To HMS Victory and beyond

[Jabberwock]

Too slow. Much too slow!!!

Patent applied for!

Cheers, Jabb.

(apply here for licence )

[kurusu]

You Sir, have amazed and delighted me for quite some time with your marvelous work.
But I think your magnificent approach to the sails issue tops it all (get the pun? ).

[ModelMonkey]

Fantastic!

What kind of paper did you find from the restoration department for the sails?

It looks wonderful.

[Bill Code]

I have had some luck using Silk span with diluted glue to get the effect you have there... Looks really good..

[LE BOSCO]

HI Dan

your work is always inspiring ....just sublim
cheers
Nicolas

[dafi]

To put the rule to the test, or - in other words - the big rag, part 1.

To get the overlap right this time I constructed a small light table: 2 logs, some glas and a lamp.



Above light from underneath, below light from the top.



To get things straight I printed the pattern onto a paper and glued it face down onto the glas with a minimum spray glue.
As I also sprayed the back of the paper, the silk is nicely fixed and does not move while working. Do not face the print towards the
silk, or the heat will transfer the laser toner onto the tissue - unless it is wanted

[dafi]

The silk I used for the gaff was pong�e 8 as this sail was a more heavy cloth.

Made a small cutting machine for the panels, ...



... and started bravely ironing. First side went rather fast, then flipped over, adjusted to the grid and restarted and went immediately tilted ...



... but was no problem to scratch that off

Here the result in changing ambient light conditions, just what I wanted to see, every time it looks different









The overlap is still to broad, that was a mistake of mine. To make the overlap more visible, I still added a 1 mm stripe atop, see the spaghetti in the back of the picture. It was surprisingly easy to do and exact in the outcome.



Then the slightly curved reef bands and the other doublings ...



... and step one was done.

The size of the sail can be seen as soon as my little ship yard worker is added.





And just for fun: The original out of the box



So next steps will be great fun: Adding the bolt ropes and the glue-paint mixture and waiting if everything stays as crisp as it is now!

XXXDAn

[Bill Code]

The sail looks really nice ! I am not happy with how my silkspan sail worked out... The sails are just too large in this scale for silkspan to do the job.. I have some fine thread count cloth I will try next.. I will try gluing strips like you have used and see how it goes... Sails are a bit of a beach ! LOL

[JIM BAUMANN]

Hi there Victory Builders!

my opinipo for what is worth -as an ex-sailmaker own business-now canvas producrts business...

Beware! of making the sails look too ' 3-D '
I also currently have a vested interest in making small sails (as you both know with my little Mary Rose-!)

- albeit mine is 4 x smaller

so I have been studying other modellers o the net , McNarry, Reid et al


have a look at the link below

- good feel and colour I think

link

http://www.shipmodel.com/models/diana-h ... rline-exm-

( alas images are too large to post @ 2100 px wide)

http://www.shipmodel.com/files/diana-hm ... ana008.jpg

edit: Jim Baumann

I have downloaded and cropped the image to the relevant area

as below

[Bill Code]

lovely looking Sails Jim.... Really sweet looking Frigate.. I wish he shared how he made them... I am a little surprised he did not add a crew for her... Probably what the client wanted.

[JIM BAUMANN]

I am sure he tells you how in his book !

Period Ship Modelmaking

here is a cheap( ish ) copy in the US
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Period-Ship-M ... Swk1JWefm8

probably worth a look !!

he also has an e-book version of the same for considerably less

http://www.pen-and-sword.co.uk/Period-S ... dle/p/8082

hope it helps

JIM B

[dafi]

Thank you Jim for this great input, very appreciated. I think every scale needs its own technic, as the challenges change. For scale 1:48 thin cloth can work out fine, from smaller than 1:150 paper gets a wonderful choice. My scale of 1:100 is somewhere in-between: The cloth is too coarse or too transparent, on the other hand the sails are too big for paper, also I would like to add some details, that would be difficult in paper alone.

In real life I did not have to much time to tinker around due to job and privet commitments, but some small experimenting I could afford.

I prepared a small extract of a stay sail, using my laminate technic. I reinforced the leeches by 0,3 mm copper wire



The material is that thin, one can see the copper shining through.

Took a wet cotton stick and resoftened the sail partially to slowly form a soft wave.



The anvil were the handles of a scissors and the hammer was the hot iron.



And here the fascinating thing, how the appearance changes with the different moods of light ...







... as originally intended

OK, one could guess what comes next ?!? Almost.

Another reason for testing to see the limits of the material. And what should I say?!?

