Calling all Iowa-class (BB-61) fans

[CPL_Wiggles]

The attachment 01 level fwd port side.jpg is no longer available

01 Level, port side fwd.

Following up on my previous question on Page 138 - I needed to read EVERY page of the forum, page 74 specifically. They must be vents of some sort. Thanks again. Thanks Flinger 747

[Harquebus]

I ran across an unusual conversion article/build thread turning the 1/350 Tamiya WWII Missouri into a 1956 New Jersey. This is of interest as it avoids becoming another member of the ubiquitous glut of WWII Iowas since it focuses on the inter-war period and also concerns the modification of the uppermost of the port and starboard triple quad Bofors mounts into a Mk 56 director platform with bulkheads:

http://www.britmodeller.com/forums/inde ... rsey-1956/

I'm doing a 1947 (best I can tell) Big J which at that time also sported the platform and bulkheads--The genesis of that feature occurred during her 1945 refit at Puget Sound Navy Yard.

[BB62vet]

Harq,

Interesting build that you posted - My original BB62 conversion was from a 1:350 Life Like MISSOUI kit in 1972 and later a 2nd kit that I had found in Maryland in 1996 - but I sold that one in 2011/12 after beginning the 1:200 scale build I'm working on now. I never got as far as the modeler did in your attachment; there simply was no PE or 3rd party parts available back then and I lost interest in the 1:350 scale.

Your comment re. the center admidships 40mm tub and it's genesis into a single Mk. 56 FC director platform did indeed begin with NJ's 1945 refit in Puget Sound. With Model Monkey's Mk. 56 available now, that part of the refit should be quite easy. I've got those in place on my 1:200 scale build.

Good luck with your 1947 version - not much photography available from that time period.

Hank

[Harquebus]

For most of our models in these larger scales, I have yet to see an out-of-the-box model of an Iowa with hull plating details--they are all smooth as a baby's bottom. I always wondered if the Iowas had a discernible keel too. Now looking at a hull frame cross section from the Booklet of General Plans (BB63), we can see a 'flat keel' that runs down the centerline of the hull and I know from experience that this keel must terminate at the small skeg 'nub' that lies between the two inboard propeller skegs. I also note that the plans show alternating overlapping and underlapping 'strakes' that run down the hull parallel with the waterline. See attached illustration:

Has anyone tried to replicate these with thin sheet styrene? Pros, cons, opinions?

[BB62vet]

Harq -

You are correct in noting that most (if not all) kit hulls are devoid of any plate detail. At least (and this is with tongue in cheek!) Trumpy's 1:200 IOWA/MO hulls have minor indentations for where various PE parts should be placed. This, of course, notwithstanding the obvious distortion/incorrect shaping of the hull itself.

Your further comment about the IOWA hull being devoid of a visible centerline keel is also correct. The side bilge keels are the only external protrusions from the hull, as such.

I haven't seen any IOWA models in this scale (1:200 or 1:192) that have depicted the rows of bottom plating as you describe and show in your attached frame section illustration. I can't recall off hand if Flinger747 has detailed his 1:192 MISSOURI hull in this way or not. I am planning on showing the side plate lines (horizontal) on my build, but haven't decided on the method by which I'll do this. I would think that cutting out very thin strips of styrene would accomplish the job on the bottom of the hull. I'm not sure how to accomplish this on the rounded stern and after quarters of the hull as it rises upwards to the main deck.

Indeed, an interesting question!

Hank

[marengtech]

BB62vet:
My current project, Tamiya 350th Yamato (the newest release), has that detail and would be a good starting point for adding this detail to the hull. I could take a few pics and post them on here if you like. Also, if I remember correctly, there were some pics of the Mighty Mo in PONTO's thread for the detail sets with the plate detail added.

[BB62vet]

Gerry,

An interesting comment/reply - it doesn't surprise me that the YAMATO hulls have more detail than the IOWAs do. I believe the reference you were making to Pontos hull plating was the MISSOURI model completed by Kim in the Gallery - his model (once again - my opinion here) overstated the hull plating, esp. the vertical plate lines. Unless you are within 5-10 feet of the ship, you won't see this on the real ship, why would you depict it on a model? I can see lightly scribing the vertical lines representing individual plates, but not as his model shows. It's (once again - my opinion) simply overkill. The horizontal lines, however, are a different story - they actually are visible from a moderate distance as they are NOT in the same plane as the row of plates either above or below. As such, they are visible and worth showing on the model. With all the other detail that the model company has put into these kits, I'm quite surprised their hulls are as nondescript as they are.

Adding the vertical butt plates (these are available as a 3rd party add-on) also improves the overall hull appearance. I can see that once you get into the smaller models (scales less than 1/350) it becomes harder to properly show or mold these types of detail. But, for those of us working on the larger models, I think the manufacturers could do a lot better in this respect.

Any pictures of your YAMATO would be nice to see.

Hank

[Fliger747]

A building paint such as a high build auto body primer can be used, with masking, to make the plate lines. There was a guy with a 1:350 Indiana did plate lines (I think it was the floating drydock project) using strips of foil tape. Not getting wrinkles on the compound curves is an issue. I read, but have not tried, using paper tape, when when wet can be worked around the compound curves. The 1:72 ? Missouri by John Haynes on board Missouri does have the plating modeled. Where or if he had data to use is not known.

