present in some photos of the Mighty Mo, but most kits do not have them. If they do have them, I would like to know how much they carry, and the placements of each gun.
I am also curious of the crane-like thing at the starboard aft of the ships. It sometimes has thick black cables hanging and sometimes it doesn't have anything under it at all. I assume that it is a fuel line or some sort? Is it usually left hanging like that when the ship is on a mission?

I'm sorry if it seems like too much asking, it would really help me on building a model kit of the New Jersey.