If one uses hard and pointed tools to make smaller crisps into the material and one slips, the material breaks!



But also one can see the benevolence of the material ...



... cleaned and a new leech glued on - this time no copper inside - and it looks like new!

And to prove that this invention is really mine, I left a good part of genetic material in the superglue to provide enough DNA-Tests for the future



Then formed the hanks for the stay ...



... and tried to fix them, still without leech rope, but still it was quite stable.



First trials on the right were not so really shipshape, useful was the third hand of table, clamp and clamping tweezers.



And slowly ...



... I was happy. Even though the fixture of the hanks is on the really outer edge, it proves to be very stable.



So tried the technic on my small sample and heaved it up.



Even though it looks soft, it is quite rigid and keeps well the form due to the white glue used to stiffen it up.

Then resoftened with a wet cotton stick partially to get the wave stronger (remember - went bad already once ...)



But this time it worked out fine



So slept over night - or perhaps not that good as one of the 17 beers that night must have been bad ...

... felt a bit crunched and wrinkled and had the feeling, the sail should exactly represent that.





... fits ...

...

XXXDAn

[JIM BAUMANN]

Most excellent !!!

, both the results achieved and the sheer tenacity you display in getting the results that YOU want!

Bravo-- durchalten!

JIM B

[dafi]

Thank you Jim,

Schmidt, a german forum-mate already used this new technic on his Statenjacht - The effects are amazing and exactly what I had hoped for!

http://www.wettringer-modellbauforum.de ... post786384



http://www.wettringer-modellbauforum.de ... post784090



http://www.wettringer-modellbauforum.de ... post784326




And finally visiting the battle damaged Prince
(Prince still wearing a "normal" paper sail)
http://www.wettringer-modellbauforum.de ... post786131





This is exactly what I had dreamed of: Slag sails that have their own fascination in every different light.

Cheers, Daniel

[marijn van gils]

Brilliant Daniel!!!

I'm following with great interest!

Cheers,

Marijn

[LE BOSCO]

HI magic Dan

as Marijin, always a great interest to following your thread
cheers
Nicolas

[j.mahieux]

Hello Dan,
Fantastic works
Jean

[dafi]

Born out of a brain fart while joking around in the german forum, a crazy idea became reality and within 12 hours more than 12 people already wanted to take part in it.

Soon later we had 20 pirates from all over Germany plus some admiralties in tow that went to the Ijsselmeer, or better to say the Markermeer in the Netherlands.

In a well mannered attack were successfully boarding the beautiful Staatenjacht Utrecht and we found ourselves in the mids of our wildest pirate dreams.





And so the scum of several german forums gathered underneath the blood-red-yellow-lioned flag.



Foolhardy pirates ...





... applecakesmutjes ...



... in short, the whole landlubbery motley crew was overwhelmed ...



... as the cake was marvelous and more important than the captains speech: "If we sink, do not panic, the water is only approx. 2 meters deep, so be prepared to only get wet feet."



But one could see his thoughts: "Oh my god, what have I done to deserve this?!?"



Finally on the endless sees of this lake: Putting up sails, everybody had to help ...





... what a delight for a pirate�s soul ...


... then the staysail ...







... and to put up the jib one had even to climb outboard defying deaths and horrors.



Look at these professionals at work.



The master gave the directions how to coil the ropes ...



... but as usual it ended up in some kind of private bondage lessons.



The leeboards had to be put down and up depending on the tack ...



... even the the tiller we were allowed to touch and steer ...



... and - big management mistake - even me they dared to try to cope with steering, so of course the company went a bit off course ...



... but just look, isn�t my silver medal glowing beautifully under this tropical sun ?!?

XXXDAn

[DeaD_Peter]

Super job on the "Diana" Jim, one little boo-boo on the transom but thats ok, awesome water.

This HMS Victory has been a huge project, been watching it for a very long time, and your doing such a good resto on it I keep
forgetting it's not wood. So when your done, I challenge you to get a 1/78 HMS Victory from Caldercraft and build one out of many
different kinds of wood, and try a real wooden ship model. I don't think you will have any problems at all with a ship like that, and
in fact I think you will rather enjoy it, at least I hope you try one. With your skills, it will be a piece of cake.

[Bill Code]

Any idea if the Gaff sail was attached to the mizzen mast or just to the upper and lower boom on Victory ?? I am about to bend this first sail to my Victory.. Also would the flag staff pole been struck and placed on the boat skid as to not interfere with the operation of the Gaff sail and booms ?? Seems to me it would of been struck to the skids.. Any help Appreciated gentlemen...