Tom

[ModelMonkey]

A building paint such as a high build auto body primer can be used, with masking, to make the plate lines.

I used this technique on a yet-to-be-completed, scratch-built 1/350 USS Saratoga CV-3 to good effect. The trick is using a good primer (Krylon) and good tape (Tamiya).

[BB62vet]

Steve,

Very interesting - it wasn't until I actually zoomed the picture larger to see the lines. OK, so now - how did you accomplish this? I.E. the steps you used and the paints/primers, etc. to get the look.

This just might be the way to go on my NJ.

Hank

[Harquebus]

Your further comment about the IOWA hull being devoid of a visible centerline keel is also correct. The side bilge keels are the only external protrusions from the hull, as such.

I guess I wasn't clear but I was trying to say that along with plating detail (in the plans and on the actual ships), the plans show a keel that seems to protrude, ever so slightly, from the bottom of the hull. I don't know if it exists in reality but I was assuming that it does since it's in the plans.

As far as the 'painted on' plating lines go, I think I can give a simple answer: Tamiya masking tape in an appropriate width, let's say 6mm, applied to areas of the hull where the plates underlap which according to the plans is pretty much every other plate section, and then an application of the aforementioned build-up or gap-filling primer and voil�!

The unmasked areas will be replete with raised plate/panel detail...

[ModelMonkey]

I guess I wasn't clear but I was trying to say that along with plating detail (in the plans and on the actual ships), the plans show a keel that seems to protrude, ever so slightly, from the bottom of the hull. I don't know if it exists in reality but I was assuming that it does since it's in the plans.

As far as the 'painted on' plating lines go, I think I can give a simple answer: Tamiya masking tape in an appropriate width, let's say 6mm, applied to areas of the hull where the plates underlap which according to the plans is pretty much every other plate section, and then an application of the aforementioned build-up or gap-filling primer and voil�!

The unmasked areas will be replete with raised plate/panel detail...

Yes, that's a good description. When spraying the primer, try not to let the thickness of the primer exceed the thickness of the tape. And, it is best to remove the tape while the paint is still a bit wet. Once the paint hardens, there is risk that when the tape is lifted, the tape will lift adjacent paint with it from the raised strake areas ruining the effect.

Paul Budzik uses an even better technique. It requires more effort but the effect is very, very convincing. Here is a link to his technique on YouTube:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XVULb3sOd2w

[BB62vet]

Harq, Steve -

Thanks for the excellent info on hull plating. The video clip was really good; I've bookmarked it for future reference. This will certainly come into play once I've got the basic hull ready for detailing.

Re. the IOWA class hull - As for any centerline EXTERNAL keel, I haven't been able to discern any from the plans except for the extension of the short keel block "keel" that's already been discussed. This is not shown on all plans available but is on others (Booklet of Gen. Plans does not show this stub).

Hank

[Fliger747]

Cross sections of the hull and Drydock photos do not show any external central keel, just overlapping plates.

[Fliger747]

The exception to the keel scenario is a short keel below turret three that is in the fwdortion of the tunnel between the skegs. Mostly I believe to help carry the weath of this turret, especially when drydocked.

T

[Harquebus]

The exception to the keel scenario is a short keel below turret three that is in the fwd portion of the tunnel between the skegs. Mostly I believe to help carry the weath of this turret, especially when drydocked.

T

Right. I have seen that feature in photos before (can't recall where) and the experience was sort of jaw-dropping. Thank you, gentlemen.

[kfgodsey]

I need a little help with a 16 inch gun turret 3d model (USS Iowa turret 1) that I am building. Maybe I have been looking in the wrong places on the web but I have been unable to find some info on the turret gun house. I need help with...

1. How wide is the front turret armor plate? I know it is 17 inches thick but how wide and how high?
2. How far is the widest part of the turret (35.95 feet) back from the bottom of the front plate?
3. How thick is the shelf plate (the bottom of the turret)?
4. How high is the back of the turret (the shelf plate slants up slightly about 8 feet from the back of the turret)?
5. And how far from the back of the turret does the slant start (looks like about 8 feet)?
6. How high, thick, and long are the 16 inch deck lugs?
7. What are the dimensions of the counter recoil tubes on the yoke?

Lots more later but these will get me started.

Many thanks to anyone who can help me.

Keith

[Fliger747]

Check the HNSA turret catalog, many of the WWII turrets are diagramed with dimensions.

T

[kfgodsey]

Thanks for you kind help. I have already been to that site and got every thing useful. No luck with the questions I was asking in my previous post. Any other ideas?

Thanks again.

Keith

[James M]

You might want to try Googling: 3D modeling Iowa class battleship
There have been a lot of these already rendered.

http://www.stlfinder.com/?search=uss-ne ... eship-wwii
http://www.3dcadbrowser.com/download.aspx?3dmodel=2173
http://www.turbosquid.com/3d-models/iow ... obj/632557
http://www.cadnav.com/3d-models/model-10998.html

James